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Discussion Starter #1
in the place i play the top three armies are in order, eldar, tau, and tyranids. i can handle the nids well enough on my limited army, but the tau and eldar prove extremely trouble some. i have yet to beat any of these three players, but have come close agenst tyranids. i cannot scractch the skimmer heavy lists of either tau or eldar. unfortunatly i notice a large trend in that if they get first turn, around half my army goes down before use and their many skimmers become neigh untouchable, all i have to ask is wtf? how does chaos beat this blattent abuse of the skimmer rule?

i have in my possession:

1 chaos terminator lord,
12 khorne berzerkers,
7 plague marines,
8 chaos space marines,
3 bikers,
2 rhinos,
1 land raider,
1 nurgle daemon prince,
and 10 daemonettes.

i understand that this is limited and come tax return's i aim to rectify this with many additions. is it possible to win with this list however? or am i SoL.
 

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As I see it you've got a severe shortage of ranged anti-tank weaponry. Your CSM squad and your land raider is basically it and the land raider probably gets shot to hell by lance weapons and railguns before it has a chance to do much. I'd say that you are a little SOL with what you've got. Obliterators seem like they'd help a lot (against open-topped vypers they can get 2 hits from 1 plasma cannon shot).
 

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Discussion Starter #3
well ironically enough i do manage to kill some of the eldar things, of that army the wraithlords, wraith gaurds, and falcons are the most difficult for me to handle. honestly its tha tau i can't touch..i have yet to do more then get lucky and kill 1 or 2 fire warriors. the tau player is suit and tank heavy, running three hammer heads, a bunch of crisis suits, a broadside team and limited foot soldiers. i'm at a loss. in my next order i will have a 2nd landraider, 3 obliterators, 10 terminaters, 10 possessed, a havoc squad, another 3 man bike squad, a raptor squad, another Daemon prince,2 thousand sons squads, and 2 emporer's children squads. the 8 chaos space marines will intergrate with the havocs.. but i do not believe it will help to do much agenst vehicles that can only be glanced agenst.
 

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I concur some obliterators would be severly helpful, but so would a defiler. the defiler would be good since you can hide behind cover from the skimmers and shoot with indirect fire at the skimmers. unfortuneatly this is epensive, but it is the only thing that I can think of that will help you.

Also three hammerheads and 1 broadside team is four HS selections. that is above the limit.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
sounds good, but is there away passed rediculous skimmers? only ever glancing those is too huge of an advantage and BS in my opinion, is this how they really work? that if they move over twelve inches they only ever count as being glanced?
 

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sounds good, but is there away passed rediculous skimmers? only ever glancing those is too huge of an advantage and BS in my opinion, is this how they really work? that if they move over twelve inches they only ever count as being glanced?
If a skimmer moves more than 6" it can only ever be glanced. It's strong to the point of being perhaps overpowered, and is getting a nerf in 5th ed. Throw in holofields and eldar tanks are almost tougher than land raiders. Their one weakness is that their armor is low, so lots of weaker stuff can down them, you just have to throw a lot at them. Any weapons of str 7 or 8 that fires a lot of shots is great, but chaos don't really get those. Most other races have an effective way of getting those kinds of weapons except chaos. For you, you have to load up on obliterators, which are effective against skimmers, but not as much as their point cost suggests. Unless you really have a lot of them, expect to maybe down one of his tanks.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
well that sucks. space marine skimmers aren't so bad, their open topped and 10 armour all around, its the eldar falcons with holo fields and the tau ships that never seem to die. thanks for the advice so far, i guess i just have to wait for 5th cause right now, a skimmer survives a hell of a lot longer then my land raiders do...
 

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well that sucks. space marine skimmers aren't so bad, their open topped and 10 armour all around
Actually SM skimmers aren't open-topped, supposedly because the pilots are wearing power armor. Still, at armor 10, it's not hard to pull together the firepower to down them. Vypers are open-topped, but I don't see many used nowadays.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
i actually had vypers played agenst me this saturday. we played a 3 way meat grinder, tau, chaos, and eldar. the game ended on the begining ot tau's second turn. our eldar and tau player started arguing over rules and it escalated. on that note i took out a wraithlord in one hit. hurray bikers w/ powerfist and involnerable saves.
 

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No terminators? I have an eldar army which i regulay face up against Chaos and a squad of 5 terminators with abbadon (which he never uses just allows him to deepstrike) makes VERY short work of my 2 squads of Dark Reapers and Dire Avengers.

i think you can get Abbabon fairly cheaply and this would make a lot of difference against the Fire Warriors. Don' they have a 5+ armour save? or am i thinking of something else in the Tau Army.
 

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Against Tau, remember. The first half of the game will, and should suck for you. But when you get to thier side, ya should kill em all. And try to get a lord with bloodfeeder on a bike.
 

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Be wary of being complacent against a good tau players, espeically one who is heavily meched up. Just because some of your guys get there doesnt mean you win the game. This may have been the case against the oldschool tau army with its three squads of fw and two bside teams turtling in the corner.

If he knows hes up against chaos you will see a limited number of fw in fishes. Ion/Railheads will follow, and possibly no bsides but loads of crisis. Even ifyou get there theres not a lot to actually attack that cant redploy or isnt in a vehicle. Vespids and kroot will be deployed in place of the fire warriors in order to engage and sacrifice should your bikers/transport troops get too close. A large squad of kroot with hounds should not be underestimated, only a dedicated cc unit would be able to cut through them in time to hunt other things.

thus its important not just to get there, but to get there with a decent fighting force. This means that sometimes its not a good idea just to rush the bikers forward- advance your forces together so that he is forced to make a choice out of many targets.

My advice would be against termie squads in lrs. These are just point sinks asking to be railgunned and entangled. With the new rules, sadly, termies are actually gun platforms now and not cc units, though they do well in that category. the thing is he can move away from you as you advance, so the key would be to ds small sacifical squads of termies maxed out with reapers. ITs cheesy but in my opinion a meched out tau army is too powerful to be beaten with fluff. DS these termies behind the heads and have fun. Alternativley take out his fishes and strand his mobility, making his fw easy meat for your fast units.
 

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All I can say is that against Tau the trick is Use fast assault units that you can get a lot of.
The fact remains that no matter how bad a squad is in meelee chances are a Tau squad of the same points is going to be worse. Except for kroot. I hate kroot.
 
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