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Slave to Heresy!
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So theres been a fair amount of negativity the last few days over 5th edition. Not all from me I might add! :biggrin:

So just wondering, what part about 5th edition do you personally dislike the most?
 

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That its awesome? No, but seriously the kill point system is the only thing I got a real beef with in 5th.
 

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Kill points is my major one as well and cover saves sometimes get a little crazy with it's just so easy to find cover, but other then that i think it's really good
 

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I actually like TLOS, makes the game more realistic (Yes, I realize, realism + 40k = ????).

My beef is that they implemented 5th without realizing the implications it would have on every army. They beefed up transports and made glances less dangerous- Making Necrons totally screwed. I may be thinking a bit single mindedly but with one release they turned Necrons into a joke when they used to be widely considered to be very powerful in 4th. Since they're the only army I play it was a big hit. I still play, but its a lot less competitive.
 

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Yeah I was a Necron player and I was also hit brutally by the change. Its partly why i'm working on a Space Marines army now. That and marines are a million times more fun, customiseable and interesting than generic blenders.

That said I love the change to vechile damages. I found it horribly unrealstic how easy it was to destroy tanks in 4th. Everyone had a dozen lascannons and even Monoliths tended to get shredded in 1-2 rounds.

oh... this is what I hate about 5th... umm...Necrons.
 

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Grand Lord Munchkin
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I love it! TBH I only had about a month of 4th so not much to compair it to. lol
 

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I Piss in your Cheerios
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People complaining about it!

:p


No, Capture and Control. And that has little to actually do with 5th, per se.

Single worst mission ever, and I include the old 2e Mission Cards, like the Dawn Raid, and that one where you had to destroy Bunkers in the enemy DZ.
 

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I like 5th but I also liked 3rd & 4th Ed.
I can't see the point in hating this rule or that scenario (or whatever)...we play the game within the ruleset we're given. Changes in editions just means we have to adapt and learn how to play our lists to suit...swings and roundabouts.
 

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Hmm lets see:

- Cover saves system
- Space Marines
- Codex Creep
- Retarded Missions (compare to 8th ed WHFB)
- Retarded victory system (both kill points and objectives; again, compare to 8th ed WHFB)
- Implications that CSM will be more like a satanist terrorist Coyote from Looney Tunes (Abaddon + Renegades + GW's warband ideas = THUNDERING EPIC FAIL).
- Necron Gauss weaponry nefred to death.
- Necron WBB FAQ-d so that you WBB back from EVERYTHING, even Gift of Chaos, which essentially mutates your model into a Chaos Spawn. Also, Jaws of the World Yiff. And I mean fluffwise. I dare you to pull that in a space hulk or on a daemon planet.
- Increasing tendency towards the total disregard of fluff, meaning 1, the never-ending 41st millenium 2, the invincible SM who must win on a 3+ or little Johnny will start crying 3, armies are being generalised to the point where fluff-based diversity disappears (see Orks, Eldar and CSM) 4, SM are an exclusion from the previous point, they're getting retarded codices with rules that are retarded and fluffwise unfitting to the Chapter (1, psyker-hating Space Wolves have the most powerful spells in the game 2, Fast Predators and Vindicators for Blood Angels and the Greater Daemon Mephiston, pedosmile mask Dante (turning DPs into Lords without an effort) and of course nipple armoured titty marines).

Have I missed anything?
 

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Do we really need another thread about this shit?

Jez, not to disrespect you or anything, but as an administrator i would have thought the last thing you would do is create yet ANOTHER thread about this same topic.
I know your not complaining about 5th ed as much as others, but to everyone else... im sick of hearing this shit.

Seriously people, dont clog up the forums with all these bullshit complains about the games rules. The game is what it is, and your opinions arent going to change anything. If you dont like the game then dont play it. If you think you can write better rules, then go and start your own miniature wargaming company.

If you want to play a balanced strategy game, then go play chess or something. Fuck.



P.S. Sorry for the rant, but someone had to do it.
Suspend me, ban me, whatever. I dont really care.
But seriously, i think 99% of people will agree with me when i say "Quit your bloody bitching and play and enjoy the game how its supposed to be played or else piss off".

/end rant
 

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Yeah, kill points are a bitch...

"Sir, they've blown our Land Raider to smithereens and Venerable Brother Agrius just went nuclear, but we've managed to kill 5 grots and 2 killa kans. We are clearly winning the battle!"
:facepalm:

But otherwise 5th ed. works pretty darn well, except for necrons :laugh:

My main problem is them not updating the codices with each edition, I'd like to see some of the older codices have multiple effective options (ie.Eldar, DE, WH, Tau) or just plain be effective (Necrons, daemons, chaos, Daemonhunters, DA). Otherwise 5th ed.'s great, granted I never played 4th but from looking over the rules I'd have to say 5th ed. looks better on paper by far.
 

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Hmm lets see:

- Cover saves system
- Space Marines
- Codex Creep
- Retarded Missions (compare to 8th ed WHFB)
- Retarded victory system (both kill points and objectives; again, compare to 8th ed WHFB)
- Implications that CSM will be more like a satanist terrorist Coyote from Looney Tunes (Abaddon + Renegades + GW's warband ideas = THUNDERING EPIC FAIL).
- Necron Gauss weaponry nefred to death.
- Necron WBB FAQ-d so that you WBB back from EVERYTHING, even Gift of Chaos, which essentially mutates your model into a Chaos Spawn. Also, Jaws of the World Yiff. And I mean fluffwise. I dare you to pull that in a space hulk or on a daemon planet.
- Increasing tendency towards the total disregard of fluff, meaning 1, the never-ending 41st millenium 2, the invincible SM who must win on a 3+ or little Johnny will start crying 3, armies are being generalised to the point where fluff-based diversity disappears (see Orks, Eldar and CSM) 4, SM are an exclusion from the previous point, they're getting retarded codices with rules that are retarded and fluffwise unfitting to the Chapter (1, psyker-hating Space Wolves have the most powerful spells in the game 2, Fast Predators and Vindicators for Blood Angels and the Greater Daemon Mephiston, pedosmile mask Dante (turning DPs into Lords without an effort) and of course nipple armoured titty marines).

Have I missed anything?
I hate to do this but i've really gotta disagree with some of your points. Its just filled with so much venom and hate. Cover saves are arguble. Its nice now that armys liket he Tau dont laugh and go "lawl you should not have bothered with armor" though it does give armies with crappy armor far better saves.

Space Marines... how exactly are Space Marines a horribly by product of 5th edition.. thats like me saying Tyranids. They are the reason 5th is bad.. I ... its just not there. You dont have to like them but how are they a horrible result of 5th Edition.

Retarded Mission and Victory system. Yeah... pretty much no one seems to like that.

CSM stuff.... prehaps a bit oversimplified.

Necron WBB... your a Necron hater arnt you? For the record WBB has been FAQed not to work a whole variety of times. JotWW does NOT get a WBB roll because the unit is taken off the field and not a casulity, also sweeping advances do not get WBB rolls which makes no sense.

The "going against the fluff" argument is a good one. And I dont want to take a side here nor there. However I think its great to see codexs and chapters evolve. Some people cry foul the moment a new additon is added to a chapter or race codex because "its not not fluffy". Of course its not, its new! That said Space Wolves hating psykers having the nastiest psykers is... wierd.

None the less all the Codexs that have come out have been brutal. It sucks that CSM (and DE and Necrons) have old outdated dexes but I dont thhink anyones been desappointed with their new Codexs... other than a few wierd Tyrnard players.
 

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Hmm lets see:

- Cover saves system
- Space Marines
- Codex Creep
- Retarded Missions (compare to 8th ed WHFB)
- Retarded victory system (both kill points and objectives; again, compare to 8th ed WHFB)
- Implications that CSM will be more like a satanist terrorist Coyote from Looney Tunes (Abaddon + Renegades + GW's warband ideas = THUNDERING EPIC FAIL).
- Necron Gauss weaponry nefred to death.
- Necron WBB FAQ-d so that you WBB back from EVERYTHING, even Gift of Chaos, which essentially mutates your model into a Chaos Spawn. Also, Jaws of the World Yiff. And I mean fluffwise. I dare you to pull that in a space hulk or on a daemon planet.
- Increasing tendency towards the total disregard of fluff, meaning 1, the never-ending 41st millenium 2, the invincible SM who must win on a 3+ or little Johnny will start crying 3, armies are being generalised to the point where fluff-based diversity disappears (see Orks, Eldar and CSM) 4, SM are an exclusion from the previous point, they're getting retarded codices with rules that are retarded and fluffwise unfitting to the Chapter (1, psyker-hating Space Wolves have the most powerful spells in the game 2, Fast Predators and Vindicators for Blood Angels and the Greater Daemon Mephiston, pedosmile mask Dante (turning DPs into Lords without an effort) and of course nipple armoured titty marines).

Have I missed anything?
-Poorly thought out points costs.
-Ridiculous psychic defenses.
-Dumbed-down special rules.
-Prevalence of Eternal Warrior, and other annoying SRs.
 

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my only beef is theat only troops can capture objectives.
 

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Slave to Heresy!
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Do we really need another thread about this shit?

Jez, not to disrespect you or anything, but as an administrator i would have thought the last thing you would do is create yet ANOTHER thread about this same topic.
I know your not complaining about 5th ed as much as others, but to everyone else... im sick of hearing this shit.
Personally I'm sick of your attitude. This forum is here to cover everything about the hobby, that includes negative feeling - we don't get paid by GW, we're not here to endlessly praise them. If what they're doing is bollocks we'll highlight it and give a true representation of the community.

If you don't like it don't read the thread. Or fuck off somewhere else, I'll miss you like the shit I flushed last night.
 

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I hate to do this but i've really gotta disagree with some of your points. Its just filled with so much venom and hate. Cover saves are arguble. Its nice now that armys liket he Tau dont laugh and go "lawl you should not have bothered with armor" though it does give armies with crappy armor far better saves.
Its not the existence of cover saves that bothers me but the way it is assigned. For instance, how come you've got a cover save in a crater if I'm shooting you from the second level of a ruin? And why does a squad get a cover save if half the squad is indeed in the forest, but the rest is out in the open? Barbed wire giving cover save against the shot of a Lascannon? And other ridiculous abuses of the cover saves rule? If only LoS gave cover I'd be happy, but this is just stupid.

Space Marines... how exactly are Space Marines a horribly by product of 5th edition.. thats like me saying Tyranids. They are the reason 5th is bad.. I ... its just not there. You dont have to like them but how are they a horrible result of 5th Edition.
Sure its not 5th ed's fault strictly speaking, but the era of 5th edition contains the Space Marines lots of people are sick and tired of. Every time a new SM codex comes out it postpones the update of codices that are in much greater need of attention. And don't tell me you never came across the "Space Marines Must Win" type of player. If attention would be evenly distributed among the races of 40K, not only the 40K community would be more colourful and less agitated, but because of this a more mature game system and codices could be introduced. WHFB managed to get by eight editions without a favoured army, why couldn't 40K do the same?

Retarded Mission and Victory system. Yeah... pretty much no one seems to like that.
I take we have an agreement here? :)

CSM stuff.... prehaps a bit oversimplified.
You're being far too diplomatic. :p

Necron WBB... your a Necron hater arnt you? For the record WBB has been FAQed not to work a whole variety of times. JotWW does NOT get a WBB roll because the unit is taken off the field and not a casulity, also sweeping advances do not get WBB rolls which makes no sense.
Actually a friend of mine plays with Necrons and both of us were shocked when WBB got FAQ-d and couldn't believe how retarded it was. Though him being a shameless opportunist wasn't helping much, but he stopped abusing the rule after a while. But even so I wouldn't call myself a Necron hater, I just wish you guys got a Codex with fixed Gauss weapons, some new units, T5 for everyone with the Necron rule and Feel No Pain on a 3+ (rez orb lets you roll for wounds caused by Instant Death, PW, and AP1-2 weapons; sounds fair to me). I prefer that if I killed something it stays dead, unless its a Living Saint but shes a bloody phoenix, it can't be helped. :p

The "going against the fluff" argument is a good one. And I dont want to take a side here nor there. However I think its great to see codexs and chapters evolve. Some people cry foul the moment a new additon is added to a chapter or race codex because "its not not fluffy". Of course its not, its new! That said Space Wolves hating psykers having the nastiest psykers is... wierd.
And four of them if they feel like it. Ask Dark Eldar players what do they think about Living Lightning. :p

None the less all the Codexs that have come out have been brutal. It sucks that CSM (and DE and Necrons) have old outdated dexes but I dont thhink anyones been desappointed with their new Codexs... other than a few wierd Tyrnard players.
Every new Codex without Power Armour were nice and well done in my opinion. IG and 'nids have several ways to be nightmarish, but theres always a way to counter it.
I apologise if I sound offensive at some parts I wrote this on a whim and before lunch. :p :)
 

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Hey some well thought out and sincere responses, appirecate it and can place a much greater value on what you've said.

Some of your dislikes are probably anothers likes. For example while cover saves annoy you, someone else loves them. I dont disagree with your statements on people getting cover in a crator when your in a tower overlooking it. Or a bush saving you from a lascannon.

the Necron WBB thing i've seen FAQ'd against the Necrons so well I think both you and I need to go double check that rule cause we've got some differeing views. That said it would not surprise me for it to have changed.

I do think everything should have a counter. The game is so fun when every counter has a counter. If anything can be countered by something then we've got a crazy setup of balance. Thats not to stay anything should counter something.

I dont personally know the CSM stuff so I cant say how bad they have it, but I see a lot of people complain about them.. and not so many defending .. so they must have some legit problems.

The Necrons have problems in competitiveness but I think there biggest issue is how boring they are. Look at DE.. hugely outdated but at least there still fun for the fans to play.
 
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