[Tybalt]

Hello good people! Just have a few questions that if anyone has time to answer would be great help.

Ok number 1. My Chaos Space Marine Daemon Price has Mark of Tzeentch/Warptime and Bolt of Change.

Can i use WT twice at the start of either phase due to Mark of Tzeentch? MoT Allows me to use up to two powers per turn that are not a psychic shooting attack (Well not BOTH shooting attacks).

What happened was basically my Prince failed his psychic test for WT, could he then use his second power as it is not a psychic shooting attack to roll again to try and use it?

What my opponent argued was that if taken on RAW then i cannot as essentially WT and Bolt are my two pieces of Wargear and a piece of wargear can only be used once (Of this i am also unsure). I countered this with the Errata on Ahriman as it states he can use WT multiple times, this however is literally Ahriman specific no doubt due to The Black Staff, but could it not also include the MoT ruling as well? In effect i argued that if taken on RAW then it is NOT a psychic shooting attack so can legitimatly be used a second time. In the end we used 'The Most Important Rule' and diced off so i wasnt too fussed.

Any help on this would be great!

And my second question is can a Bolter opt to fire one shot! Or does it HAVE to use its rapid fire rule? And i know most marines come armed with a Bolt Pistol but my friend wanted me to ask so any clarification would be grand.

My final question is somewhat tricky as it deals with the timing of when to roll for a force weapon.

The example is as follows. Typhus and a Dark Angels Company Master go toe to toe Typhus is slain but causes the one unsaved wound on the Company Master that would allow me to roll a leadership test to slay him outright due to Instant Death. Now then, seeing as i died but still caused the one unsaved would would i be allowed to roll the leadership test to use my Force Weapon, or is it that the timing of Typhus' death means i do not get to roll even though we are both I5 so striking at the same time.

I hope i have explained all my queries clear enough so that someone of you good people can answer them for me! Any examples of why certain rules work or not would be great so i can show my opponent.

Thanks alot everyone!

BOOM!

 

[Aramoro]

You only get to Warptime once, Psychic powers are once per turn unless otherwise stated. As you suspected the Ahriman ruling (and Eldrad) are specific to them only.

What happens if you fail it is a bit of a mystery, I would guess you cannot do it again as the power was used even though you failed to get it off.

Bolters must rapid fire, all rapid fire weapons will fire 2 shots under 12" weather you want to or not.

If Typhus and the Chapter dude are striking at the same Initiative then you get to use your force weapon to try and instant kill him. You're not dead until after you resolve your wounds.

Aramoro

 

[Tybalt]

Thanks alot pal for this super fast response!

Thanks for answering these i can let my oppnenet know now as well, cheers again!

 

[Schizofen]

From the CSM FAQ:

Q: Can Ahriman use the same power two or even three times during the same turn?

A: Powers that are psychic shooting attacks can only be used once per turn. Gift of Chaos can be used multiple times, as it is not a psychic shooting attack. The same is true for Warptime, but of course there in no point in using this power more than once per turn!

Ahriman's rules don't metion anything specific about non-shooting powers, so I'd assume that the point about Warptime in the FAQ would apply to other psychers as well. So yes, you can attempt to cast it twice.

 

[maddermax]

Schizofen is correct on this one - you can use warptime twice, if it gets shot down the first time. There is no rules stopping you from casting the same power more than once, if you have the ability to cast multiple powers. The only restriction is on psychic shooting powers, which Warptime isn't.

On the other questions, Aramoro is correct. Bolters must rapid fire, and Typhus can use his Force Weapon ability when striking simultaneously.

 

[aboytervigon]

also the deamon prince can use 2 psychic shooting powers as he is a monstrous creature

 

[DeathKlokk]

But not the same one twice.

 

[Aramoro]

I've always considers Psychic Powers to be usable once per turn as they become abilities of the model and all model abilities are once per turn. Hence Why Eldrad Specifically says he can cast the same power twice. But I see no evidence of this outside of that context so yeah same power over and over.

Aramoro

 

[yanlou]

also dont forget that you can opt to fire bolt pistols if there in the wargear list instead of rapid fire bolters which is especially good if your within assault range

 

[forkbanger]

But I see no evidence of this outside of that context so yeah same power over and over.

There's a single reference to it the BRB- "(but still cannot use the same power twice in a turn)."

There's no explicit restriction to only using powers once per turn, though.

:toot:

 

[Tybalt]

Thanks alot for everyones input its been really helpful.

From all the responses i think that the overall ruling would indicate that i am allowed to cast Warptime again, i would argue this down to the fact that there simply isnt anything saying i cant do it. There is clear solid rulings on the use of psychic shooting attacks but nothing stipulating the use of none psychic shooting attacks more than once.

This lead me to look into the Wargear side of the argument. I scrolled through the BRB for rulings on wargear and came across nothing, then followed that up under the Characters section nothing again, so finally went to multiple codexes and their wargear entries had nothing specifying the limited use, i know its a bit of a grey area overall for looking for rock solid RAW but seeing as there isnt anything stopping me; the precident of being allowed takes over.

I do understand that wargear is one per turn, but as i think it was Aramoro who said there is no definative ruling on using wargear once per turn, they can only fire/use H2H weapons once per item per model (if you get me).

Thanks again for the help and insight to this little bother, and as well for clarifying the other two questions.

BOOM!

 

[Unforgiven302]

Check the FAQ about using psychic powers multiple times per turn. First page, last question on the right. Yes, this is asked about Ahriman specifically, but I see it as representative of any model that can use multiple psychic powers per turn.

"...shooting attacks can be used only once per turn. Gift of Chaos can be used multiple times... the same is true for warp time..."

LINK TO THE FAQ

 

[Wolf_Lord_Skoll]

There's a single reference to it the BRB- "(but still cannot use the same power twice in a turn)."

There's no explicit restriction to only using powers once per turn, though.

:toot:

This. The rulebook states that even a model that can use two pyschic powers and shoot two weapons can't use the same power twice.

The FAQ reference only applies to Arhiman, and Eldrad is the only other one who can do this.

Otherwise the Swarmlord could cast Paroxysm on two units, for example

 

[maddermax]

This. The rulebook states that even a model that can use two pyschic powers and shoot two weapons can't use the same power twice.

The FAQ reference only applies to Arhiman, and Eldrad is the only other one who can do this.

Otherwise the Swarmlord could cast Paroxysm on two units, for example

That restriction ONLY applies to shooting attacks, which includes Paroxysm. All non-shooting powers have no such restriction, or, at least, none that I can find.

As such, it works like this:

Shooting powers can only ever be used once!
Normal casters can only ever use one shooting power, as it counts as firing a gun.
MCs Can use two different Shooting powers, (if they have the ability to cast two of course!)
Casters can use other non-shooting powers more than once (if they have the ability to use multiple powers).

 

[Aramoro]

Yeah it looks like a bit of an editing issue. The phrase in the Psychic Shooting attacks section says you can only use each power once, but in a way which makes me think you were only ever supposed to use each Psychic once. It's written like a handy reminder not a specific exception for Shooting attacks. But as it stands it is an exception and an odd one.

Aramoro