[Crimson Shadow]

So I bought a Leman Russ Demolisher kit with every intention of building the Punisher variant specifically for horde armies. But after trolling the forums, and hearing the less than stellar opinions people have posted after actually using them in games plus a little side trip to the Combat Calculator, I'm now having second thoughts.

So, should I build it as a Punisher, or did I just buy myself another Demolisher?

Oh, I guess is the Eradicator worth building as well?

Thanks.
CS

 

[GrimzagGorwazza]

If you already have a demolisher what does it really hurt to build a punisher, you are simply adding more versatility. I always build what i think looks better for my army.
Otherwise i wouldn't be building a slaaneshi biker force and would have bought a baneblade instead of a shadowsword.
Depending on what your opponents are like will probabley decide for you. most of mine like to play around with their lists, fielding units because they want to see them on the field (one guy fields an assault squad every game purely because he likes the seargeant model) rather then waht is the obvious tactical advantage.

 

[CursedUNTILLDEATH]

Punishers in squarderns of 3 simply put down to much fire power to be ignored.Lacking Ap6 and only being able to pop light vechiles is somewhat of a problem though. If your enemy is foot slogging then yes, they can be usefull but any type of armor is dangouers unless you give them auto cannons . As for eradicaters they look cool but i really dont use them. Thier just not that great at killing anything really. I would go with a standerd LR instead.

 

[shaantitus]

Buy some magnets andd make it interchangeable. I know there is a thread on that around here somewhere. I am concerned about having a tank with no AT ability at all. Even the exterminator can destroy most armored vehicles from the side or rear.

 

[HOBO]

Aren't the end pieces on the barrel just plug-ins?, or is that not the case?
If it's possible then magnetise...that way you have all the options available.

But I agree with you on the Punisher...the Calculator actually makes it look good when compared to actual on-field effectiveness - it's a poor excuse for a Russ, especially when compared to other units available in the Codex that perform a similar role, plus are cheaper to boot.

The Executioner on the other hand is a great Tank, as is the Demolisher.

 

[HorusReborn]

no it's not the case... you want versatility man, Executioner... have had more success with them as a squadron. However, I do think the best tank on the field is the Demolisher... In a typical game I run a squad of executioners, a squadron of two vanquishers and a battle tank to take out any Land Raiders. The Executioners eat marines and pretty much anything up. The nova cannon is cool because no one gets a cover save from that bad boy... cover is a big thing these days!

 

[HOBO]

Hmmm, I thought that was the big deal with the new Russ Kits...that they were 'plug and play'.

 

[GrimzagGorwazza]

I can't help but feel this post would be more at home in the tactics section of the forum.

 

[The Sullen One]

Why dither, if you like the Punisher then field a Punisher. If your going to start basing your army on what works according to the internet, then it's not going to be your army is it.

Seriously more people need to stop worrying about what 'works' and just go with whatever models they like the look of.

 

[GrimzagGorwazza]

Why dither, if you like the Punisher then field a Punisher. If your going to start basing your army on what works according to the internet, then it's not going to be your army is it.

Seriously more people need to stop worrying about what 'works' and just go with whatever models they like the look of.

I agree, i read here that somone thought lootas were overrated and not worth the points. I still got a mob of them cause they look so damned cool.

 

[The Sullen One]

I agree, i read here that somone thought lootas were overrated and not worth the points. I still got a mob of them cause they look so damned cool.

Whoever said they were overrated was either blind or bitter. I had one game where five of them took out damm near half a Dark Eldar army.

To many armies now sacrifice their character and individuality for the sake of being competitive and I'm not just talking about Space Marines here. Thankfully GW's thinking along the same lines and encouraging people to give their armies character.

 

[HorusReborn]

this isn't what the initial converstation was.... I answered the guy's question with the intention of explaining one benefit over the other... He himself stated the facts about the Punisher tank. Hobo: The plug and play benefit really only applies to the defensive weapons on the sponsons and the front of the tank.

 

[fynn]

on the demolisher kit, the main weapons are changeable (plug and play), but there not on the new leman russ kit. just dow hat i did, make all the weapon options, and paint em up, and swap as needed, so you can change the load out from game to game if needed.

 

[HOBO]

Thanks for the plug-in details guys..I have a lot of Russes but they're all the old model. I do have 2 new Demolisher kits coming, but they're going to be Demolishers as I'm building a Siege Company Detachment for my Battlegroup.

Someone brought up to the OP about 'building the version you like' over 'building the version that performs best in-game'...I agree in general, but the OP (or anyone really) might not have money to splurge on multiple kits so doesn't want to 'waste' his hard earned on a dud...hence his question and reason for making this Thread.

 

[Crimson Shadow]

Punishers in squarderns of 3 simply put down to much fire power to be ignored.Lacking Ap6 and only being able to pop light vechiles is somewhat of a problem though. If your enemy is foot slogging then yes, they can be usefull but any type of armor is dangouers unless you give them auto cannons . As for eradicaters they look cool but i really dont use them. Thier just not that great at killing anything really. I would go with a standerd LR instead.

Not entirely sure I want to buy two more Punishers to make them viable. 500pts in order to take an anti-horde oriented tank seems like a points sink.

Why dither, if you like the Punisher then field a Punisher. If your going to start basing your army on what works according to the internet, then it's not going to be your army is it.

Seriously more people need to stop worrying about what 'works' and just go with whatever models they like the look of.

I can appreciate where you're coming from and I agree to a certain point. Hence why I was all prepared to build the Punisher, but as a counter to that, given that I do have a limited budget at the moment, I want to build something that I will find more use for now and through various situations, and worry about building a model I like the look of and that has limited usefulness gamewise, for when I have more money.

...I agree in general, but the OP (or anyone really) might not have money to splurge on multiple kits so doesn't want to 'waste' his hard earned on a dud...hence his question and reason for making this Thread.

I agree.

 

[TRU3 CHAOS]

It sounds like you want the punisher, so thats what I'd go with.

 

[Vaz]

If you want anti horde, then I'd suggest getting yourself a Vulture with Punisher Cannons, or a Vulture with 4 Rocket Pods. I've been running 2 with TL Punishers and one with 4x Rockets, and there's not much place to hide. Of course, the issue with that is that you're then relying on Vendetta's, Venators and Veterans (Elysians is full of V's - it's how they recruit).

However, if it's for Tournament play, I'd recommend the bog standard Leman Russ with Trip Heavy Bolters. Takes on Medium armour and Heavy infantry, as easily as the next, and 20 shots only works out as 10 hits, 6 wounds, and most likely 2-3 dead.



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[HOBO]

I totally agree with Vaz..the Punisher will disappoint you the more games you play. Yes it might shine in a game or two by taking out a MC, but it won't do it consistently, and it won't kill enough of a Hoard list to make any significant difference..but that's the trouble because for it's points it should be good, but it ain't.

It is the poorest of all the Russ varients..I have at least 2 of all of them and use them quite a lot. My top 3 are the LRBT, Demolisher and Executioner and that's in all-comers lists.

All that said, the Punisher is a nice looking Tank, which is reason enough for me to have it, but don't put Punisher and effective/competitive in the same sentence.

 

[The Sullen One]

I can understand wanting to get value for money, so here's an idea. If you save up a little start looking on bitz sites for Leman Russ turret parts (assuming the turret's still detachable the way it was on the old kit), once you've enough parts you can build a spare turret and swap out weapons depending on the game.

 

[maddermax]

Punisher only starts doing decent damage with pask, and at that point, it's the price of a land raider. On the other hand, it can take down a Tyranid MC or daemon Prince a turn on average rolls. I have a friend who made a nice conversion of one with Pask, and he swears by it - it will usually kill any Combat Squad it's pointed at, and it's effectiveness isn't reduced by cover against most targets. The only thing is, it usually becomes a high priority target, after it wipes out an enemy heavy weapons squad in a turn.