Yes if you take tanks in a squadron they have to all fire at the same target.

 

Apart from Heavy choice slots, what are the benefits here? I dont see much reason to take them as a squadron?

 

9 Tanks for heavy support... !!!
thats one hell of a benefit.

But yes, if you are only gonna take 3 tanks from the heavy support options never put them in a squadron The upside is in exceeding the number of tanks other armies get to take, so if your not doing that there is no point in taking the disadvantages.

 

9 Tanks for heavy support... !!!

to your opponent yes, they can destroy most of them by just immobilizing them.
If armoured companies were one of the weakest lists around without squadrons, imagine how they would be now with them

 

Pretty much. I can see bringing a squadron of Punishers-- not because you NEED that many shots, but you know that the single unit you aim that squadron at that turn is going to die, pretty much regardless of what it is. But things with ordinance-- not so much.

 

Sorry if this question has already been asked or answered....

If I have three Leman Russ tanks in a squadron as per the new codex, in the shooting phase, do they have to all target the same enemy?

Just trying to think of it in a real world situation as it is not likely that in a real battle, three tanks would all target the same enemy, more likely that they would spilt there fire up to cause maximum damage to a range of enemies.

Page 64 of the BRB, the vehicle sqn rules are quite well written I think. :shok:

 

Agreed that they are well written, but I cant help but feel they are well written for squadrons of highly mobile machines. It states at the top of page 64 that "However, some small vehicles, like Ork Warbuggies and Eldar Vypers, operate in units of more than one vehicle, known as squadrons." I think that says it all, the intended use of the squadrons rule was for "small vehicles".

Take for instance the rule in the squadrons that allows you a line of sight through a vehicle in the squadron. It states that this is because the vehicles are well practised, but a Leman Russ is classed as a lumbering behemoth. Hardly highly mobile and able to move in and out of each other in a shooting phase?



I think now that Leman Russ tanks can shoot all there weapons if they do not move that they should be treated more like the Bane Blades that can pick there targets. There is one section of the new codex that says that inside a Leman Russ, it is so noisy that all you can hear is the sound of gun fire. If that is the case, how would they coordinate a squadron of three Leman Russ tanks firing all there weapons at the same target. More likely that they would shoot what ever they can see through there windows.

I like the idea of a squadron, just wish they could pick out more targets.

 

Depends on what your purpose is. Several benefits to a squadron:

Majority Cover. Do a 2 tank squadron, have the 2nd tank sit in a ruin, and the first maneuver around it to get better shots, still 50% in cover, both get a cover save.

Spreading Fire: Fire spreads across the squadron. This is a mixed blessing. You won't take the 3 pens on one vehicle, but could lose the entire squadron to one round's good shooting.

 

Yeah, the shooting the same unit might not make a whole lotta sense (but then it doesnt for a unit where half can see 1 unit on the right and the other half could see a unit in the left).
As for teh being able to draw line of sight through members of the same unit I would say thats down to small scale positioning and unit formation drills and the like that just arent apparent from the god's eye view that we all take (yes your models come alive and move outta each others way when your not looking).

 

It would seem sensible that they could all fire at different targets as otherwise the mass firepower of three tanks would be wasted on a small unit with few wounds

 

Sure, except it stops sounding so sensible if you were faced by 9 basilisks that could fire at different targets... your army would disappear in the blink of an eye.

 

whats seems sensible and whats 40k's restrictive rules allow you to do are very different things

 

It seems sensible that ten guys with guns could divide their fire between two different enemy units, but they can't.

Squadrons are one unit, they fire as one at the same target.

Really, there are only two advantages to squadding your tanks: 1 is getting more than your FOC would otherwise allow, and the other is because of the squad rules, you basically get a free Extra Armour upgrade.

the disadvcantages are that you have to overkill anything you shoot at because all three must fire at the same target, and all squadded vehicles are destroyed on an immobilized result, making them extremelyvulnerable to anti0tank fire.

Not a great advantage to penalty ratio. Good for AV10 buggies, but not for expensive battle tanks. I suggestno more than 2 tanks per squad, thateay you;re only in danger of losing one of them to lucky glances and you;re not wasting as much firepower.

 

Its good because you can get double the hits on units to wipe them out faster, if you shoot a mob of 30 boys and kill 10, no big deal, but when you fire one unit and kill 20, it changes everything.

However taking more then 2 is not a very smart idea, your just throwing away points.

 

How about three bassies used as an indirect fire barrage? It would be a lot more like real artillery and in game terms the shots all scatter so you might get a great scatter and drop three blast templates that don't overlap but mess up a lot of troops.

 

Check the squadron barrage rules, you scatter the first template as normal, then place the other two templates based on the position of the first so the edges touch. If you roll a "HIT" you put them where you want (as long as it's touching the edge of the first template), otherwise you place it in the direction indicated by the arrow.

 

Also, don't forget that 3 tanks on their own = 3 kill points, 1 squad of 3 = 1 kill point, unless I missed something.

 

No, you got it right, but it's also a lot easier to kill 3 tanks in a squad than it is to kill 3 on their own.

One round of assault with krak grenades and you're absolutely fucked. All they have to do is get into contact with one of your tanks and they're all taking rear armour hits and dying on immobs. Obviously you always want to keep tanks out of CC, but squadrons moreso

 

There is one benefit to squadrons, which is that incoming fire takes the armour value of the nearest vehicle they can see. If you have vehicles facing in different directions, it is very difficult to ever hit anything other than armour 14.

Then of course, there's the issue of kill points. 3 leman russ tanks for 1 kp is pretty harsh.

Even so I very much doubt you will see many tank squadrons. The disadvantages do outweigh the benefits in almost all cases.

 

I suppose the only hope for a squad of tanks is if all but 1 die at an eirlier 'I' in that assault phase, leaving a solo vehicle that reverts to non-squad rules?

 

True, but consider the 30 man ork mob/50 man Troops or conscript squad, the 20 man Eldar/Dark Eldar squad. A three wide barrage can ruin the day of that sort of setup. The first shot will get corrected. The 2nd and 3rd will hit 1/3 of the time. A threewide has a good chance of wiping out a big unit quickly. Against vehicles, not so good.