[stormshroud]

Quick question, after a couple of games last night myself a a couple of friends are thinking we are losing the plot (more so than we already had), so...

Can a skimmer pop-up from behind cover to fire, doing so makes the skimmer vulnerable to return fire in his opponents turn. True or False?

If it is true can someone point out the page reference? If false then it must be an old rule that we dragged with us from 2nd Edition.

 

[wolf.]

it cant really "pop up"
skimmers float above the cover at all times, and it ignores difficult terrain.
im using the battle for macragge mini rule book, and its in the vehicles section
so, to answer your questions, yes, it can be shot if seen, because its above cover?
or am i confused about your question..

 

[stormshroud]

You might be, probably my bad wording. Let me try an example...

Eldar Vyper moves behind a piece of woodland terrain, in the shooting phase the player decides he wants to fire at enemy unit X on the other side of the wood. Can he elect to be above the wood and thus fire over it without penalty? In doing so he is a valid target in his opponents turn despite being on the far side of area terrain.

Hopefully that makes more sense.

I have a growing feeling that we have dragged this through from 2nd Ed?!?

 

[anathema]

No chance. If it can't see the target unit at the start of the shooting phase, it can't hit it. Pop-up attacks were in 2nd Ed. I think but nothing exists in the rules to allow it now.

 

[stormshroud]

Thanks anathema, I had a growing feeling that we had inadvertently brought it with us from 2nd Ed, it was definiately allowed back then.

A follow on question. If a skimmer ends its move in area terrain itis considered to be flying above it, correct? If so can it then fire out even if the model is deeper than 6" into the cover?

 

[Someguy]

The rule that causes confusion is that skimmers are able to fly above terrain. If a skimmer ends its move in a piece of terrain it can choose to be above that piece of terrain. In this case you ignore that terrain piece (not any other terrain) when drawing LOS to and from the skimmer.

A vyper can't pop up from behind a wood to shoot something on the other side but it can end its move above the wood and shoot in any direction - and expect to be shot back.

 

[anathema]

it can choose to be above that piece of terrain.

Nope, it has to be above the terrain. Skimmers cannot enter terrain ever unless they are Tau vehicles with Sensor Spines.

 

[O'sharan]

Thats right.
SO to shoot something on the other side of the wood you will have to fly up on top and count as skimming over.

 

[Jezlad]

2nd edition... :so_happy:


Pop up attacks, overwatch, being able to shield your hive tyrant with a carnifex... awesome.

 

[stormshroud]

Thanks all. Your confirmation of my sanity and understanding is much appreciated.

 

[Elchimpster]

Are you sure? I thought a skimmer could choose to end movement either above (can shoot and be shot) or in terrain like infantry (in which case it makes a test, which if failed means it wrecks). Is this old data filling up my noggin?

 

[anathema]

In short, yesk:

 

[thomas2]

Jetbikes can go above or through, not skimmers.

 

[Bishop120]

Trial Vehicle Rules... End of 3rd Edition had that.. not so for 4th Ed.. as it sits they may only be "hovering over" terrain and the debate is still ongoing as to what effect that has on skimmer transports.

Hovering over terrain means they are not affected by the terrain in any way but may not be considered as obscurred or in cover while in the terrain piece but they are still obscured if they are behind it.

 

[QuietEarth]

I believe skimmers can choose to move through cover and make a difficult terrain test or hover over it. However, this may be with the Landing Gear option in the Tau Empire Codex. If someone who has it can check . . .

 

[squadiee]

yea, its sensor spines in the Tau codex. You can hide behind the object and not shoot, or technically rise above it and shoot over it, but you can never be in it!

 

[QuietEarth]

Well, I know if you Tank Shock a unit in cover you have to make a difficult terrain test.

 

[chromedog]

Skimmer pop-ups were 2nd ed, but it had overwatch as well.

Eldar had the ability to zip from cover to cover and shoot while in the open with the Crystal Targeting Matrix option (in essence, giving them a pop-up) but this was scrapped in the 4th ed codex.

 

[wolf.]

it all depends on where the skimmer is.
ill double check the rules later, cuz currently im at school

 

[anathema]

Well, I know if you Tank Shock a unit in cover you have to make a difficult terrain test.

Bonkers as it sounds you actually don't. It goes something like this:

Skimmers never enter terrain so therefore never take dangerous terrain tests ever (Sensor spines being the exception).

Skimmer tanks may tank shock as normal following the tank shock rules.

Therefore skimmer tanks may tank shock units in cover without taking a dangerous terrain test.

Yes its stupid and hopefully will be fixed in some way in 5th ed but its still correct as the rules stand.