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Ah, not the reason that I thought the FAQ writer needs shooting... but a valid alternative.
Last few days I've been thinking about the steam tank after reading through the empire FAQ the other day:

Steam Tank, Magic phase
Ignore this paragraph.
Ok, so non-strength magic can hurt the steam tank.. great
Q. Can the spell Pit of Shades from the Lore of Shadows affect the
Steam Tank? (p51)
A. No.
Huh... and why not? If the steam tank no longer has any special magic protection then it should be down to an I3 test vs death... I have absolutely no idea why the pit of shades can't affect the steam tank. At least I assume you use the commander initiative, since it is a chariot now...

Tricking the steam tank into dangerous terrain, characteristic tests such as dwellers or purple sun or just throwing about a billion attacks at it will eventually kill it.... lore of metal works too. WoC dont really have a lot of choice- you can send in units of marauders with great weapons, flails (or just go for numbers and dont try for armour mods) or you can take the lores of metal/death (I assume you can take them)... mebbe a chaos giant could help you out (I only remember my own slavegiants giants rules... and they are pretty useless vs a steam tank).
Other then that, to really beat it up in combat you are looking at D3-D6 wound weapons and try to get lucky, armour ignoring attacks (lots of them) or just get S9-10 attacks, but then I doubt many can get S up that high (my ogres can if I really tried... but otehr then steam tanks there is no reason to).
 

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Im not sure about the characteristic tests auto-pass/auto-fail... the FAQ says nothing about them. I assume they still work the same way they did, so purple sun FTW.
 

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Im just scared shitless about steam tanks... the grand total of counters with the WE book is the amber spear spell from beasts (requiring me to take a spellweaver, lore of beasts and to get the right spell)... even then I would have to cast it. My ogres are slightly better off with enough armour mads to take the tank down to 3+/4+ save in combat but Im still on 6s to wound. My magic missile is reasomably effective since its 2D6 S2 hits with no armour saves.. but its still only 1 wound average a turn (and not too hard to dispel). I can cast it several times, but it doubtful I would have the butchers to be able to do it...

In the old rules the stank was hard and hit hard. Now its either pathetically easy or near impossible to kill.
 

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Chaos Lord in a unit with the standard of discipline (if you can have someone else as the general.. if not no worry, you just lose the general's Ld bubble) and then cast okkam's mindrazor... lots and lots of auto-hitting S10 attacks.

Randomly thinking about other ways to get S10 got me thinking- you can do it with ogres too: Tyrant with siegebreaker and "giantbreaker" (55pts of magic items) is S9 and as long as the stank doesnt get the I3 of the captain then it auto-hits and does D6 wounds... quick buff with bullgorger can make him S10. 5 S10 auto hit, D6 wound hits probably make him the best combat solution to the stank anywhere (other then non-ogre giants)... but I cant literally think of no other reason to take that tyrant build.

Talking of giants- whoever said earlier that you get their attacks and then thunderstomp was a little off: you cant thunderstomp a steamtank... stomp/thunderstomp only works against infantry/beasts/swarms. Its not a great loss though anyway since it would be an average of .3W a turn...
 

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There is the Wood Elf Sword that autowounds, and then does a 1d6 ld vs ld no saves of any sort for further wounds. That can take down a STANK fast. As can the Runefang. Honestly, the worst thing a steam tank faces is 20 skinks with blowpipes. Or any poisoned ranged attack with enough behind it. Sure the save is 1+, but make about 10 saves a round and it rapidly dies. As for Chaos, sure, you're limited on doing things about it. Flank charges with Knights is likely the best that you can expect.
Cant see the spirit sword working TBH- you have 4 attacks, which will all hit and wound, then the stank has a 2+ save to fail. SO you might do a wound. The you have 1D6+10, and he has 1D6+10 and whoever scores higher does that many wound to the opponent... with equal Ld you are just as likely to wound yourself as the enemy (and since you would need to do another 9 wounds to the enemy, vs the 3 he needs on you its unlikely you'll win). Although take a potion of strength and you'll be doing well. S7 means that the stank will have 4 5+ saves to make, and then is likely to be rolling for the spirit sword 3 times.. which is pretty likely to kill your highborn, but if you are taking a few more wounds off the tank you'll have ended its usefulness for the game.


I always think its the first 4 wounds on a steam tank that are the important ones. If you can cause 3-4 wounds on a stank then its usefulness will mostly be ended. Most of the people I play against dont risk more then a 1in3 chance of overpowering the stank... so if you do 3 wounds they'll normally only try for 3 steam points (or 2 steam points if you do 4W). So thats knocked the stank down to 2/5 or 3/5 effectiveness... plus then it'll start to rack up wounds on itself, fast becoming suicidal.
With the aim of doing a handful of wounds onto the stank most armies can combine auto-wound weapons with a potion of strength to charge in, cause lots of wounds and have a decent armour mod from the extra strength. If your lord is in a decent sized unit of chaff (cheapest stuff armound) then the reduced number of impact attacks shouldn't kill his unit too fast (and with his Ld he should stay there).. you are then forcing quite a few saves from teh tank each turn so should be taking about 1 wound a turn. So, do ~3 wounds when you charge.. then do 1 a turn and the steam tank should only really get 1 decent set of impact hits on you before its taken so many wounds as to need luck to get any steam points (at 5W its only 50-50 on managing to get 2 steam points... and 2D3 impact hits probably wont be enough to kill a rank).


As for chaos knights- NOOOOOooooo, keep them well clear of the steam tank. Marauders are the way to go for counter-units, preferably with great weapons and frenzy (ignore terror and extra attacks). Get into th flank and you can have upto 18 S5 attacks (could go 24 with hoard... but steadfast is more important). You should still only be doing 1W a turn... but get a little lucky and you'll take enough to start knackering its effectiveness (and if nothing else you have your cheapest unit holding it up)... you could then have a lord in there to try to up the damage or put in festus to reduce the damage you'll be taking.
3 ranks, banner and 1 wound a turn means that the stank would need an average of 3 steam points to draw... throw in festus and it'll take 5 to beat you, and losing 5-6 marauders a turn is next to nothing. ANy magic that makes the steam tank have a worse save (either -vs to it, or +vs strength to the marauders) will help.

Im not sure how poison works against WS0 enemies... the rules say all attacks hit automatically, but it doesnt say you dont roll to hit. So Im wondering if you would roll the 'to hit' dice, with them all automatically passing but with 6s being poisoned. Opinions?
 

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If you don't roll to hit, you can't poison the enemy.
Well yes, thats certainly true... but not really the question that I asked.

You must roll 'to hit' dice in order to get a poison hit... but I can't see anywhere where the rulebook says that hitting automatically means you dont roll the dice. Sure there is no point to do so as all results from 1-6 hit, and therefore we skip the useless roles... but with poison it does matter and I cannot see any reason why they dont get the roll anyway. Its like the old re-roll success and failed dice... technically you have to roll the dice, pick them all up and roll them again, we usually just skip the first round because it has no effect.

I know this might sound like a stretch... but that's just bias kicking in. There is no fluff reason why having an opponent (thats vulnerable to poison) not dodging your attacks would mean that they dont get poisoned... and as far as I can see there is no rulebook reason either (other then history).
I would also point out that since I play armies that have no WS0 and no poisoned attacks I am about as neutral as it gets...
 

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bloodcurdling roar should do well, especially on a disc with a 4++ standard (3++ with MoT) since you will be getting close and will likely be getting a cannon to the head. Im actually kinda jealous.. its better then by ogre counter :p

VC dont need to worry about stanks, they can just tarpit it. Zombies are the best anti-stank unit in the game simply becaus ethey are so cheap (or free). A stank will usually kill pretty much the same number of enemies no matter what its fighting... so a ~20pt WOC, 15pt elf or 0pt zombie will all die equally easily... but the zombies lose you nothing. Hell the only thing comparable to zombies would be skaven slaves or gnoblars... but either way they need a general and probably a bsb close by.. while zombies just dont care.
 

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Am I right to think that the steam tank must try to generate at least 1 steam point a turn? I so then by the time you take it down to 3W left it's almost certain to kill itself (assuming there is enough of the game left).

@effigy- put down the lighter... flaming opponents online is bad enough, doing it in person is just rude.
 

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Nah it can opt to not generate any steam. But then it just sits and does nothing. Basically your safe steam points are Current wounds - 6. Once you're down to half wounds the most you can possibly generate is 4 and so on.

Once you can hurt it then it starts to lose functionality very quickly indeed.



Aramoro
Aw nuts, I was hoping that if I did half the job it would do the other half for me :(
I think it'll be pretty rare to find an army capable of taking 10 T6 1+AS wounds in the space of 5-7 turns (purple sunning the stank doesnt take wounds)... if it still had the magical protection this thing would be the safest VP in the game by a huge margin. It probably keeps that title even with the huge vulnerability to magic.
 

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If nothing else you can always just try a crack's call (or however its spelt) or a quick skitterleap and orb it.
 
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