[HaSY]

Great, I know about the two chapters already. As for Knights of Crimson Order, it is actually my friend's chapter that Gav graciously include in the novel and he himself got signed copy of Unforgiven from Gav.

So the successor chapters are chapter mastera instead of supreme grand master, right?

 

[Lord of the Night]

Great, I know about the two chapters already. As for Knights of Crimson Order, it is actually my friend's chapter that Gav graciously include in the novel and he himself got signed copy of Unforgiven from Gav.

So the successor chapters are chapter mastera instead of supreme grand master, right?

Huh cool. Well the Knights do pretty well in the book, their Chapter Master gets to command the entire Unforgiven Battle Fleet against Typhus and his Plague Fleet.

It seems that way yes, though some may have their own titles. Nakir for example seems to be titled The Master of Souls, and the DA use that title as well suggesting it is official and not just a moniker.


LotN

 

[Brother Lucian]

The Unforgiven just became available for ebook purchase:
http://www.blacklibrary.com/warhammer-40000/the-unforgiven-paperback.html

Managed to hold off on reading spoilers. Eager to read this one.

 

[Lord of the Night]

The Unforgiven just became available for ebook purchase:
http://www.blacklibrary.com/warhammer-40000/the-unforgiven-paperback.html

Managed to hold off on reading spoilers. Eager to read this one.

Good, i'm looking forward to seeing the opinions on the events that take place near the end and the significance of them.


LotN

 

[Brother Lucian]

Wow, what an tremendous twister of a tale. And that ending, definitely absolutely did not see that comming. But it fits perfectly with the circular theme there has been with the dark angels since their past as the Order on Caliban.

So Azrael's command to the tuchulca to get everyone away.....it must ultimately have been this -very- act that picked up all of the Fallen, and spread them through the galaxy and the timestream as Caliban disintegrated from the presence of the rift.

 

[Lord of the Night]

Wow, what an tremendous twister of a tale. And that ending, definitely absolutely did not see that comming. But it fits perfectly with the circular theme there has been with the dark angels since their past as the Order on Caliban.

So Azrael's command to the tuchulca to get everyone away.....it must ultimately have been this -very- act that picked up all of the Fallen, and spread them through the galaxy and the timestream as Caliban disintegrated from the presence of the rift.

Yep, though it was Annael detonating his Dark Talon within the rift that actually destroyed Caliban. Likely this drew the Fallen into the rift and the Tuchulcha scattered them after misunderstanding Azrael's command.

LotN

 

[Khorne's_Chosen]

The ending line makes it quite clear that the 40k Dark Angels have been manipulated to extract the Fallen from Caliban's surface with the power of Tuchulcha.
But... what about the loyalist Heresy-Era Dark Angels?
Azrael said "Get everyone safely away from the breach", not "Scatter the bad guys over space and time and leave the good guys where they are".
Some loyalist could have been scattered in 40k aswell, thus explaining some of the Fallen considering themselves as such.
But I do not remember any of them claiming to have been fighting FOR the Lion during the Fall of Caliban.
Also, this would imply that some of the "bad" guys remained in the 30k half of the rift, which would immediately start a second civil war... well, perhaps they were all killed in the final phase of the battle or retreated. It could make sense.
Or perhaps, the loyalist were all scattered in the 30k part of the breach...
But Azrael's request was not so specific, on the contrary, he was fooled just because of his non-specific request... therefore, the division would have happened only becase Tuchulcha willed it so, perhaps being a servant of the Dark Gods.
On the other hand, the Fallen survived the battle of Caliban thanks to Tuchulcha's doing in the future, and in that future they play a major part in making the very event that saved them take place, in a circular timeline like "I-saved-my-past-self".
I still do not understand the role of Typhus in this book, apart from him and the Fallen trio being tricked and used by Cypher to create a threat big enough for Azrael to listen to him.
Perhaps Astelan was aware of the bigger picture, but I ignore what difference this would make, as well as I ignore the reason behind this most complex of Cypher's masterplans.
Does this book finally classify him as an enemy to the Dark Angels and the Imperium? Or perhaps he meant to save the Lion and bring him to 40k, for the end times, where he would be needed most? Why did he excape towards 30k? To start all over again?
I like to thing that the Hunt is the price the Dark Angels had to pay for the safety of the Imperium - a price that will grant them their Primarch in humanity's most desperate hour.
The answers are still missing, and I do not really feel this as a true conclusion to the saga -apart from the shocking finale, we are at the starting point again, with nothing changed and more questions than answers.
But I guess that's how it goes with the Dark Angels.

 

[Stormxlr]

Got ebook version today, will start reading =D

 

[Alive Blue Clown]

I am so interested!!!!!

 

[Vitarus]

Well, I'm only a casual reader. Not hardcore into everything like most of you. But I rather enjoyed it. Cypher was the best part. Very cool. Our new Dreadnought kicked ass. All the plots and double crossing was fun. It was nice to see Ezekiel in action, and sensing important things, although I'd still like to see more of him.

What was the short HH story where Lion took the Tuchulcha?

 

[Nashnir]

I wish they release a novel just from the POV of Telemenus ( Maybe a different story).

 

[gamingharry]

So finished Unforgiven after reading the whole series AoD-Unforgiven in the last few weeks. Loved it to bits, one of Black library's better Trilogy's! Ending truly is a "Did they just do THAT??" moment and I loved it. Cant wait for Gav's "Angels of Caliban" later this year/ next year to read more about his Dark Angels.

Holy Crap on a cracker where to begin. First, while it isn't spelled out I'm pretty sure this book confirms that Zahariel is Cypher. Its listed in the book that Cypher, Astelan, Luther and Zahariel where the top dogs of the fallen rebellion and Luther himself is later quoted saying that Corswain killed his Cypher at the fall of Caliban. That tidbit of information along with all the HH hinting and that the Cypher audio short was about Zahariel not Cypher himself in my mind confirms until proven otherwise that Zahariel = 40k Cypher

So the warp rift over Caliban was created by Tuchulca's meddling with the plague heart and the bridge. When Azreal then ordered everyone be taken to safety we can kind of assume that Tuchulca teleported all the Fallen to 40k and scattered them, and returns all the loyalists back to their ships in 30k? That's what we are roughly assuming. If so that's massive. The biggest implication I can see is: did any of the fallen really fall to Chaos then? If this happened is totally likely that everyone in 30k was really suprised by the warp rift and none really did cause it. All the Fallen at the time of the fall of Caliban where loyal to the emperor and potentially pure? Seriously how was this allowed to be written?? This is amazing. All this speculation will probably be confirmed at the HH series draws to a close with at least 1 or 2 more Dark Angel books left, probably all spearheaded by Gav now.

Finally, less of a a discussion and more of a question, what was going on with Telemenus' God-Emperor visions? As soon as they started in Master of Sanctity I though we would be getting a demonic possession story in part 3, but that plot point didn't really go anywhere. When he encountered the Plague Lord at the end there was a little internal monologue about still being tainted but It didn't go anywhere so I'm not sure if that was him getting over the early possession? Any thoughts?

 

[MontytheMighty]

Sounds like BL has finally grown the balls to shake things up a bit

 

[Seraphiel]

So finished Unforgiven after reading the whole series AoD-Unforgiven in the last few weeks. Loved it to bits, one of Black library's better Trilogy's! Ending truly is a "Did they just do THAT??" moment and I loved it. Cant wait for Gav's "Angels of Caliban" later this year/ next year to read more about his Dark Angels.

Holy Crap on a cracker where to begin. First, while it isn't spelled out I'm pretty sure this book confirms that Zahariel is Cypher. Its listed in the book that Cypher, Astelan, Luther and Zahariel where the top dogs of the fallen rebellion and Luther himself is later quoted saying that Corswain killed his Cypher at the fall of Caliban. That tidbit of information along with all the HH hinting and that the Cypher audio short was about Zahariel not Cypher himself in my mind confirms until proven otherwise that Zahariel = 40k Cypher

So the warp rift over Caliban was created by Tuchulca's meddling with the plague heart and the bridge. When Azreal then ordered everyone be taken to safety we can kind of assume that Tuchulca teleported all the Fallen to 40k and scattered them, and returns all the loyalists back to their ships in 30k? That's what we are roughly assuming. If so that's massive. The biggest implication I can see is: did any of the fallen really fall to Chaos then? If this happened is totally likely that everyone in 30k was really suprised by the warp rift and none really did cause it. All the Fallen at the time of the fall of Caliban where loyal to the emperor and potentially pure? Seriously how was this allowed to be written?? This is amazing. All this speculation will probably be confirmed at the HH series draws to a close with at least 1 or 2 more Dark Angel books left, probably all spearheaded by Gav now.

Finally, less of a a discussion and more of a question, what was going on with Telemenus' God-Emperor visions? As soon as they started in Master of Sanctity I though we would be getting a demonic possession story in part 3, but that plot point didn't really go anywhere. When he encountered the Plague Lord at the end there was a little internal monologue about still being tainted but It didn't go anywhere so I'm not sure if that was him getting over the early possession? Any thoughts?

Note: several spoilers are paraphrased into the context of this post.

Actually, I'm very firm to the opinion that Zahariel El'Zurias became one of the founding Grand Masters of the Grey Knights.

Zahariel's top-quality psychic abilities (commented upon by the Emperor in Angels of Darkness) and wariness toward Luther's plans against the Lion (in Fallen Angels) would be an ideal personality for Malcador to harness; additionally, remember that most of the original Grey Knights were Throne-loyal members of the Traitor Legions.

The most powerful evidence, however, is the Epimetheus character in Pandorax. It's revealed in the final parts of that novel that Epimetheus is a Dark Angel, and very insistent on avoiding the attentions of his current-era peers. His physical description and overall ability-levels match Zahariel well, and we haven't many other choices among the currently-named psychic Fallen that would fit such characteristics.

Have some spoiler tags for your aforementioned spoilers.