[Skcuzzlebumm]

ok time for my 2p on the lists...

(just gonna focus on the 2 most recent as this is what the lists have evloved into)

#1
Yes i'm gonna say it, EC for the warriors!!! I know what you have said and what chris etc have stated about there been so much AP4 etc there aint a point to them. But belive me those bolter shots bouncing half the time AND increasing your CC surviability by 50% IS worth the extra 3pts a model. At first i though the same as you but the benifit in CC is worth it alone.

I wouldn't bother with scuttlers on the spineguants - wasted points. Been able to move an extra 6" aint that great tbh. The only time its ever really worth it is with stealers.

Either make the HG's 14 strong as a min or scrap them. 8 of them will melt far too quick and just bleed the vastly inflated points. Plus 8 are never going to do anything in the game apart from the rare extremely lucky glance. HG's only work well i bg numbers - thats why i take bucket loads of them. They are far too fragile to even consider in small singluar units. Wither get 3 or more units that are 12/14 strong as a min or just forget them and buy more spineguants.

Rienforced chitin is the extra wound yeah? Sorry too lazy to check which is which. If it is then i wouldn't bother, your actually giving away more points as it takes the same number of wounds to go below half. Ok you last a little longer but in the current GT system every VP saved is important. This is doubly so for nids who have loads of units that bleed vps like mad.

#2

Same as above where applicable.

My main concern is the warriors. TBH whats the point? Warriors are the kind of unit that automatically attract fire and tend to die as a result unless you hids them like buggery. In this kind of list i would be looking at say a cheap dakkatyrant or maybe even a broodlord.

Also like i said before about scuttlers, when you have a load of stealers give it them. They wanna be in CC quick, it'll help. Transfer the points from the spine gaunts and maybe drop a ravener to do this, which you can afford to do with all those stealers.

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

if you do go a tyrant i think one with dual twin dev's would be far better than wings and CC. Reason been there is enough in that list that excells in CC, but relativly little that can deal with skimmers well (the carnifex's maybe but you realy wanna be shooting tanks with them). Pumping out 12 S5 BS4 shots at 18" with re-rolls to hit against some speeders (the bane of all nids lives) is gonna scare the shit out of them. Woks well against marines also (ave 3 dead marines outright - do that 3 times and it makes it cost back, not bad).

The other bonus is it is another TMC to march forwards and porvided mobile terrain for your stealers :lol:

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

meta game shows that spineguants are better vs MEQ than termaguants pt4pt. But termaguants are superior against anything with higher/lower T and can also glance AV10.

HAving loads and loads of gaunts works just like Daves orks - you swamp the buggery out of the enemy with ridiculous units of say 30 spinegaunts (only 150 pts - get 180 for 900pts!!!!!) and they fall apart under massed low S attacks.

Works great up unitl you face a tank or something with T7 or better. But then thats where the Tryant and fex's come in.

If anyone could ever be bothered to do the mega spinegaunt army of doom the would probably stand a good chance of winning the GT.

But no-one (except maybe staff) have that kind of money to throw away.

And know one wants to paint that much - tried and now can't face another nid.

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

true, speeders are THE reason for having fex's at all. They are the only thing nids have capable of pinging them each turn to slow them down.

or lots of S4 hormaguants i remind you.

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

fair enough - just read speeders and thought so.

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

Personally i have always thought, and seen that Nids tend to work best when they are maxed to one end of the spectrum.

Hordes do great against anything that isn't skimmer/tank spam, they swamp the foe with superior numbers and in a tourney where ppl prepare to fight MEQ half thier list is wasted.

Godzilla goes the other way and deals with armour VERY effectivly. It has the wounds and durability to take down even the toughest skimmer/tank army though it fears the marine horde (or similar) as it just can't kill that many tough troops.

Mix armies seem to fail IMO been too much of a jack of all trades. This has always been my sentiment and also been the trend. That is until Joe came top 10 with his essentailly mixed force.

What he did is take the strenghts of my army (he had 2 big HG units and 3 BIG guant units - talking 16 each which is the horde - also had some gargoyles) then added in the best parts of a Godzilla list (2 Gunfex's with extra wound and a mean fly tyrant with devourer and scyth) to deal with tanks. He then filled the list with common choice safe units like 2 ravners for objectives and cheeky IC snipe, Zoes for Synapse and the odd uber shot, and leaping warriors for synapse and maybe CC.

This worked awesomely for him, a good approach that bascially melded the best of the best together without compromise.

Looking over your lists you are almost there at times, 3 glaring things though IMO.

Reliance on elite troops (stealers, raveners and warriors) - these boys will get the full force of the enemies attention. To me i have never seen someone effectivly use stealers and the like in large numbers at a tounrey. PPL aint mugs and will go after them like flies on very very smelly cheese (see resited the obvious sweary answer). Evne taking them in small numbers is a risk as your opponent can just chuck a little fire once to deal with them. Ravners are a bit better as your opponent ends up wasting shots on them as theya re low wound. Warriors unfortunatly you will probably need for syanpse cover unless you go Tyrant. Stealers though are easy meat/VPs at the GT - believe me. Would you let stealers live more than 2 turns?

Syanpse: One list has no syanapse (4 warriors and 2 zoes are never gonna last) and the other has almost all warriors. Havng too little synapse is BAD. Even fexs are afected now, you need, i hav found at least 5/6 syanpse units in your army to maintain coverage throughout a game as ppl know to kill the syanpse. Now the other list has bucket loads of warriors, good we have coverage, but as i said above how much AP4/5 weapons are there that can chuck horrendeous ammounts of fire at them? Warrirors unfortunalty melt very quickly - its why the massed warrior army has never succeded at GT. Tyrants and Broodlord are great survivable syanpse models. Tyrants for been tough and broodlords for having at least 8 wounds (broodlord and 5 stealers min). They stay around longer, keeping your coverage.

Lastly unit size. You guants ned to be BIG. 12 just aint that many. I always aim for at least 60 guants in my army. Thats on average 2:1 vs MEQ lists foot for foot model. They are the kind of odds you need to be able to do anything to MEQ. Also currently you have little mid ranged, anti AV10 (i mean tornado) power. Fleshborers are the answer and unless you invest in a load of high S devourers - take all your guants as termaguants.

Does this help? Do you disagree?
- could easy make this into a tactica.

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

OK looking at that list:

Hive Tyrant [wings, 2 x Twin-linked devourers, Enhanced senses, Toxin Sacs, Flesh hooks, Implant Attack]

Swap one set of devourers for Sycthing talons and then give him +1WS and +1I over +1BS (you are twinlinked remember). Tyrants, especailly flying ones, want to be in CC to really dish it out. So let him be good at that.

Broodlord[Implant attack, Toxin sacs, Flesh Hooks]
5 genestealers[extended carapace, fleshhooks]

good though if possible i would take an extra stealer to keep round number for scoring purposes. Also give your broodlord Carapace above Implant as he will pretty much kill and IC he comes near - especially with those stealers helping. But the increases save will help you vs shooting if he is target via torrent (or ends up alone) and in CC when little gits some how land wounds on you.

4 Tyranid warriors[Leaping, Extended Carapace, Rending claws 2x scything talons, 2 x Rending claws

Not sure what you mean by this but i'm guessing the standard 35pt warrior build i take (scyth and rend). Good choice but try not to over estimate thier CC potential. They need support in combat as thier low WS and S will slow them down.

Lictor 80

Good call for the re-roll with your tmc's and raveners.


8 Borerguants[scuttlers] 64
12 spinegaunts[scuttlers]
12 spinegaunts[scuttlers]
8 Hormagaunts[toxinsacs] 96
4 Ripperswarms[leaping, Toxin sacs] 56

right remember what i keep saying about guant unit sizes? make then 12-16 strong (pref 16). Also keep them cheap dude - scuttlers in increasing the pts in a unit which will rarely if ever still be scoring at the end of the game. Invest those points in making your really good units better, not polishing shit so to speak.
Again Hormaguants need to be 12-16 and having at least 2 uints of for redundancy as they will get shot at.
Rippers: good fun at home but remember at the GT they can't take any biomorphs. Also its more points in non-scoring units, invest them elsewhere dude.

3 Zoanthropes[warpblast, Synapse]
Carnifex [Venom Cannon, Barbed strangler, Enhanced senses, Reinforced Chitin]
Carnifex [Venom Cannon, Barbed strangler, Enhanced senses, Reinforced Chitin]

yep cool, perfext, nothing to really say here.

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

Asked brain this 2 years back when i was designing my nids and he says yes its wording is out of date but it still stands that Rippers are fixed - therefore no upgrades. For some reason he has visions of ppl bringing ridiculous ripper armies of doom - though who would have the money?

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

the broodlord is ace - he cause terror in all opponents tbh.

Basically he'll make ppl worry over terrain near thier army and (hopefully) make them clump together around an area with little cover near by. Or (just as good) spread themselves thin across thier DP to try and cover every angle.

Then sticking him down will force ppl to move away an/or start pouring masses of fire into him. Provided you don't make the mistake (like i did against you) of letting him and his bodyguard get AP4'd the stealers will absorb enough wounds to deliver him into the enemy army. His stealers have never still been scoring when i play but i t don't matter when he eats his points back. H will rip the arse hole out of everything up to a bloodthrister/gliave prince. only beware of BIG squads with fists. But then you should hopefully have other parts of your army - like guants to help deal with them.

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

No, 4D6 - god you tau players never get anything right do you? Forgetting you can fleet while falling "back", FarsHite has Ork Hunters pref rules, Flame On is L33t over Spikeyclub.....

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Skcuzzlebumm]

Nice looking list there; if this is the way you wanna go (some elite nastiness for defo) then i would make those spinegaunts 4x12 - more scoring units and resiliance as gaunts go under quick. Spread your chances.

Also i think the stealers need scuttlers to give them an added edge. Been able to sneak 6" further forward is very helpful (just remember you don't always have to do it).

If you droppped the Impant attacks of both the broodlord and tyrant, plus the tyrant bioplasma you should have neough spare points to do this. Bio plas on a tyrant with twin Dev aint so handy or great. Plus with both your HQ's not much can stand up to them (except GD's) and you'll find the doubole wound is often wasted points.

I also still think those warriors need EC - i know you don't but i will never shut up about it :twisted: