[Tom_Peanut]

Hi everyone just a quick question. Can a character use a Magic Lance in a turn it did not charge?

8th ed rulebook says always use a magic weapon over mundane but the lance rules say only use on the charge, then the Bretonnian armybook says characters using magic lances use them in subsequent rounds. :scratchhead:

My thoughts are that you can but you do not gain the additional strength for charging and any other effects the lance may have the require charging. This came up as my friend wants to use the Dreadlance on his Vampire lord and was wondering if he always auto hit (though at str 5 if he didnt charge) or if it was just the turn he charges.

Cheers for any responses

 

[Vaz]

Just checked the BRB, Bretonnia and the Bretonnia FAQ, and it seems that as it's not been changed, RAW, BRETONNIAN ONLY Magic Lances can be used granting +2 in all phases.

However, it would lose you Sportsmanship, and most likely an opponent, so it's best to play it with just the +2 on the charge.

On the other hand, Magic Lances for other factions only benefit the charge, at which point they switch to their Hand Weapon.

 

[Masked Jackal]

Note that there is quite some debate about the Dark Elf item Deathpiercer, which states that it just gives the Killing Blow rule, but doesn't specify charges. These arguments tend to go in-line with what you've stated, and a clear consensus hasn't been reached.

 

[Vaz]

I don't have the book to hand, but it states that lances switch to Hand Weapon. If it states it's a Lance with the Deathpiercer rule, then it grants KB on the charge. If it states it's a Lance, and grants the Bearer Killing Blow, then it grants NB even with the HW.

 

[Cheese meister]

from the wording on magic weapons i wouyld say you always use the magic weapon

 

[maddermax]

I don't have the book to hand, but it states that lances switch to Hand Weapon. If it states it's a Lance with the Deathpiercer rule, then it grants KB on the charge. If it states it's a Lance, and grants the Bearer Killing Blow, then it grants NB even with the HW.

I've had this come up before.
Magical weapons = always use, cannot switch to another weapon.
Lances = Always switch to hand weapon.

So, there is no answer, except for Bretonnians who always use the lance of course, due to their special rule. Meanwhile, while I agree with you on the +2 in all phases by RAW, but you'll note that Bretonnian magical Lances all specify "+2 str. on the charge" only.

 

[unixknight]

I know this has been said but I'm gonna summarize and then ask a question of my own. (And forgive me for not being able to look it up right this minute, my books are at home and I'm at the office.)

The Bretonnia Army book specifies that a character will always use a lance (if equipped) when charging, whether magical or otherwise. In subsequent rounds he will switch to a non-lance weapon UNLESS the lance is magical, in which case he will continue to use it.

However, I'm not aware of any RAW stating that the +2 S bonus applies in subsequent rounds.

 

[Putch.]

Its because Brets are old, and some of the wording is a bit muggy, but all the Bret magic weapons do say +2 str on the charge

 

[unixknight]

Its because Brets are old, and some of the wording is a bit muggy, but all the Bret magic weapons do say +2 str on the charge

Right. They specifically say that because he Bretonnia book came out before the "Lance" special rule formally came into use.

 

[Vaz]

I can't find my 6th Edition Book, but if it stated that after the charge you changed to your Hand Weapon, then that would also mean that without the Caveat in the Breton Magic Item list, for example, the Wyrmlance would only have Flaming Attacks on the charge in addition to +2 strength.

The rule was streamlined were a Lance was a 1 Handed Weapon Granting +2 Strength. However, there was an asterisk which denoted an extra special rule, stating that the Lance would be dropped in subsequent rounds, using the HW instead.

This would mean that in conjunction with the Breton Special Rule, if weapons such as Silver Lance of the Blessed were "Lances", your Lord would now be auto hitting at S6, rather than what it currently is - autohitting at S4, going up to S6 if it charges.

 

[Aramoro]

If they were 'Lances' you would be S8 on the charge as they all give you +2 Strength when you charge which would be in addition to the Lance rule, scary.

Aramoro

 

[Cheese meister]

it does say you only get +2 strength when u charge in the brb the question is do you get the benefits of the weapon otherwise

 

[Aramoro]

Yes because the Bretonian Army book says they continue to use the Lance after the first round of combat.

Aramoro

 

[Cheese meister]

brets are not the only army with magic lances though

 

[maddermax]

brets are not the only army with magic lances though

Indeed, though my answer on the first page is relevant here. There is no answer. One rule says "always use magical weapon", the lance rule say you "must change to hand weapon" after the charge. A magic lance is bound by both rules, and so, until GW gets off their asses and does something, it will remain unanswered.

Best bet is to play it like it was in 7th - use the magical lance all the time. Why they bothered changing the lance rule, of all things, I don't know.

 

[Vaz]

Big plans baby. Big Big Plans.