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Discussion Starter #1
IMO Stormtroopers (Inquisitorial, and I think Guard can get them) are really underrated. This is because:

A: You can give them meltas.

B:Hellguns are not bad.

C: The Main Reason: NO-ONE EVER SHOOTS AT THEM!

You can have 2 meltas in a squad of five, so potentially 2 melta troops and 3 hellguns for 70 points. And as i said, the most important thing is that they are so underrated that no-one will ever shoot at them, meaning they can get up close with their meltas.

My Friend took 2 5-man Squads of them, set up as above, and took down 5 termies with 1 assault cannon and 1 heavy flamer!

Opinions?
 

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Problem with them is because they cost more than the average guard squad they are more of a target to be destroyed first. Which is the opposite to what you said :p i've found in every game i've watched or played they are usually the squad to go down first.
They are good but its just how people use them that makes them poor, they need to be dropped in imo. Squads dropping behind lines with two meltas is good, but its the only safe way they can be deployed and be effective. Having them move over in a chimera or foot slogging it, is bad. imo :p
 

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Discussion Starter #3
OK, So you give them a Chimera and they cost 140 points, more expensive but still... And also, your point about being more expensive than most guard, I am planning to use them in a SM army, and I think that people will think "Haha, Guard... Aaah, SM's! I dont play against skilled people like yourselves, and i doubt the people I play would think of shooting at "A Crappy Guard Squad!! Haha..."
 

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I occasionally use Storm Troopers in my IG army. I taken them in a squad of five with two Melta guns and the Deepstrike ability which all total costs 75pts. Not bad at all.
 

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Same here, QuietEarth. I take one Dropping ST Squad with 2 Meltas, another with 2 Plasmas, and a Dropping Special Weapon Squad with 2 Meltas and a Demo Charge. They don't always work well individually, but they usually make the point total for the three squads back in enemy kills each game.
 

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In my Witch Hunters Army I have one squad of Inquisitorial Stormtroopers for one reason. Plasma Weaponory, I give two of the Storm Troopers Plama guns, upgrade one Storm Trooper to a Veteran arm him with Plasma Pistol and Close Combat weapon and finally add a Priest with a Plasma Gun (only one Priest may be armed with one per army.) so that gives me 3 Plasma guns a Plasma Pistol and and two Hellguns. For the cost, it's one of the best moves you can make in a Witch Hunter army (since any real plasma force is lacking) and it's one of the cheaper moves in the game. Also if you want, you can beef up the squad a little and throw them in a Chimera. So for the Witch Hunters I think it's a really good move. However I have to admit I really don't know how useful it is in the other army's.

-The un-Divine
 

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Ok, well i didn't realise you meant using them as allies rather than in a stand alone army,
They have more survivability when allied with space marines as inquisitorial troops ofcourse.
 

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I find them very effective. The carapace helps them last, the 2 special weapons allows for specializing, and the option of DS, infil or a Chim makes them far more mauevourable than any other Imperial guard squad
 

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I find them extremely valuable.

Infiltrating and Deep Striking are nice options. They're still pretty cheap in the grand scheme of things.

They have a variety of unique tactical advantages in an Imperial Guard army. The first is mobility. Most Guard infantry are constrained by a heavy weapon. This means that Guard generally has trouble moving up and seizing objectives. Storm Troopers don't have heavy weapons so they give up less while staying on the move.

They can provide excellent localized firepower. The difference between BS3 and BS4 is significant. With a pair of Plasma Guns they're actually quite competent at shooting up a smaller Marine squad. I've also used them to good effect in tying up Necron Warriors. They lost in the end, but they managed to delay the opposing enemy squad long enough that it never managed to achieve anything else in that game.

Many lists are optimized around killing Marines. This means that AP4 firepower (Heavy Bolters, Whirlwinds, etc.) aren't really all that common. Many players go for Lascannons and Plasma Guns instead. Those weapons are largely wasted shooting at Storm Troopers. It takes twice as many hits from a Bolter/Shuriken Catapult/Gauss Flayer to take down a Stormtrooper as a regular Guardsmen. This gives them more resiliency than you'd expect. Combine that with my earlier point about mobility and you have a competent unit for holding objectives.

Stormtroopers face direct competition from allied Sisters of Battle though. The Sisters are only slightly more expensive but have superior weapons and armour. Stormtroopers have nicer special weapons, but it's likely not enough to tilt the balance back in their favour.

Overall I think Stormtroopers are a little overpriced for their capabilities. I think at two points less they'll be very viable. (I suspect that will happen when Codex: IG gets redone. Regular troopers will probably go down a point or two too judging by the new Orks.) I still continue to use them because the Kasrkin models are some of the best in the range.
 

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My favorite ISTs are also the least attractive when put in context of their army list.

Witch hunters ISTs are great because you can load them up with shotguns. The addition of shotguns makes them a fairly viable assault choice...but at the same time, for 1 point more, you can get a sister of battle with a better save and a better gun, and the option to take two special weapons

Anyone play Grenadiers/carapace traits for their IG?
 

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I'm a Cadian player, so I use the grenadiers trait. Always have 3 squads of Kasrkin either line bolstering or objective stealing, I find they're excellent as a mobile fire base and far better point for point over an armoured fist squad. Elite Kasyrkin in my army consist of 2 deep striking,5 man suicide melta squads, which is weird IMO as I preserve the "specially trained soldiers" and kill the real commandos...
 

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I mainly use inquisitorial stormies, because the sergeant gets better wargear. All of my (viable) lists are built around an inquisition core of some sort, and I find stormtroopers make excellent "sneaky units". One of my favorite tactics is to distract the enemy with whatever signature unit the army has (GK or SoB) and sneak a few stormies around their flanks. It works surprisingly often, as they're so busy trying to kill the big, scary grey knights that they find out too late a few stormies toting meltaguns can be just as deadly if left unchecked.
 

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I use grenadiers as troops exclusively. The 4+ armor is worth it with all the ap5 most armies have. I run a squad of 8 men and 2 special weapons. One plasma and one of melta, standard. They have been able to handle anything they come across.
I have had players so scared of them that they over commit fire power just to get rid of them. At armor 4 over heats are not always fatal. Back them up with something that looks scarier like a russ and they will live long enough to kill thier target.
Do not underestimate the stuff they com with.
Free frag for assaults, i have even killed a sentinal with these (inquisitorial troopers).
krak is good for killing up to armor 12, i have bad luck on rolls and so need all the attempts as possible. A squad of 5 marines with bolters were held up for 3 turns (6 assault phases) by a sentinal and only managed to stun it. a unit of 5 grenadeirs came up assulted killed it and moved on in one turn.
Do not under estimate BS 4 las. My friend runs carnifex at toughness 7 standard to make it immune to str 3, because he has lost that last wound to rapid fire las several times. I have even made use of thier ap 5 hell guns.
At exactly 300 pts you can have a mobile force with more fire power than an equal pt cost of regular troops, and they are just as survivable. Admittedly they are pretty short range, but every squad needs back up to be effective. The Sgt can get officer only items and make the squad decent at cc. With a little bit of every thing and the right selections they are very versitale for just 10pts.
 

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I feel really weird then for using storm troopers as the basis of my Daemon hunters army. My core is three ten man squads w/ 2 special weapons and chimeras with heavy bolters. I find them to be fantastic for taking and holding objectives; I leave the assaulting to my DS grey knights. Targeters are fantastic for a defensive force so you can tell exactly how far each enemy squad is and concentrate your firepower accordingly.
 

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They have their uses, but I find them ridiculously overcosted. Compare the point cost of a Storm Trooper with that of a Sister of Battle to get my view.

I think that in a Guard army you're better off using Vets 90% of the time. That said, just because they cost too much doesn't mean we shouldn't use them! I sometimes mix my IG and DH to make a mechanized Grenadier army. While I nomaly hate Chimeras and Storm Troopers in my IG army... when you combine them together they work a lot better.

Since STs have a better chance of surviving the front line than guardsmen, it makes a lot more sence to have them riding chimeras. Had to that fact that STs can have 2 plasma gun and a plasma pistol with a BS of 4 and they start to look attractive (plus they don't fry themselves nearly as much as guardsmen). I normally have 4-6 squads in a chimera and 2-3 deepstriking ones with meltas for tank hunting. With tank support and HQ lascannons it's not that bad an army and more importantly it's great fun and looks cool.
 

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I field witch hunters and IG together too. While Sisters are better with power armor and bolters, ST have better special weapons and come in 5 man minimum not 10. my opponents actully are more scared of the ST due to 2 plasma and ignore the sisters allowing them to close with their special weapons. if they do shoot the sisters that means they are hitting the more survivable unit putting the plasma in place to wreak havoc. win win for me.
 

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I find stormtroopers to be a bit inconsistent. They can do a lot of damage against the right opponent but sometimes they either die very easily (there is loads of multi-shot, cheap ap4 around) or don't have good targets.
 

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if you deep strike them with 2 plasma guns rapid fireing they are good but if the get shot they will die.
 
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