[Tim/Steve]

Ogres got some bonusses with the new rules, which is plainly obvious. What isnt so obvious is that the core rules that ogres relied upon disappeared, and as such they stayed about the same. They get lots of bonus attacks, but have just about the lowest I in the game and their magic is essentially useless now. I think they'll stay what they've always been- able to kick the ass of some army builds, but certain armies will just smash them.
I dont really understand people saying that waywatchers got nerfed... sure they have to be a bit more formal about their formation but the march and shoot, and easier set up rules should help them... the rest of the WE however arent quite so lucky.


I recon the most powerful armies in 8th will be HE and SKaven... with probably the Skaven as the best. Units of slaves are basically unbreakable if they are anywhere near the general (and especially if they have BSB close by) and their magic and toxins are very useful. Big blocks of slaves are cheap and will last a long time.. and Skaven shooting can still target the enemy while the slaves keep them locked. HEs are very very useful now with their ASF (especially with the re-rolls to hit). The boost to magic has helped them too, especially when the HE have lots of protection from miscasts (not to mention Teclis) and the cheap powerhouses that are Caradryan and Korhil.

 

[Tim/Steve]

Well, saince you have said no hoard, no elf, no chaos and it must be a strong army I rather think you have completely run out of options. The only 2 I think that are left are dwarves and lizzies... the dwarven war machine of doom army will be a very tough nut to crack in 8th, but I dont really see the power of lizzies beyond then having just about the best ranked units throughout their army (sure chaos warriors are better then temple guard, but not by much... and then there are saurus and skink ranked units to back them up- although I cant remember the names of the big things that joins skinks to give them some combat power).

The dwarven list is basically the maximum number of the best warmachines filling all the special/rare choices... I think someone said you could get something like 17 war machines at 2k (6 bolt throwers, 3 cannons, 2 grudge throwers, 2 organ guns and anything else you have the points for). You can take so much power in the war machines and then back them up with thunderers and a few cheapish blocks of warriors as well as being able to shut down most people's magic phase... but whether armies can weather then storm of metal long enough to reach the dwarves is yet to be seen (and I recon it would be really boring to play- shoot.... shoot... shoot... shoot.... win/loss, repeat next game. No magic on either side, little combat and no manouvering).

 

[Tim/Steve]

Dwarf King: him and his unit just dont die... ever. Thats basically summing him up. Anyone short of Archaon wont have much of a chance against him and the unit just isnt going to break (and being dwarves they are hard to kill). It is massively expensive and very slow moving though... so anyone with good tactics just tries to avoid you or lure you out of position while they destroy the rest of your army.

Just take a regualar dwarf lord with 1+ save and GW with the ASF rune.

There's no point taking the ASF rune with a great weapon as a dwarf... 8th ed means the great weapon's ASL cancels out the ASF of the rune and you strike at I... which being a dwarf if pretty mush ignorable. Just take the ASL great weapon and accept you'll be attacking second, your armour is normally good enough to see you through (especially if you take defensive runes).

 

[Tim/Steve]

Not really surprising- and can be summed up by 3 of the units I was playing against last night: 30 warriors, 10 wide with MoN and frenzy banner. Valkier. 15 MoK knights.
Each is capable of just running forward and hitting something and almost everything will crumple under their attack. Very simple to understand, very simple to play with (and so enjoyable to make mincemeat of).

 

[Tim/Steve]

He has several large units of warriors and kairos fateweaver

No he doesnt. WoC and DoC are different armies and cannot be played in 1 army unless its as part of a doubles game.
Anyway, if he did take kairos just take a KoS/HoS with siren song and laugh as one of the worst combat units in the game is forced to charge you (although kairos now gets a thunderstomp... so not as bad as he was).