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Of all the long lived beings and entities in the 40k-verse, which in your opinion has the greatest chance of emerging as the most successful? Not necessarily the sole survivor of them all, but the most likely to achieve lasting dominance?

Is it:

A: The c'tan. Over however long it takes, perhaps the shards manage to gradually rejoin themselves, be it by chance, engineering or carelessness on the part of their captors. Perhaps some trancendent shards become aware enough of their past to truly become what they once were, maybe a few manage to emerge and topple their former masters in vengeance. From here they could do pretty much anything, imposing their rule upon the younger races of the galaxy and reigniting the War with the Warp fed deities and worshipers just like the days of old where time was to their advantage.

B: The necrons. Through whatever you may call it, conquest or conviction, perhaps a visionary necron lord such as Anrakyr, Imotekh or Szarekh manages to pull the divided necron empire back together in time to reclaim the galaxy from the threats within and without. The tyranids are driven back and/or defeated, the influence of Chaos brought back under control and the younger races either stamped out or brought into compliance, serving whatever useful end their masters may dictate. The hold on the c'tan is maintained and with stability achieved greater measures are developed to keep them contained.

C: The Tyranids. With too little too late amassed to stop them, the constant influx of tyranid Hive Fleets proves too much for the denizens of the galaxy to handle and their feeding frenzy drives all other life in the galaxy to extinction. The turbulence in the warp from so much resounding death may slow them for a time, but in the end they are stronger and more numerous for having fed on such powerful genetic samples, spelling even swifter doom for whichever galaxy falls under their ever hungry gaze next.

D: Chaos. With ever greater numbers of mortals succumbing to their divine influence and their power reaching near unstoppable levels, the very moment of the Emperor's death spells not only doom for the Imperium, but for every other being in the galaxy as Humanity falls completely under the sway of the Dark Gods. Powered by the four winds, an army of unstoppable fanatics and slaves marches forth, feeding the Eye of Terror's growth until the entire galaxy is naught but the gods' playground.

E: The Mortal Races. While no single regime will endure forever, the deaths of those now feeds the courage of those in the future, inspiring the next generations to continue the fight. One by one the enemies of all living things are brought crashing down, the tyranids eradicated, the c'tan and their masters brought to heel and the influence of Chaos stemmed and bled dry by enlightenment and understanding. Though the Imperium may not have survived, and the tau and eldar races lie bloodied or broken, Life itself continues to endure, refusing to submit to even the darkest forces the universe can bring to bear.



Stirring speeches aside, which of those do you perceive to be the most realistic outcome of the current setting?
 

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Tyranids eat man , elder , orks and Tau ( and anything else that's eatable )
Chaos dies ( nothing to sustain them )

Necrons sit and wait till the tyranids either starve ( or turn on themselves to sustain higher hive creatures ) or bugger off .

Necrons are now the rulers till the destroyers get bored and decide to anhialate the last living remanants ( ie , the other Necrons ) .

:) :)

simplistic I know , If you follow the fluff though the silent king came back from his self imposed exile once he realised the threat of the Tyranids .
If they ate all life then the Necrons would not be able to return to biological beings ( so he started to awaken tomb worlds ) . So in all liklyness theyd probably fight and ally against the Tyranids . That's not to say some dynasties would abstain as all don't want to return to what they once were .
I also like the idea that at some point the C,Tan regain there former self,s , either through
Necron memory engrams breaking down ( and not remembering whats captured in the teserct labrynths or why they did it ) OR they do manage apotheosis ( I think that's what they call becoming mortal again ) and as with mortals , time turns fact to myth and curiosity eventually kills the cat :)
 

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Tyranids eat man , elder , orks and Tau ( and anything else that's eatable )
Chaos dies ( nothing to sustain them )

Necrons sit and wait till the tyranids either starve ( or turn on themselves to sustain higher hive creatures ) or bugger off .

Necrons are now the rulers till the destroyers get bored and decide to anhialate the last living remanants ( ie , the other Necrons ) .
:)
This is actually a really good analysis. The Tyranids in particular should be fundamentally unstoppable. The hive fleets are so large they are visible as interstellar structures. It's difficult to really grasp that scale. The hive fleets could eat every single occupied planet in the galaxy and probably 0.00000001% of them would even realize they encountered resistance. Of course, plot armor prevents this, but ....

The necrons of course don't give a crap about living on worlds that have been stripped of life (heck, their pylons do this) so inheriting Tyranid discards would be just fine for them. Although I'm sure they'd be retroactively pissed that there was so much life they missed having a chance to kill. But they're used to being safely buried for billions of years, so whatevs.
 

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The necrons of course don't give a crap about living on worlds that have been stripped of life (heck, their pylons do this) so inheriting Tyranid discards would be just fine for them. Although I'm sure they'd be retroactively pissed that there was so much life they missed having a chance to kill. But they're used to being safely buried for billions of years, so whatevs.
Actually, the Necrons are already opposing the Tyranids. Szarekh, who used to be the Silent King in charge of the entire Necrontyr species, views the Tyranids as the greatest threat there is to the dream of his people regaining biological bodies (and thus their souls), so he is marshalling tombworlds against the Great Devourer. The whole "all necrons want to eradicate all life" thing has been tossed out the window by Games Workshop.
 

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Actually, the Necrons are already opposing the Tyranids. Szarekh, who used to be the Silent King in charge of the entire Necrontyr species, views the Tyranids as the greatest threat there is to the dream of his people regaining biological bodies (and thus their souls), so he is marshalling tombworlds against the Great Devourer. The whole "all necrons want to eradicate all life" thing has been tossed out the window by Games Workshop.

Indeed , ( as mentioned in my original post ) though without the command protocols the silent king has no control over his former empire and I doubt all the dynasties will heed the call to fight ( indeed he himself is probably a target of some vengefull lords as not all went to transference willingly ) .

Even with the Necrons , I doubt ( unless GW change the fluff ) that the hive fleets could be stopped .
Just leaving those that don't support the silent king to sit back a wait ( theyre good at that :) ) till theyre last ...... robot standing ;)
 

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On a serious side Tyranids then Necrons nuke them.

Nids devoured flesh and all sorts and their size is beyond gargantuan. The imperium sure as hell don't have something to stop a single hive fleet short of bodies which aren't entirely infinite. And at best throwing men and arms is really out of desperation not tactics and method. Orks can't exist without planets to grow them so that's out.

You could are that Chaos as an entity would still be around but the 4 gods don't give the much of a damn right now.

Though really Tyranids won't consume Cron as far as I'm aware so then the Crons just need to exterminate the 'Nids once they have consumed all the biomass and starts to die of/unable to grow.

That's always been my understanding of the Universe at least.


Even if both Eldar did hide in the webway they would die out sooner or later.
 

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Tyranids eat man , elder , orks and Tau ( and anything else that's eatable )
Chaos dies ( nothing to sustain them )

Necrons sit and wait till the tyranids either starve ( or turn on themselves to sustain higher hive creatures ) or bugger off .

Necrons are now the rulers till the destroyers get bored and decide to anhialate the last living remanants ( ie , the other Necrons ) .

:) :)

simplistic I know , If you follow the fluff though the silent king came back from his self imposed exile once he realised the threat of the Tyranids .
The problem with simplistic solutions is that all the greatest threats in the galaxy are occurring simultaneously. So for example, whilst the Tyranids are encroaching from the galactic void, Chaos is also breaking through the Cadian Gate and enacting the Crimson Path, whilst the Silent King is strenuously reawakening Tomb Worlds etc.

In the relative short-term the most likely outcome is the 13th Black Crusade (thanks to the Crimson Path) rumbles on towards Terra, just as the Astronomican continues to attract the Tyranids swarms. The primary purpose of the Silent King and his awakening Necrons seems to be to combat the Tyranids, whilst any and all Greenskin empires will continue to be attracted to the most vicious wars. Thus a four-way scrap (with involvement from any Imperial remnants and any interested Eldar factions) over the carcass of the Imperium seems the most likely result in the short-medium term, which would then usher in the next age of the galaxy.
 

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The galaxy was nearly annihilated before and when the Necrons woke up the Chaos Gods were still here. They are immortal and eternal in the truest sense of those words. They exist beyond the bounds of time itself, they have always existed and always will, regardless of what the material realm is doing.
 

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Will the four Gods continue to exist in their current state if all mortal (not Tyranid) life is extinguished from the galaxy?
 

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Discussion Starter #12
The galaxy was nearly annihilated before and when the Necrons woke up the Chaos Gods were still here. They are immortal and eternal in the truest sense of those words. They exist beyond the bounds of time itself, they have always existed and always will, regardless of what the material realm is doing.
Granted, but if their pawns lose the battle for the Materium all of their immortality and such doesn't really mean much.
 

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Granted, but if their pawns lose the battle for the Materium all of their immortality and such doesn't really mean much.
Well it kinda does. I mean the topic is the Long Game and since the Chaos Gods can't loose they must eventually win, right? The Gods can't ever die, everything else in the contest can and probably will so all they have to do is wait.
 

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Well it kinda does. I mean the topic is the Long Game and since the Chaos Gods can't loose they must eventually win, right? The Gods can't ever die, everything else in the contest can and probably will so all they have to do is wait.
Why can't the chaos gods die? We've had examples of actual gods biting the dust (like most of the Eldar ones).
 

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Why can't the chaos gods die? We've had examples of actual gods biting the dust (like most of the Eldar ones).
Time doesn't exist in the warp. By definition the Chaos Gods have always existed and always will. They are the warp and the warp is them. The Eldar Gods are different in that they were created intentionally (or at the very least, they seem to have been) and might have corporeal forms but even they they aren't necessarily dead they've just been consumed by Slaanesh (the fatality of that basically depending on your views of the Eldar gods).
 

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Time doesn't exist in the warp. By definition the Chaos Gods have always existed and always will. They are the warp and the warp is them. The Eldar Gods are different in that they were created intentionally (or at the very least, they seem to have been) and might have corporeal forms but even they they aren't necessarily dead they've just been consumed by Slaanesh (the fatality of that basically depending on your views of the Eldar gods).
I'm having trouble with the whole "Time doesn't exist in the warp" argument, in general and not just as you're using it in this discussion, as it's established as canon that the first Chaos God to emerge was Khorne, which didn't happen until sometime in early recorded human history. That means no Chaos Gods interfered during the entire War in Heaven, after the Necron's wiped most sentient life from the galaxy, or even during most of the Eldar Empire... although with the most recent fluff it's no longer clear to me of the order of those three events. I'm sure some other nasty form of the Primordial Anniahlator was at play considering it's reputation for billions of years prior to Khorne. Perhaps it's the creation of the Eye that gave Chaos such a preeminent role in the Milky Way where before they struggled to find material sponsors?

On another note, I wonder if the Tyranids can reemerge on a planet once they've cleansed it of all life? I think the Nids could easily win in the latest round by wiping life from the Milky Way, but sentient life has a way of hiding in the nooks and crannies of asteroids, Craftworlds, starship hives, etc. In that case, I think some current species would emerge from the Nid cleansing and repopulate the galaxy, although it wouldn't be one of the current players as they're known.

If the Nid's biological residue rises again after a planet they cleansed was repopulated millennia after they first ate it out of house and home. In that case, then the Nids will own the Milky Way in the Long Game IMO.
 

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I'm having trouble with the whole "Time doesn't exist in the warp" argument, in general and not just as you're using it in this discussion, as it's established as canon that the first Chaos God to emerge was Khorne, which didn't happen until sometime in early recorded human history.
The problem with this argument is that it assumes that the warp follows some kind of externally accessible logic, which it doesn't. For example: we know exactly when Slaanesh was born, shortly before the GC was launched. We know this because the birth of Slaanesh is the Fall of the Eldar. But we also know that Slaanesh existed prior to this point. She Who Thirsts is well-established in Eldar lore before the Fall and it is explicitly mentioned that she fueled her own birth. Slaanesh is her own father. That shit don't make sense but it happened. I agree with you that it doesn't make sense for time not to exist in the warp, but it doesn't. The warp doesn't make any sense. That's just about the only thing about it that's consistent.

If the Nid's biological residue rises again after a planet they cleansed was repopulated millennia after they first ate it out of house and home. In that case, then the Nids will own the Milky Way in the Long Game IMO.
There's no indication that the Nids operate in this fashion. To me it doesn't seem likely that they would because they aim to leave nothing organic behind. That includes there own organisms and would logically include there own eggs/whatever. It would be wasteful after-all to leave combat organisms in a non-combat zone. Plus, they'd starve to death rather quickly.
 

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Well it kinda does. I mean the topic is the Long Game and since the Chaos Gods can't loose they must eventually win, right? The Gods can't ever die, everything else in the contest can and probably will so all they have to do is wait.
No, this isn't the case at all. The c'tan can't die either remember? Yet both sides aim to enslave and feed upon all life. The question was who wins the lasting victory in the Materium. Immortal or not, the influence of both these classes of gods can be contained one way or another, so neither is necessarily guaranteed victory.
 

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The c'tan can't die either remember?
Didn't one get killed when they were sharding the others?

The question was who wins the lasting victory in the Materium. Immortal or not, the influence of both these classes of gods can be contained one way or another, so neither is necessarily guaranteed victory.
Well, if it's about material victory then Chaos shouldn't really be considered. A) Because the Chaos Gods themselves aren't really a player in the material realm, and have shown themselves to be largely uninterested in it. B) Because the Chaos Gods aren't in a mutually exclusive situation with everyone else: they can 'win' even if another faction wins complete control of the material realm. C) Because the Chaos Gods can't loose. Without a definitive loss state it's hard to say what a definitive win looks like.
 

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Didn't one get killed when they were sharding the others?



Well, if it's about material victory then Chaos shouldn't really be considered. A) Because the Chaos Gods themselves aren't really a player in the material realm, and have shown themselves to be largely uninterested in it. B) Because the Chaos Gods aren't in a mutually exclusive situation with everyone else: they can 'win' even if another faction wins complete control of the material realm. C) Because the Chaos Gods can't loose. Without a definitive loss state it's hard to say what a definitive win looks like.
One c'tan, yes. A fluke that has not been repeated since and had a devastating consequence.

To your second point, I originally referred to Chaos in general, meaning daemons and followers as well. The c'tan I referred to separate to the necrpns because they are no longer technically on the same side by choice.
 
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