[Jonny B]

Hi all, I am after a list or 3 that I can stick to that will cope with many different armies when playing at my club. I'm the sort of person that is ok at writing lists but I dont get a massive amount of joy from it and due to my inexperience they usually end up rather unbalanced. I'm normally rushing when writing a list too due to being rather busy with work and the kids.

I mostly play Nids, Dark Angels, Eldar, Grey Knights, Orks, Blood Angels, The other knights (can't remember exactly)

Lists can be battle forged or Unbound.

I have a lot of, if not most models out of the codex, a few tanks and 1 Drake. I also have the black legion codex. I can proxy most stuff too as my clubs ok with that. Be'lakor, Cypher and helbrute dataslates, too.

Anyway, please feel free to throw in a few ideas. The last list someone wrote for me I used in a tournament and I just got better and better with it and ended up beating quite a few old schoolers thanks neferhet!

 

[dragonkingofthestars]

2.000 points, many different army's, one list.

mate, you ask for the philosophers stone, it can't be done.

blob guard and armored guard are different beasts and the weapons you need to fight are so radicly different from the other that if you brought a balanced all comers list to fight both extreme's, you lascannons can't kill enough guard, or your hell drake just annoys a lemen russ. it's what makes these lists so dangerous, not the units, but the number of units that overwhelms there counter .

this has only tripled now that a list can go unbounds and bring nothing but, say tanks. in such a case a 'inbetweeny' army list would find maybe half it's fire power worthless as bolters just tickle the tanks.

now is this a bad thing? pends on your perspective, I'm neutral on the subject, but then again I'm guilty of scribbling out army lists at the last moment since are gaming group often has no idea how many tables were need to play on and the point level of the tables due to the number of people until the last moment, that said I can see the issue.

sorry mate, I just don't see how you can make a all comer list even against even one codex, more then one? nope. just can't be done.

now to be constrictive,

build bunch of lists and reuse them. you opponent today a space marine tread head? break out your armor cracking list, guy breaking out a tyranid swarm? pull out the blast weapons, death wing? Plasma for every one!

now, this might be a bit unsporting, but frankly with the now sheer amount of options unbound gives (for example space marines alone can go Mech, foot, hybrid, death wing, jump assault, flying circus, bike rush, and maybe something else I'm forgetting, Command squad spam?) I don't see much other choice.

 

[Xabre]

The only thing I can suggest is to take models that have options. For instance, maybe take some squads of Noise Marine 'Havoc's, since you can field some Sonic Blasters and Blastmasters together, and with their varying weapon frequencies, the guns can do double duty. You can also take a bunch of Obliterators, because their weapons will always be helpful.

The other option is to just say 'frak everyone else' and make the army list YOU want. My main army right now is 2000 points of Thousand Sons. Yes, I have about 3k worth of models and units, but I have a 'primary line' that I keep for my own preferences and tastes, and you just use it. Let other people adapt to you, instead of you to them. For instance; I hate worrying about heavy armor in my lists, and so if my opponent breaks out a ton of Lascannons, I can smile and watch them bitch that each shot is wasted on a single Rubric Marine.

 

[Jonny B]

Cheers guys, a few thoughts for me to ponder on there. I suppose I will develop better list writing skills in time. I may sod everyone else and design a list to take against each of my opponents.

 

[whittsy]

Put up a list that you like and post it on here and ask for feedback. Its a great way of learning whats good and whats not!

 

[Jonny B]

Ok, suppose I should have done that in the first place. This is the list I used against Imperial and Grey Knights. I knew he was bringing a super heavy (forget what its called but it was big) And I also knew he would have plenty of psychic dice to use.

Ahriman
Be'lakor

Juggerlord of Khorne AoBF and 5 bikers with MON and 2 meltas

Lord with the Nurgle steed and eye of night manning the lascannon after shooting the eye of night

Bastion and lascannon

3 obliterators in the bastion

Helcult formation
Helcult formation

1 spawn
1 heldrake

I didn't go too well as I made a mistake deploying be'lakor and his supper heavy destroyed my bastion and its occupants. First time I'd used the helcult formations so will do better with them next time.

 

[neferhet]

I'm going for the madness:

Terminator Sorceror
3 ML
Force Sword
Spell familiar
(175)

Terminator Sorceror
3 ML
Force Sword
Spell familiar
(175)

Abaddon

4 Terminators
3 combimelta
champ. with fist + claw
(156)

Heldrake / baleflamer

5 Nurgle Spawns
(180)

9 units of 1 Obliterator (630)

5 noise marines
blastmaster
(125)

5 noise marines
blastmaster
(125)

-2001- Unbound

Sorcs go all telepathy (and hope to get invis)
Terminators + abby + sorcerors fucking deepstrike together and act as a boo-boo unit, blessed with invisibility.

Noise marines and 9 single obliterators pepper the enemy with blasts and lascannons. having 9 oblits means that a couple could be used in deepstrike to fry any superheavy.
Spawns gurgle and act as a fire magnet or disrupt the enmy.
Mad and funny list, i hope.

You could also be more "sane" and go for the spamming route:

18 units of 1 obliterator (1260)

3 units of 5 noise marines + blastmaster & meltabombs (390)

Heldrake/baleflamer (170)

Nurgle Daemon Prince, wings, Cursed Mace (245)

-1995-

Just me being silly uke:

 

[Jonny B]

Cheers Neferhet. 9 or even 18 Obliterators may be a problem. I can proxy but I don't have enough terminators; can always design a raised base to sit my marines on! Never used a sorcerer before so may give that a bash.

What does the spell familiar give us in 7th?

 

[neferhet]

lol pbliterator spam is a stupid thing though:biggrin:
in 7th ed i strongly suggest unmarked sorcerors: they rock.
familiar gives the sorc the ability to reroll all of his warp dices cast to get success in order to launch a power basically making them the most powerful sorcerors of wh40k.

also, don't overlook the nurgle dp. he is a beast, now that FMC don't need to zoom to get the jink save.
about the list, i suggest to scroll the list section: you will find a dozen of lists suitable for your needs
cheers

 

[mayegelt]

in 7th ed i strongly suggest unmarked sorcerors: they rock.
familiar gives the sorc the ability to reroll all of his warp dices cast to get success in order to launch a power basically making them the most powerful sorcerors of wh40k.

Spell Familiars are insanely good. The normal chance to cast is here, but in Red is the chance to cast with a spell familiar.

Chance of successful cast for a 1 Warp Charge spell:

1d6: 50% 75%
2d6: 75% 93.75%
3d6: 87.5% 98.4%
4d6: 93.75% 99.6%
5d6: 96.88% 99.9%
6d6: 98.44% 99.9%

Casting with 1 dice now becomes viable, casting on 2 seems to be almost guaranteed.

Chance of successful cast for a 2 Warp Charge spell:

2d6: 25% 43.75%
3d6: 50% 75%
4d6: 68.75% 90.2%
5d6: 81.25% 96.4%
6d6: 89.06% 98.8%
7d6: 93.75% 99.6%
8d6: 96.48% 99.8%

Casting with 3 dice now becomes viable, casting on 4 seems to be almost guaranteed.

Chance of successful cast for a 3 Warp Charge spell:

3d6: 12.50% 23.4%
4d6: 31.25% 52.7%
5d6: 50.00% 75%
6d6: 65.63% 88.1%
7d6: 77.34% 94.8%
8d6: 85.55% 97.9%
9d6: 91.02% 99.1%

Casting with 4 dice now becomes almost the same as without using 5 (normally considered good), and 5 is better than 6 (normally considered viable), casting on 6 seems to be almost guaranteed.

---------

A lot of stuff it is about finding what you have and finding out where your weaknesses are and try to prevent them.
Personally I love Maulerfiends running along side bikers and chaos spawns. Also if unbound things like Hounds of Khorne from Daemons are nice and cheep and normally a bit of a threat.

 

[whittsy]

18 units of 1 obliterator (1260)

3 units of 5 noise marines + blastmaster & meltabombs (390)

Heldrake/baleflamer (170)

Nurgle Daemon Prince, wings, Cursed Mace (245)

-1995-

18 units of 1 obliterator

what the fuck is wrong with you?! This is insane....

In other news, i'm off to buy about 12 boxes of obliterators...

 

[neferhet]

Welcome to the unbound realm. Don't forget the nurgle prince spam topped with heldrake sauce.
And would you feel bad if you could do this:
15 units of 1 obliterator
4 units of 5 noise marines w/blastmaster
(then, from Iron Hands Space Marines)
1 ironclad dreadnough in drop pod
1 dreadnought in drop pod
1 dreadnought in drop pod
-1995 pts- who care about the 12" deployment and 6" untrust zone. chaos stand back and slowly advances spurting tonzillions of shotsh while the drops wreack havok in the midst of the enemy.

 

[whittsy]

15 units of 1 obliterator
4 units of 5 noise marines w/blastmaster
(then, from Iron Hands Space Marines)
1 ironclad dreadnough in drop pod
1 dreadnought in drop pod
1 dreadnought in drop pod

You should start a thread for unbound army lists. I could sit here and eat a whole bowl of popcorn while I read them.

 

[dragonkingofthestars]

rule zero with unbound army's, don't be a dick.

I'll play all oblerators, that sounds like fun.

but I won't play 18 squads of one obliterator given that each of my squads can only kill one of those guys a turn, while you have all the firepower of the whole thing. that is unfair, cheesy and I'll take my army and go else where.

 

[neferhet]

You should start a thread for unbound army lists. I could sit here and eat a whole bowl of popcorn while I read them.

I am right now starting the "Unbound & Popcorn " thread.

Also @dragonkingofthestars of course i'll never be a total dick. i'm just making fun of the new unbound madness taken too far. Besides, i'd be very disappointed if someone just walks away from a game bacause i bring a dickish list, for once, just for fun. Once in awhile wouldn't be fun to just throw a dicklist at your opponent? i'd even be ok with list swapping. I'd say that you should walk away from that guy that ALWAYS bring a cheese fest list. (on a side not, do you walk away from Taudar, wave serpent spam, sit-and-shoot tau gunlines or triple wraithknight lists? for me those are the true dick lists: they are not even fun nor stupid. just a bick dick covered in cheese...)

 

[dragonkingofthestars]

I am right now starting the "Unbound & Popcorn " thread.

Also @dragonkingofthestars of course i'll never be a total dick. i'm just making fun of the new unbound madness taken too far. Besides, i'd be very disappointed if someone just walks away from a game bacause i bring a dickish list, for once, just for fun. Once in awhile wouldn't be fun to just throw a dicklist at your opponent? i'd even be ok with list swapping. I'd say that you should walk away from that guy that ALWAYS bring a cheese fest list. (on a side not, do you walk away from Taudar, wave serpent spam, sit-and-shoot tau gunlines or triple wraithknight lists? for me those are the true dick lists: they are not even fun nor stupid. just a bick dick covered in cheese...)

wouldn't know, no one in are group plays elder or those type of tau.

Maybe I'm just a bit bitter and a bit trigger happy with my walkout, (or what I said I would walk out on, i'd give any list a try at least once) since at the tail end of 6th (back when monster characters could joins squads) I faced a tau-farsight death star that stuck two riptides, the farsight character riptide, farsight himself and another battle suit commander with a mess of signature systems.

so too recap, ignored cover, twinlinking, tank hunter, split fire. . .somehow,2+ armor, one with 3+invul tanking my psi screams, shield drones, and hit and run, on two riptides when I had no bloody idea what was coming. did I mention I'm a green horn? oh and it was kill point.

that game lasted three turns maybe, likely less, and I did not inflict a single wound on ANY model in that army.

I refuse to play against a list that I have no hope in heaven of beating. a reasonable chance, yes, let me know you want to try that and i'll build something to beat it, even if the plan is just 'sacrifice something to melee for three turns and kill the rest of the army, it's still a plan. but bring something that is literally impossible for me to beat, and I won't play it.

only thing I've seen in that category (Thankfully, i'd hate to do a walk out in real life) is that farsight death star thing, strength9, ignore cover, tank hunting, AP2 large blast? when between the entire gameing group we don't even have the models for me to beg or barrow enough land raiders to try and stop that thing? NO.

this is a game, we both in it to have fun, bring a list that is unfun to play against and I'll play that list as little as possible (not YOU I'll play you all the time)unless I have time to prep against it, then "ere we go!" with a no hold bars fight. but that is an exception, and I don't want to play against a army list (cavet: unless I'm playing an army where this is normal like nids) that just forces me to remove entire units in one turn with no way for me to respond, and that is key, the Reponses.

if I mess up and you remove a whole unit? my fault.

if I unlucky and you remove a whole unit? lady luck why have you forsaken me!

If it is mathematically impossible to prevent you from destroying me, with no way I can respond? only then, do I put my foot down, and that only after I get bit once from it, but in the future expect me to get twice shy about that list.