[morfangdakka]

So when not counting oustide sources like IG, Inquisition and such.
If every chapter pooled all its resources and decided to battle each other to the point of destruction who would win? I am not counting Successors except in thh case of DA as they are known for acting toghther and are still really under the command of the DA Grand Master

The Top 4 I think are:

Black Templars: The Size of the chapter is around 4000-6000 and all the Crusading Fleets toghther would be a good edge in a space battle

The Unforgivin: Seeing as how the DA and their 2nd foundings work toghther often they could bring abuot 4000 marines in a battle not to mention thier fleets and notably the Rock (Thier very large space Fortress)

Space Wolves: Another Large chapter though am not sure how large.

Grey Knights: Though not as large as the others they are without a doubt the best trained and equipped of all the chapters due to their nature.

There are of course some other contenders, though I think these are most likely amoung the best, and no I am not counting the Custodians as they really are more than marines, being even better than Grey Knights.

So Fluff wise what do you think?

 

[Geist]

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Grey_Knights

With an estimated strength of 3000, I think I'd have to go with the Grey Knights. They all got force weapons, all are powerful psykers, best trained, best equipped. They are like Custodians: more than marines. Though I think still not as good as the Emperor's personal body guard.

 

[Capt.Al'rahhem]

Ultramarines.
Over half of all Spacemarine Chapters get their geneseed from the Ultramarines and the majority that do owe fealty to Ultramar. Plus the vast resources, not even including the PDF regiments, of their entire sector of space. They would be unbeatable.
End of Story.:victory:

 

[hippypancake]

So when not counting oustide sources like IG, Inquisition and such...

Grey Knights: Though not as large as the others they are without a doubt the best trained and equipped of all the chapters due to their nature.

I'm going to quote Lexicanum word for word on this "...they are in fact part of the Inquisition's Ordo Malleus..." So according to your rules Grey Knights muat gtfo XD

 

[gen.ahab]

Ultramarines.
For one it is impossible for them to lose, they are like the MC... They just can't lose. Number two there are around 499,000 marines waiting to help whenever they call. Like to say the wolves but they would get swarmed.

 

[Stephen_Newman]

I would love to say the DA. The 1st and 2nd companies are just sooo cool (Especially the Ravenwing-see them running over entire company of black templers or ultrasmurfs!)

 

[Calamari]

I would have to say Templars, if the crusader fleets met up and decided to destroy ultramar, they could without batting an eye lid. They are almost at legion strength and have the rescourses of thousands of keeps across the galaxy. Logistically, this might cause some supply problems but it means they have no centralised organisation which means no quick strikes to break the templars' backs. Then there are the successors...

The grey knights would quite easily kick the Templars in their rebel arses but this will never happen. The grey knights, strangely, have bigger fish to fry.

 

[Doelago]

Well, it is almost unfair that the Grey Knights are allowed to take part in this, as it is basically an overkill when you throw Grey Knights at something, the drag down a huge, a very huge titan, with just three of them on the job, they kill deamons, and a lot of them...

They have Psy-Cannon bolts, Force Weapons and those kinds of things, so god damnit, they have already won!

On the second place would be both the Dark Angels and the Black Templars...

Then on the third we would find both the Blood Angels and the Space Wolves...

4. Imperial Fists

5. Iron Hands

(The list continues, but for the sake of god, lets jump to the last one...)

999. Genesis Chapter

1000. Ultramarines...

 

[Capt.Al'rahhem]

I simple love how most people choose to ignore established fluff because of their hatred for Ultramarines. Then use the fluff of whatever Chapter they'd like to say would win to argue for that win.

The OP said "Not counting the Inquisition" so Grey Knights are out of the running. He also brought in successor chapters. This makes this hypothetical situation an Auto-win for the Ultramarines. If it was single 1000 marine chapter vs. another single 1000 marine chapter we could argue the various traits, tactics, training, etc. of various chapters. But on just what assets and successor chapters a given chapter can call it will always be Ultramarines, hands down.

You take approximate # of 1000 SM chapters of which we know at least more then a 3rd are Ultramarine Successors. That's between 333 and 500 (or more)successor chapters. That equals 333,000 to 500,000 Marines. So 4,000 to 6,000 Black Templars ain't gonna do it. Even if you bring the Grey Knights into it, with just 3,000 all the force weapons and pys-cannons in the galaxy won't help you with 111 to 1 odds.

You can't fight the Fluff Facts no matter how much you hate the Ultramarines. :headbutt:

 

[kharn-the-betrayer]

Legion Of The Damned would win

 

[LukeValantine]

Yah I got to say the UM win just because if they got all their 2nd/3rd founding chapters together they could theoretically fight two other chapters by numbers alone.

 

[Baron Spikey]

Guilliman's geneseed is used by 3/5ths of all Astartes (so around 600,000 Marines), if the Ultramarines and their Second Founding Chapters chose to they could easily destroy all the other First Founding Chapters. If you included everybody's Second and Third Founding Chapters the Ultramarines would still wipe the floor with every Chapter not of Guilliman's geneseed from those foundings.

It boils down to-

Include Successor Chapters: Ultramarines Auto-win

Don't Include Successors: Black Templars Auto-win

 

[hungryugolino]

Well, bugger the Ultramarines.

Grey Knights.

 

[gen.ahab]

I was under the impression they had half the chapters. Hm.

 

[Putch.]

Grey Knights. Sure the ultramarines would have so many..but their the grey Knights. Am I right or am I right?

 

[hungryugolino]

Ultramarines are miserable excuses for space marines. Give the argument a sane writer who doesn't basecoat everything in Mordian Blue, and they'd be steamrolled.

Grey Knights, damnit. Or, for that matter, Black Templars.

 

[shas'o Thraka]

I am going along a different route here, instead of saying who would win. Why? Simply because no-one would win!

This is because some chapters know each other so well that it would be a stalemate. A chapter attacks, another knows the tactic and counters. The 1st chapter counters the counter etc.

 

[gen.ahab]

It wouldn't matter the counter. You can't counter being outnumbered by a force 100 times your size. The ultramarines foce would simply role everyone under. It's an ultra win.

 

[hungryugolino]

Ultra fail.

Honestly, why would the successor chapters even support their miserable failure of an originating chapter, seeing as they'd have obviously lost it if they're attacking the Grey Knights and every other chapter in sight?

More to the point, Calgar's ineptitude, second only to that of good ole Boreale, could probably lose a war against the Navi. With the Navi blindfolded.

His track record is atrocious when it comes to commanding troops. Losing your whole first company and letting the redshirts under your command get slaughtered is not tactical genius. To say nothing of the baneblades and fleet.

And that's before we get into possession and heresy.

 

[Warlock in Training]

One day someone will have to retcon the absurd # of chapters in official fluff. Ultras were big Legion, and played little to no part of the HH, so by default 3/5 are Guillimens Gene and therfore UMs? :laugh: Whatever. It seems every new SM dex has 10 to 20 more UM successor chapters added.

Truth be told that means 3/5 of all Renegade Chapters are Guillimens Gene. :nono: Shame on you. You curroptable blue bastards. So I dont see, at all, evry Guillimen Gene Chapter flocking to Calgar. After all hes just a Chapter Master like the 100s others.

Now the DAs are the head of the entire Lion Gene stock, and the successors know it. Big difference there in the numbers gaim. The Second Foundings are a front for the Codex Astartes sake.