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Discussion Starter #1
Everybody has the right to their opinion (believe that a certain judgement is valid, true).

However, some judgements are more appropriate than others.
Therefore, some opinion are greater than others.

We must respect an other person's right to have an opinion, even a lesser one.
However, the fact that a person have the right to have an opinion is irrelevant when evaluating the opinion itself : opinion have to be evaluated on their own merits.

Therefore, even if we must respect everybody and all of their right, we do not have to respect lesser opinions. Discuss.
 

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You don't have to respect opinions if they fly in the face of facts. The flat earth believers are an example of this.

Otherwise every opinion counts.
 

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Therefore, some opinion are greater than others.
I disagree with this statement, no-one's opinion is superior or inferior to another person's opinion. Someone's opinion maybe respected more, but still that doesn't make it superior.

Similarly an opinion may be formed by someone more qualified to form that opinion, such as Stephen Hawkings opinion on how stars are formed, but that doesn't make it more superior, or possibly inferior, to my opinion on how stars are formed.
 

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I disagree with this statement, no-one's opinion is superior or inferior to another person's opinion. Someone's opinion maybe respected more, but still that doesn't make it superior.

Similarly an opinion may be formed by someone more qualified to form that opinion, such as Stephen Hawkings opinion on how stars are formed, but that doesn't make it more superior, or possibly inferior, to my opinion on how stars are formed.
If your opinion on how stars are formed is some half-baked idea of a giant carpet with lights pinned to it and stephen hawking's "opinion" is formulated through evidence and solid reasoning then his opinion is more valid than yours.

in other words, an opinion is superior to another opinion if it is based off more facts or observations.
 

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You don't have to respect opinions if they fly in the face of facts. The flat earth believers are an example of this.

Otherwise every opinion counts.
But facts can often be distorted or misinterpreted. Some facts can seem to contradict, and some can be commonly held fabrications.

To say you have to respect opinions as long as they don't fly in the face of facts, is an opinion - based on your perspective. It doesn't mean they are more or less valid than everyone elses, because ultimately you can argue all opinions are based to some degree on facts. Of course it doesn't help that we don't have the 'full picture' so to speak, we are not omniscient - therefore I would say all opinions (if they are truthfully believed by the individual) have to be respected. You may know almost certainly that someone's opinion is wrong, but that doesn't mean you should just disregard it, it may be an interesting lesson to learn how and why they concluded with that opinion.
 

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If your opinion on how stars are formed is some half-baked idea of a giant carpet with lights pinned to it and stephen hawking's "opinion" is formulated through evidence and solid reasoning then his opinion is more valid than yours.

in other words, an opinion is superior to another opinion if it is based off more facts or observations.
Evidence on how stars are formed, this i would like to see:grin:

But regardless of how much evidence he uses his opinion isn't superior, it would be more valid but not superior. Opinons are like immature facts, eventually some opinions will mature into facts (such as the opinion that the earth was round, now it has grown into a fact) others will not. Saying one opinion is inferior is like saying a fact is inferior to another.
 

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But facts can often be distorted or misinterpreted. Some facts can seem to contradict, and some can be commonly held fabrications.

To say you have to respect opinions as long as they don't fly in the face of facts, is an opinion - based on your perspective. It doesn't mean they are more or less valid than everyone elses, because ultimately you can argue all opinions are based to some degree on facts. Of course it doesn't help that we don't have the 'full picture' so to speak, we are not omniscient - therefore I would say all opinions (if they are truthfully believed by the individual) have to be respected. You may know almost certainly that someone's opinion is wrong, but that doesn't mean you should just disregard it, it may be an interesting lesson to learn how and why they concluded with that opinion.
Continuing on with the Flat earthers then what "facts" do they have on their side that support their position?
 

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Continuing on with the Flat earthers then what "facts" do they have on their side that support their position?
Of course it doesn't help that we don't have the 'full picture' so to speak, we are not omniscient - therefore I would say all opinions (if they are truthfully believed by the individual) have to be respected. You may know almost certainly that someone's opinion is wrong, but that doesn't mean you should just disregard it, it may be an interesting lesson to learn how and why they concluded with that opinion.
I reiterate what I said before (as quoted above).

However as for your question, people percieved the world as flat because of their personal experiance of the facts. They were stood upright on seemingly flat ground, there was no evidence (at the time) to suggest anything other than the world being flat.

Heck, if we didn't know the Earth was a globe (if we were brought up in and lived in a jungle for example) - would we automatically assume the world was round? No. We would think it was flat (if we gave it any conscious thought at all) because based on our experiance of the facts that would seem like the logical conclusion.

But as I said: "You may know almost certainly that someone's opinion is wrong, but that doesn't mean you should just disregard it, it may be an interesting lesson to learn how and why they concluded with that opinion."
 

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This works but it all pertains to the context in which the opinion is spoken, no?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Opinons are like immature facts, eventually some opinions will mature into facts (such as the opinion that the earth was round, now it has grown into a fact) others will not. Saying one opinion is inferior is like saying a fact is inferior to another.
A fact is a judgement on reality. Opinions are just a broader category of judgement.

Some judgements are more insightfull than others, therefore, opinions being judgements, some opinions are better constructed than others.
 

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But facts can often be distorted or misinterpreted. Some facts can seem to contradict, and some can be commonly held fabrications.
This is true.


@ JackJack: How can you rate lesser opinions? If an opinion is not based around a fact, then it is essentially false, but what reduces the merit of an opinion other than this?

eg1: I think India`s society is flawed.

There is no knowledge to support this. India is thriving. To me this opinion is false.

eg2: I think India`s use of a caste system is flawed.

There is a fact here. India uses a caste system. I express my view of it.

eg3: I think India`s caste system is an excellent means of maintaining a balanced society.

Same fact, but a different view.


By what logic is any of these lesser? The first is a genuine false statement formed of ignorance, but the second two are based on the same fact. Do you consider one lesser because of your own view?


And on your original idea of not having to respect opinions if you consider them "lesser." To me that just sounds arrogant. Have a good look around this forum, you will see many examples of what you would call "lesser" opinions. But I respect them simply because they chose to voice (type) said opinion, not because of the merit itself. They deserve to be heard, and not simply belittled for being "lesser."

I respect what you say, despite not often agreeing. Your posts often speak of idealism, something I am not well aquainted with. Yes, we can all see how things should be, but that`s not the way things are. Deal with it.

Sorry to attack you personally (so unprofessional) but this particular view of yours has hit a nerve with me.
 

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A fact is a judgement on reality. Opinions are just a broader category of judgement.
I disagree with this. A "fact" is an objective truth of reality, independent of opinion. It is a fact (not a judgement or opinion) that if I drop a brick while sat at my desk, it will fall towards the ground.

You also haven't narrowed the question enough for people to post meaningful answers.

Do you, for example, mean Moral Relativism, where people are expressing opinions over ethical or intellectual problems, or do you mean Absolute Relativism, where nothing can be held to be "true" so long as some people disagree with it? Do you mean relativism in the workplace (where two different people might have different ideas about how to best accomplish a goal) or relativism in scientific fields (for example string theory or the creation of the universe)?

My opinion: Statements without context are misleading at best, offensive at worst! :)
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Well, it was more about moral relativism. But that was only the title of the thread and was not explicitely mentionned in any post.

Also, the thing with the brick... the knowledge that the brick will fall is an opinion, even if the fact that it will fall is, well, a fact. It's a complex matter, but every human knowledge suppose an opinion.

How could I rate an opinion? Well, Adam Smith did have a point when he said that hard work gives value. An opinion that is worked harder on has more chance to have value than an opinion that was just a toss-up.

Of course, that hard work has to "pay off", just like in every other things.

Some opinion have value because they conform with reality, others have value because they can generate themselves on others judges. Others have value simply because they lead to other opinions of value ("2+2 = 4" is a good exemple of opinion that leads to other opinion of value).

And yes, every mathematical theorem qualifies to be an opinion. Are you saying we have to respect the opinion that 2+2= 3 ? (the opinion, not the person who formulates it, nor his right).

Don't forget we are talking about the respect due to the opinions themselves, I agree we have to respect stupid people, and their right to be stupid, but we do not have to respect stupidity itself.
 

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Don't forget we are talking about the respect due to the opinions themselves, I agree we have to respect stupid people, and their right to be stupid, but we do not have to respect stupidity itself.
If there was no stupidity, there would be no intelligence, because there would be no comparison. How can you say stupidity does not deserve respect?

Don`t get me wrong, I am not an idiot-rights activist, but stupidity has its place in this world, where would the world be without idiots and their stupid opinions?

My answer: The world would be full of people trying to engineer each other`s downfall for their own gain. Idiots keep the intelligent in their place, don`t ever forget that.
 

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I think you're blurring the line between "knowledge" and "opinion" unnecessarily. "Knowledge" is something that can be empirically proven, or has been proven in the past. Example is dropping a brick to demonstrate gravity. "Opinion" is something that is either untested or cannot be subject to empirical testing, for example ethical considerations. Example is "I think the brick is a nice shade of red".
 

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Discussion Starter #16
In fact, we can't draw a line, because a knowledge is supposed to be true. Since we can't know what is true and what is false, we can't know what is knowledge and what is an opinion.
 

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In fact, we can't draw a line, because a knowledge is supposed to be true. Since we can't know what is true and what is false, we can't know what is knowledge and what is an opinion.
You're talking bollocks again.

We can find out what's true and what's false through repeating experiments. Maybe not the high and mighty aboslute truths you look for but it's the best you're going to get.
 

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In fact, we can't draw a line, because a knowledge is supposed to be true. Since we can't know what is true and what is false, we can't know what is knowledge and what is an opinion.
Descartes Rock has a lovely view, but I wouldn't like to live there. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #20
You're talking bollocks again.

We can find out what's true and what's false through repeating experiments. Maybe not the high and mighty aboslute truths you look for but it's the best you're going to get.
This is how we make the difference between knowledge and opinion today. However, as we cannot garantee that it is the best way to do it, we can't say that what we "know" is knowledge instead of fact.

Condisder this : In the past, "God exist and He shaped the world" was considered a knowledge. Today, it is considered an opinion, that never should have been a knowledge in the first place.

In the near future, how many of today's knowledge will be considered opinion? Opinion that never should have been considered knowledge in the first place? I say a great many.
 
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