Warhammer 40k Forum and Wargaming Forums banner

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
A bunch of Berzerkers/MoK Marines on foot with three squads of Havocs in Heavy Support and 3 units of Spawn in Fast Attack could totally work, yeah; nobody thinks that it's viable, so not many people actually bring the tools to deal with 60+ T4 power-armoured bodies in a game.
 

·
Entropy Fetishist
Joined
·
4,249 Posts
It would not be wholly competitive, but you can have some fun with it: bringing Kharn in a Land Raider and a Lord on a Juggernaut among Spawn, or something. Or bring Warlord Huron to infiltrate a couple big blocks of melee marines. So... you can have some casual fun with it, but competitively? Not going to stand up to Knights, Eldar, a Flying Circus...
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
It would not be wholly competitive, but you can have some fun with it: bringing Kharn in a Land Raider and a Lord on a Juggernaut among Spawn, or something. Or bring Warlord Huron to infiltrate a couple big blocks of melee marines. So... you can have some casual fun with it, but competitively? Not going to stand up to Knights, Eldar, a Flying Circus...
I beg to differ on the Eldar front - most Eldar lists I've seen do not have any way near the anti-Marine fire to kill 60+ dudes.

But yes, you're totally right on most other tournament-style lists in circulation at the moment (I say, as a broad generalisation - what was that Lictor-heavy list that won a big tourny recently? Talking about 'competitive lists' is kind of bollocks sometimes :wink:)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
358 Posts
eldar dont rock that much low ap weapons that is true but there is alot of str 6 weps so your just forced to take alot of saves.

but marines with MoK crafty tactics and stuff can do well u just need to make sure u get to them with enough fight left and the tools to crack tanks it can be done
 

·
Entropy Fetishist
Joined
·
4,249 Posts
I beg to differ on the Eldar front - most Eldar lists I've seen do not have any way near the anti-Marine fire to kill 60+ dudes.
Well, assuming a Wave Serpent can kill 3 marines per turn (it's not far wrong to say, assuming scatter lasers kill 1, shuriken cannon kills 1, and Serpent Shield kills 1, on average rolls--and that's discounting any chance of rends!), and you have 6 Wave Serpents in your list... you can kill 18 Marines per turn (which is not to count any passenger Dire Avengers disembarking for another few rends per turn, then Battle Focusing out of assault range). The Marine player had better be taking those (notoriously tough) Wave Serpents out fast, or making a bunch of them jink, is all I'm saying... if they don't want their 60-Marine list gone by Turn 3.
 

·
Warsmith
Joined
·
1,190 Posts
Talking about 'competitive lists' is kind of bollocks sometimes :wink:)
Well that's all about knowing the game you are going to play in!

My amy list advice always is based around the idea of a pure PUG game, but as many tournaments run quite strange missions.. making sure you have the best army for that can lead you down strange paths!

(there was a tournament i watched a few weeks ago{work stopped me playing}, where on the 2nd game after the 3rd turn all guns run out of ammo! which helped allot of the CC based forces)
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
Well, assuming a Wave Serpent can kill 3 marines per turn (it's not far wrong to say, assuming scatter lasers kill 1, shuriken cannon kills 1, and Serpent Shield kills 1, on average rolls--and that's discounting any chance of rends!), and you have 6 Wave Serpents in your list... you can kill 18 Marines per turn (which is not to count any passenger Dire Avengers disembarking for another few rends per turn, then Battle Focusing out of assault range). The Marine player had better be taking those (notoriously tough) Wave Serpents out fast, or making a bunch of them jink, is all I'm saying... if they don't want their 60-Marine list gone by Turn 3.
I got Serpents down as killing 2 MEQ per turn as I thought they could only fire 2 guns per turn. Either way - sure, a list like 6 Serpents would probably beat a viable Berzerker Horde, but if we want to take ir from 'viable' to 'competitive' then bringing them in units of 20 with Be'lakor to make one Invisible per turn and Shroud the rest/take out enemy support then you couls make a far more 'competitive' list - at the cost of theme and ability to enjoy casual games, naturally.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
If we're talking World Eaters and trying to stick to a theme I'd rule out taking any marine with a bolter, so no havocs. No obliterators either. I don't see why WE couldn't have shooty tanks/daemon engines though, so that's where I'd look for fire support

Kharne with berzerkers in land raider
Berzerkers in rhino
Khorne termies in land raider

Then I'd be looking for some fire support from predators. Maybe melta bikes too.

The rest of the list would be fast CC units like spawn and bikes. Alternatively maybe take Skarbrand and some bloodletters as a fluffy allied detachment. I might go ahead and write this list... I think a good semi competitive list that can occasionally upset certain competitive builds might be possible.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
HQ Kharn 160


T 9 Berzerkers with four chainaxes, power weapon, icon of wrath 223


T 7 Berzerkers with three chainaxes, rhino with dirge caster 189


E 5 Terminators with MoK, 2 chainfists, 2 fists, heavy flamer, 2 c. meltas 230


Land Raider 230


HS Land Raider 230


HS Predator with autocannon, lascannons 115



HS Predator with autocannon, lascannons 115 (1492)


^ So a 1500 point list with two land raiders, a rhino and two preds deployed. What are in the land raiders can kill just about anything if they can get the charge. The rhino with berzerkers is just a tax really, but if you can shield it with a land raider it might slip through the net. The predators are cost effective fire support


One thing- the army could look awesome. FW World Eater hatches on all of the tanks and FW WE terminator parts on the termies means every model is thematic.



Expanding to 1850 I'd take Skarbrand and some bloodletters. Maybe a bloodthirster instead of Skarbrand but either way the daemon element gives two more pressure units that should arrive at about the same time the berzerkers are jumping out of their rhino and the land raider units have charged
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
I wouldn't bother with Autolas loadout on the Predators as you don't have enough mid-strength, high-AP firepower to make stripping hull points a viable possibility - go Lasboat or go home. Chainaxes are worthless pieces of crap. Terminators should really be in units of 3 with 3 Combi-Meltas each (at the very least it forces skimmers to Jink, neutering their firepower, or devastating conventional vehicles).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
I guess the best thing you can do is run khorne marked CC chaos marines for your troops, find the best use for those units you possibly can and then stock up on the usual units good chaos lists have. If you can have lots of fast units rushing the enemy line (maybe some khorne daemons too) then perhaps disembarking fuaxerkers might be ignored

I wouldn't bother with Autolas loadout on the Predators as you don't have enough mid-strength, high-AP firepower to make stripping hull points a viable possibility - go Lasboat or go home. Chainaxes are worthless pieces of crap. Terminators should really be in units of 3 with 3 Combi-Meltas each (at the very least it forces skimmers to Jink, neutering their firepower, or devastating conventional vehicles).
Fair point, but the two of them together could do some damage, and a land raider that survives to drop off its passengers can then add its firepower to the predators'. There are definitely ways to upgrade both to tri-las preds though, and I can see the incentive

The chainaxes are really just a fluffy way to make the berzerkers WYSIWYG.

I like the terminator unit for dealing with stuff like knights but I can definitely see the incentive of dropping them and their land raider for stuff like bikes, spawn, maulerfiends etc.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,694 Posts
Squire got some ggod hints there, but i disagree on the Zerkers, honestly i prefere Khorne marked marines, and also 2 raiders...overkill and also 2 meltaguns away from Explodes! result. But its tastes and meta, i guess.
Also, i'd ditch kharne due to no EWarrior and crappy saves.
Also, with the new tactical trait table, you will not need huron to get some infiltration. just reroll the dice thanks to CAD detachment and you have 50% chance of getting something good.
I'd use Crimson Slaughter for the free fear that will help you a bit vs non marines and go:

Khorne lord on Juggernaut
blade of the relentless
daemonheart
sigil of corruption
(200)

5 spawns
(150)

5 spawns
(150)

5 bikers
2 meltaguns
meltabombs
MoK
(145)

3 Terminators
MoK
3 combimelta
powerfist
(128)

10 Marines
MoKhorne
Icon of wrath
2 meltaguns
meltabombs
powermaul
(220)
Rhino, dirge caster
(40)

10 Marines
MoKhorne
Icon of wrath
2 meltaguns
meltabombs
powermaul
(220)
Rhino, dirge caster
(40)

10 Marines
MoKhorne
Icon of wrath
2 flamers
meltabombs
power sword
(210)
Rhino, dirge caster
(40)

2 Forgefiends
(350)

1 Predator
Havoc launcher
heavy bolter sponsons
(107)

that's 2000 pts.
3 fast units (nikers spawns + lord) to threaten the enemy with killyness and antitank capability, 3 units in rhinos to take objectives, working in tandem, forgefiends and predator as a reliable anti eldar and light vehicles/ hordes.
terminators as nuisance, suicide unit that must be dealt with. You can live without infiltration, but if you get it, it's gold.

EDIT: If you meant to have ONLY zerkers..then, no, not viable. It could be:

Kharn (160)

20 Marines
MoK
Icon wrath
2 meltaguns
meltabombs
(355)

10 Marines
MoK
Icon wrath
2 meltaguns
lighningclaw
rhino
(250)

5 spawns
5 spawns
2 Spawns
(360)

3 Maulerfiends
(375)

But this army is very "stupid". just rush the enemy and hope something gets there.
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top