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Discussion Starter #1
I've had this log running for a short while on a couple other forums, but any extra feedback is always useful, especially on a project this big. I've found quite a few exciting logs here, so I figure I'll add my own.

I turned this into a P&M Blog because I hoped it would keep me on track, and it's worked out so far. I'm a very lazy modeler at times. I work full time, I go to school full time. I also had a full time girlfriend who mercifully eliminated herself, and I was, up until recently, still in the Marines as a Reservist. So my free time that isn't spent on sleeping, or homework, or girlfriend maintenance, or the gym, I sometimes have a hard time keeping on track with my project. I don't play a lot of 40K anymore. I was big into the hobby starting in 1993 at the tail end of Rogue Trader, and played a ton of 2nd Edition, and some of 3rd, and then only off and on since then. However, when I was kid, and thus a young, under-funded 40K player, I had always wanted to have my own Battle Company of Marines. Problem was, I had two small Fantasy armies, and three small 40K armies and one big one (and a Necromunda gang, and a Gorkamorka gang...). So I never had the money available to just flat out waste on frivolous, excessive Marines.

Enter the well funded adult gamer version of myself, lol. So, with the help of Ebay and a reclamation of my old figures, I now am now pursuing my dream, lol. However, it would be too easy to just buy 100 Space Marines, some tanks, and such. Any lame average Joe with cash to blow can have 100 Space Marines. Nope, I'm going to convert them all. All of them. Everything in my army will be converted, somehow, no matter how small. The Marines will be easy, since I've adapted some techniques for "Tall Scale" (as I call it) or "biggerizing" Marine figures. I don't like the Terminator Legs versions. If they aren't heavily re-sculpted, the end up looking like Kim Kardashian with a giant ass and a way too small waist. Some people make phenomenal ones, don't get me wrong. Apologist's Ultramarines come to mind. But that's just way too involved for me. And second, it often makes them too big. Space Marines are supposed to be 7-7.5 feet tall. Really just a head taller than normal men, for the most part. Plus, I want to use the standard Mk VII plastics and just fix the proportions.

Very quickly, I decided that my project would address my long standing problems with Space Marine models.
1. They are too short, obviously. Space Marines should be 7-7.5 foot super-soldiers. The GW human figures are probably just too tall, but too late to fix that; gotta make the Marines bigger.
2. They don't have enough ammunition to fight wars. Marines need to be loaded for bear. Look like they could actually fight a war. So all of my figures would have ammunition pouches, grenades, combat knives, etc.
3. All the Marines should have helmets because no good Marine would be without his helmet. It's just dumb. Encased in nearly impenetrable ceramite, only to leave you nugget exposed, and lose all the life support, communications, imaging and targeting enhancements of the helmet? Idiotic.

Also, the Battle Company had to be "Counts As", WYSIWYG for the Standard, Blood Angels, and Space Wolves codex lists.

Plus, being that I was going to convert everything, my last challenge was to only use Mk VII parts, but also ensure that every model had a character of its own. That they weren't just carbon copies of Marines with bolters, but with believable poses. This of course is not going to be easy with a whopping fifty two bolter Marines in a Battle Company, and forcing the majority of them to wear helmets.

So I set to work, with some plastic card, and a dream. A lot of these are old photos of rough prototypes that I didn't fully sand, or gap fill, etc. Excuse any rough early modeling problems. At first, I wasn't sure how tall I wanted them to be. So I went with 1mm extensions to the thighs (which I thought were too short anyway) and an extra .5mm at the waist. The results were decent:



The tall walking stance makes him a bit taller than he actually is, but it was a good start. Next to him are Hasslefree's McKenzie (part of my new Imperial Guard project), a 2E metal Cadian, and Sgt Bylkow (one of of my favorite Squat models).

Decided this wasn't tall enough. So I moved up to 1mm at the waist. This was starting to give the height I wanted, but I only had about 25 or so walking legs, and they aren't cheap on EBay, and well, if they were all walking it would be a bit homogenous. So the firing stance models had to retain height too. Eventually I decided to go with 1.5mm at the waist for a total height increase of 2.5mm.




So now it was time to start working on some individual models.

This guy was posed to be pulling a grenade off of his belt. But instead of using a pre-posed hand, I cut and repositioned one of the bolter support arms, bent the fingers closed around a grenade separated from the grenade bundles.


Bolter Marines:



Arms have all been cut and re-positioned, for two reasons. The standard "hip firing" bolter cradle formed by the arms in stock form looks dumb. And second, I wanted some more dynamic looking poses, not just the more realistic ones.



The metal arm is from an old Devastator sergeant.




Of course, un-drilled barrels was out of the question, so that was rectified. Some of the models have weird poses, but that's because eventually they will all be based. So they may not stand flat on the standard bases.


The Marine on the far right is Brother Givenicus. Eventually he will have a grievous energy weapon style wound that has rendered his left arm useless. I cut all the fingers apart, and bent them to appear limp and useless, and re-positioned the thumb.


Now I needed some special weapons. I present the shortened Assault Pattern flamers and meltaguns:



Some more Marines:

Mid draw. Arm cut and the the fingers bent to be around the grip of the knife.



I have decided that the heavy weapons Marines will have the helmets with the extra targeter mounted on it. Plus, I decided the Tactical Squad Heavy Botlers will have box mags instead of the giant belt fed apparatus. Devastator Squad HB's will have the belt apparatus, but I figured Tactical Squads would need more portable weapons. This is an early version, and I have since modified the box mag to be better looking. Plus, there will be Bolter Marines from the rest of the squads who will be carrying extra heavy weapon ammo (missiles or bolter mag boxes).

This is Brother Brutus. A severely in-progress WIP. I wanted to inflect some more Rogue Trader era brutality to this army. I'm a huge fan of the darker, more brutal Space Marines of the old days. This one needs a ton of work, obviously, but here's the start. The Tau helmet mounted on the shoulder pad came from the Chaos tank sprue, and was clipped and filed down to match the shoulderpad contours. The idea of a mounted helmet came from the multitude of RT era drawings with severed heads. But I didn't want it to be too brutal and cross into Chaos tainted territory. I feel the Chaplain, once he's been modeled up, will be keeping a close eye on Brother Brutus.


The severed head is a Wood Elf sorceress head, the hand is the Grey Knight Daemonette head hand. The Dark Eldar is a classic 3rd Edition warrior that we had piles of from the three 3rd Edition boxed sets we had that nobody ever bothered to assemble. The helmet is a Black Templar helmet with studs, to mix up some of the helmet appearances. Plus, I think it makes Brother Brutus look a bit more harsh and maybe a bit more unbalanced and potentially vicious.

Eventually Brother Brutus's corpse was re-done because people suggested he seemed to be doing some untoward things with his bolter to the dead body, lol.





Part of the feeling I'm trying to evoke with this "army" is that of how I envision the Space Marines. These guys are seven foot, functionally immortal, genetically engineered super warriors. Human, but something more than human, and something a little less. I want to illustrate that they are both completely ruthless towards xenos, but also still fulfilling their role as protectors of humanity. I plan to have not just Marines brutalizing the Eldar corsairs (that way I can utilize both Dark Eldar and regular Eldar) I've decided the Marine Company is fighting, but also abusing Eldar prisoners out of a complete disregard. But I also want to hit on the Marine commitment to humanity. Show them protecting children, or wounded Guardsmen perhaps. I've got a pretty amazing idea for an objective marker that you guys will have to wait for.

Anyhow, I hope this work interests you guys. I'll try to keep this getting updated now that I've committed. Sorry for some of the mold lines I didn't file, lol. Sorry for some of the legs that haven;t been filed smooth and flat where they have been extended A lot of these pictures have been taken in progress over the last couple months, being send to my buddies via email for critique. So they don't all represent the current states of the figs. But, taking new photos is way too much effort right now. But as I go along I'll try to give you guys some ideas where it is at. Right now, my Battle Company is about 40% complete. So you guys should get to see pretty much the entire evolution of it.

Thanks for any thoughts you guys have. Especially any criticisms, ideas you don't like, etc. I'm definitely open for anything constructive or suggestions.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Amusingly enough, this guy started out as a test model, a "proof of concept" so to speak, for a model for my Command Squad. I liked the results so much, he's actually one of my favorite figures so far.



I like the idea of the Auspex, I just hate its clunky model. So I went to work creating this. The process is pretty simple. Cut the bottom of the handle off just below the buttons. Cut the display off just above the buttons. Trim the little antenna do-dads off, and then carefully cut lengthwise to make the display and buttons pieces half as thick. If you're careful doing this, you'll actually be able to use the back sides of both the display and the buttons, glue them together and make a second flip up auspex in the closed position. Now it is just a matter of trimming carefully to fit the auspex on the forearm of the model, and smoothing out the edges of the display with a file. The fist on the arm is from the Grey Knights sprues.

Heavy bolter with a box magazine, as well as his Assistant Gunner carrying spare ammunition:


Have you ever wondered why the bolt pistols don't fit in the holsters that are on the Marine sprues?

The answer is Games Workshop doesn't care. However, the new answer is because they are holding the Horatius Pattern Bolt Sidearm. A defensive weapon, it has a six round magazine, and was named after a legendary Space Marine hero whose troops held a bridge for a day and a night against an onslaught of Orks before reinforcements could arrive.

The Horatius pattern bolt pistol has been sliced down the center, with the inside faces filed down to make the weapon skinnier, the front sight trimmed off, and the magazine shortened. It's not a perfect fit in the holster, but it is close enough for heroic scale work, lol. I still need to decide how to give it a stubby barrel protruding, but I thought you guys might like the new figure.

This Marine has dropped his rifle to transition to his sidearm for immediate threat engagement.


Some detail shots of the weapon itself:


I haven't decided whether or not to put the front sight back on or not. It's perfectly believable it could be flip up. At the same time, the Marines don't actually use the iron sights on these weapons, so hey. The front end of the weapon looks flared in the picture for some reason, but it is not that way in reality.

The right arm is from the gunner arms on the vehicle sprue. I may bend the fingers on the left hand to "wrap" the firing hand better. The post is a close approximation of the traditional isosceles pistol stance, with the offhand wrapped around the front of the firing hand in the push/pull bracing and recoil compensation method.

I decided to reclaim some old metal heavy weapons. Took a solid bath in simple green to strip the paint, and whatever madness I used to paint this guy's weapon way way back in the day was quite stubborn.

But, in the spirit of capturing the feel of Rogue Trader, I bring a 2nd Edition las cannon. Cut the right arm from an assault Marine's bolt pistol, filed and re-positioned it to fit the grip of the old heavy weapons. Then I took the bracing arm from the missile launcher, clipped the hand and rotated it to properly brace the position of the lascannon.

Here he is with his other two Devastator brothers:





The metal lascannon on the right has a nice, weighty feel to it, but damn, is it a pain to glue it together. I had forgotten about that, lol. You get spoiled working with all plastics. Obviously the missile launcher will eventually have something under his foot that he is stepping on.

More Rogue Trader inspiration with some more Marines lugging around trophies. The guy on the left has picked up an exarch's shuriken catapult as a souvenir. Or maybe for heretical use. Who knows? This is Rogue Trader inspired after all. The second guy has mounted the skull from an unspecified Tau Auxiliary from the unit's previous campaign on his shoulderpad. The unfortunate donor was a fantasy Lizardman from the old boxed set I bought at some point and had never used. I filed off any skin detail, removed the eyeballs, and then hollowed out the underside of the mouth.




One of my magnetized Sergeants with a custom combi weapon. The Sergeants will all have heads with upgraded comms (antennas), and be magentized for all kinds of crazy options. I haven't yet gotten my tiny magnets, but they will be included at the belt line for stuff like Meltabombs to be attached.




The flat top to the melta barrel works aesthetically to provide clearance for the bolter barrel. The power source is from a multa bomb cut lengthwise and narrowed. I think i may go back and shave some of the details off of the rifle like the eagle.


The first of my completed Assault Marines:








Nothing terribly exciting about those guys, and they all need finishing touches. I was just glad to have sat down for a while and gotten some more work done. They are spaced 1.5mm at the waist and 1mm at the hips, with a krak grenade as part of their belt kit. I'd love to have krak grenades for all of the Marines in the Company, but they are a lot more rare than the frag grenades that come in every Marine sprue, so more expensive as bits. I've been salvaging them from friends who have Grey Knights and such. But I'd realistically need about 100 of them, haha. All the Marines have been clipped at various joints to create unique poses. Except the running guy. I was actually able to achieve the desired result with stock arms. If you notice the guy with the extended right arm, that's actually been done by taking an extended left arm and cutting it free and swapping the middle section to the right arm, and the reverse for the right arm, so you have a 90 degree left, and extended right, which isn't part of the normal sprue options.
 

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And here is my other madness. I've been wanting to do this for a while, and had to figure out the best way. I'll show him before the commentary.





That's right folks, it's a multi-laser, lol. C.S. Goto was right all along. That, and everyone knows that Marine Special Weapons troopers can have a multi-laser on a roll of 91-00. Duh.

Veteran Brother Anachronus has the honor of carrying the Chapter's prized relic, an ancient (Space Marine) man-portable multi-laser. A weapon no longer in common use amongst the Marines, the multi-laser has been well cared for and passed down from generation to generation of Marines. Large and unwieldy, even for Marine Heavy weapons, ever since its suspensors stopped functioning properly, Veteran Brother Anachronus stays in shape by practicing back flips during the long periods of time between battles.

I will probably treat this as a Counts As Heavy Bolter or Lascannon since Marine-deployable Multi-lasers are probably not coming back after 20 years MIA. But it should make for an entertaining conversation piece. It still needs some work because the right arm had to essentially be constructed from three different arms, and spacered under the shoulder in order to achieve the right angle. The multi-laser itself is from a Sentinel, with the barrel shortened, the under-rail clipped off and a bolter grip inserted, plus the power pack having been cut down and fitted onto the side to look like a removable power pack. As you can see, using .5mm card and creativity, I created a spare power pack on his hip. A third spare will go to an A-Gunner just like the Heavy Bolters have.

The Squat Standard Bearer is there because, well, he's awesome.

So there you go. The Company is about 40% done with assembly I'd say. Minus the closet full of unassembled vehicles, lol. I haven't included any of the assembledvehicles yet, because for the most part, there's nothing terribly special about them yet.

For those curious about the paint scheme, sadly I'm just as picky about that as I am the details of the models. Which is a nice way to say "I haven't been able to decide yet". I've done some test models on old metal figs I won't be able to use for this project, but haven't been 100% on any of them yet.

Thanks for looking.
 

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You have too much time and money! Soon we'll have 6th and when that comes multi lasers will make a return. Fantastic models!
 

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Hmm, this should put you up there with the creators of Angry Marines! Very nice work.

You know what you need? Some Marines just standing around taking a smoke break or chilling out beside the Rhino.
 

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Nice job on the conversion work. Given the extra height you have given the Marines, it def makes them appear and feel more in tone as they should. Well done!

I am very interested in seeing how they look once you start painting them.

Great work so far and keep it up!

Regards,
DoE
 

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Discussion Starter #7
You have too much time and money!
Sadly, I don't have nearly that much time. You're looking at around 6 months of work compiled into three posts, but most of it is recent. I hope to finish by the end of the year with at least putting everything together. But you know who has too much money? Anyone who makes a DKoK army, lol. Now that's financial dedication. I just troll EBay for deals. I'm going to have so many bits left over at the end of the project. I may be selling off like 1000 points worth of leftover Marine parts since I don't use any Mk 6 legs, beakie heads, or non-aquila torsos. Though I did promise to construct a single Mk 6 Marine (gonna have to buy a FW torso I guess, or use the one from my old Space Wolves sprue), complete with rhino horn (bonus points for the people who know what that refers to).

Hmm, this should put you up there with the creators of Angry Marines! Very nice work.

You know what you need? Some Marines just standing around taking a smoke break or chilling out beside the Rhino.
That's high praise indeed. As silly as they are, the Angry Marines make me laugh, every time. Some of my favorite all time conversions are peoples' Angry Marine figures. So much lunacy, so much awesome, and so much so that I'd considered an Assault Marine beating an Eldar Guardian/Corsair to death with its own severed arm. I can only hope that this thread offers that much inspiration and enjoyment as it moves along. As to the second part, that picture is actually one of my oldest 40K memories (after the scratchbuilt gunship/deodorant tank), and I'm fairly sure I'll have some extra Marines lying around at the end of this project for ancillary figures like dismounted vehicle crew and such. I'm sure I'll figure out a way to pay homage to that one. I've been trolling just about every 1st Edition book I have and can get my hands on to get inspiration. Heck, if anybody has a favorite, feel free to post it here or PM it to me and I'll consider if/how I can make it happen. Kil Kil Kil!

Anyhow, thanks guys. Hopefully I can move this along regularly. I've got the parts for another four Assault Marines sitting around awaiting filing and final assembly. Two will be rigged up for flamers/meltas and the other two will hopefully have exciting poses. Achieving dynamism with the melee weapons isn't as easy as the rifles, even though it would seem like it would be. I may end up having to do some more involved sculpting or figure out better arms to obtain and butcher. ;)
 

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A little something different from my workbench. Because, you know, focus and efficiency has never been an issue with this project and I've got so much free time.



Pictures didn't come out too clear, but it was a proof of concept model for an additional squad that will be added to my Imperial Guard. He's just a test model and will probably be disassembled in favor of a different set-up and Catachan legs, but I wanted to see what it looked like when done. The arms have both been re-posed, but the distinct change I made was his shortened up las-carbine because, well, the un-augmented human figures look a bit silly holding those gigantic lasguns the current plastics come with. He's supposed to be some kind of top-tier Guardsman to be represented in game as a Veteran or Stormtrooper. Perhaps a member of the command squad or an augment? I've added a respirator to him which will eventually have straps, as will the lasgun have a sling. When I was a Marine, I loved that carry and referred to it as Weak Side Samurai Style, even though traditionalists hate it because it puts the barrel into dirt if you aren't careful. With a two or three point sling, however, it's a great way to get a weapon out of the way for using your hands without taking it off completely, but maintain control of it.

I really like this lasgun. All it needs is a new barrel, which will probably be done up with plastic tube. It will also look good in the hands of my plastic Squats. I may go full-stupid and slim it down along its axis like I did with the Horatius Pattern bolt pistol just so it matches the slimmer structure of the older lasguns on my metal Cadians.

Anyhow, I should probably have some new Marines done soon, and I'll try to take an accounting of the existing squads and some of the vehicles. Getting closer to a finalized paint scheme too, so who knows, some of them may eventually have paint.
 

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Really loving the work so far. I do have a couple of niggles though:

1. I really don't think the special issue weapons needed their barrels shortening. I think they look too stubby now, in comparison to the rest of the model. But maybe that's just me.
2. That pistol you converted (drawn from the holster), I think isn't necessarily accurate. If you look at the holstered pistol, I think it looks like a normal pistol, simply without the magazine. Hence, the "slimmer" version you have simply looks too flimsy and unlike a bolt pistol to me - more like a laspistol unfortunately.

+rep for your amazing effort so far. :)
 

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@Veteran Sergeant

Firstly a HUGE THANKS for sharing your project, I too have felt the Marine mini was too mini and need a couple of extra mils to stand out better.

Its a true joy to see your models, I love conversions and I was wishing the thread (and pictures) to never end!

I must ask, what gauge drill bits do you use for the barrels / muzzles, if I might be so bold as to also ask what tool do you use?
 

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@Veteran Sergeant

Firstly a HUGE THANKS for sharing your project, I too have felt the Marine mini was too mini and need a couple of extra mils to stand out better.

Its a true joy to see your models, I love conversions and I was wishing the thread (and pictures) to never end!

I must ask, what gauge drill bits do you use for the barrels / muzzles, if I might be so bold as to also ask what tool do you use?
Glad you've enjoyed it thus far.

The barrels are done with a 1mm drill that I bought at a model airplane shop and is powered by my fingers, lol. It's actually perfect for the side holes with no modification because it fits right into the molded depression and will push right through. It's a little too fine for the barrel mouth, but sometimes that is a good thing since it can be an imprecise practice. I tried to take a picture of the little bastard, but it's so small it didn't come out too well.

Really loving the work so far. I do have a couple of niggles though:

1. I really don't think the special issue weapons needed their barrels shortening. I think they look too stubby now, in comparison to the rest of the model. But maybe that's just me.
2. That pistol you converted (drawn from the holster), I think isn't necessarily accurate. If you look at the holstered pistol, I think it looks like a normal pistol, simply without the magazine. Hence, the "slimmer" version you have simply looks too flimsy and unlike a bolt pistol to me - more like a laspistol unfortunately.

+rep for your amazing effort so far. :)
These are fair opinions. What I ended updeciding to do was just have 3 classes of bolt pistol. The SMG sized "standard" bolt pistols are sidearms for anyone who would need medium-short range engagement weapons. Devastators carrying missile launchers, lascannons, etc. Sergeants, special weapons Marines, etc. Everyone else would have a smaller, more maneuverable and less bulky sidearm. As far as them fitting in a holster with no magazine inserted, there's just no way I can reconcile carrying a defensive weapon that isn't immediately usable. I remember being ordered to carry a concealed pistol in Condition 3 when I was assigned to civilian clothes humanitarian stuff one time and it bothered me that I was being asked to carry a weapon (implying potential threat) and not having the ability to immediately engage a threat (suggesting the weapon wasn't considered needed).

The special weapons are actually more or less the same size as the bolters now. They may look a bit stubby because people are used to seeing them look so large. Everything in 40K is a bit too big to me. Honestly, if it wasn't so much effort to fix the grippy hands (which would be way too big), and actually modify the weapons, I'd have slimmed down the standard bolters by chopping them lengthwise too. The effect I wanted at the end was a weapon that appeared to be maneuverable at close ranges. Which is important since both of those weapons are only used at close quarters. Thanks for the rep though. We don't have to share the same exact vision. That's the fun of the hobby.


Anyhow, I've decided to give an accounting of the project as it stands. This isn't actually all of the vehicles, and none of the vehicles are "complete" to my standards. You can see my 3rd Edition first run LR Crusader (I literally bought it the first month the model was available when its rules were only in White Dwarf and non-Black Templar Chapters were still limited to 1), which I, quite fortunately in retrospect, never painted. I apologize for the poor quality of the photos as I didn't have any better place to take pics, and had to use my phone's camera (it takes pretty good photos, but not up to such a task)




And in a squad by squad order. None of these guys are permanently assigned to these squads, it just makes it easy to keep track of the project if I keep an organized tab of how many full units I have completed. Only have two completed Sergeants right now, so the angry pointing guy is filling in as the squad leader for the Devastators. "Kill those assholes over there!"





The 2nd Squad's magnetized Sergeant is probably getting reassigned to the Assault Squad as I think with some different arm poses, re-basing and a jump pack he'll look okay. I had big plans for his pose (was going to be stomping on some poor bastard's face), but I wasn't able to convey the movement and animation I was looking for, so he got re-done. The final effort isn't really working for me. His magnetized arms are second hand, so it may just be the arms aren't posed for that specific model. Or he may get taken apart and completely re-tasked. However, for now he stays.



I didn't bother to photograph the Assault Marine Combat Squad because, well, they are a few posts up.

Regardless, there's the total project progress. I've finally gotten around to playing Fallout: New Vegas (I've had it for months, lol). I don't play a lot of video games, but I loved the Fallout series back in the day (still have copies of the three original PC games). However, as you can imagine it chews at my hobby time. Sorry, heh.
 

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I've never understood why anyone would want to make it harder for their marines to get cover.

Now that brings up an idea.... converting dwarf space marines. Just take 1mm from the thigh, another from the shin, 1mm from the waist, and maybe from the arms.
 

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I've never understood why anyone would want to make it harder for their marines to get cover.
I think it comes down to where you get the most enjoyment out of the hobby. I enjoy the converting more than anything else so i'll build stuff because i like the way it is going together rather than because i like the way it will play. I've got a battlewagon with 4 big shootas and a lobber for crying out loud, not exactly an amazing tactical loadout but it looks pretty cool anyway and i enjoyed building it.

I would guess that creating something more inkeeping with the background is more important to the OP than how well the units will do in battle. Marines are meant to be taller than the models make them out to be after all. The only reason that they're not bigger model wise is probably due to the extra cost that the little bit of plastic would mean across the whole range.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I think it comes down to where you get the most enjoyment out of the hobby. I enjoy the converting more than anything else so i'll build stuff because i like the way it is going together rather than because i like the way it will play. I've got a battlewagon with 4 big shootas and a lobber for crying out loud, not exactly an amazing tactical loadout but it looks pretty cool anyway and i enjoyed building it.

I would guess that creating something more inkeeping with the background is more important to the OP than how well the units will do in battle. Marines are meant to be taller than the models make them out to be after all. The only reason that they're not bigger model wise is probably due to the extra cost that the little bit of plastic would mean across the whole range.
Pretty much. I'll be honest, I don't even really like the game of 40K anymore. It's too simplified at its core, and has gotten too far away from its roots as a sci-fi wargame, and at the same time, it has broken itself by trying to use a simple system to represent complex army type interactions. But I played this game a ton as a kid, and I love the universe, or at least, I love it the way I envision it. If that's all this army ends up being, an expensive modeling project that sits on a shelf and looks cool collecting dust, it will have been fun. If it brings some inspiration to other gamers, and/or they enjoy what I've been doing, even better.

So yeah, this is a modeling log. If you're looking for munchkin power gamer type conversions and tourney lists, you're absolutely in the wrong place. I can't imagine ever playing Apocalypse, so the very core idea of making a Battle Company is absurd. I will, without a doubt, never field this entire army on a table/floor/etc. So enjoy my waste of money. Or don't, lol.

I think the sarg in the second squad looks awsome, the whole squad is just running forward shooting like hell and hes just in the middle posing saying "BOOOSH" just my opinion though
Well I'm glad you like him. Just to be clear though, I was talking about the Sergeant in the second Tactical squad with the leg up pose, not the one with the combi-melta. The combi-melta guy I like.
 

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Well, I for one am glad that you enjoy creating something new out of the game. Your larger than life Space Marines are really cool. I tried to emulate a little, but didn't do as well. What do you think?
 

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Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
It's not bad. I'll admit right up front I've used nothing special to complete these guys, so don't get discouraged. It's really low tech.

My tools:
X-acto blades (I like the #10 general purpose rounded tip ones.)
1mm drill for the barrels
1mm (legs), 1.5mm(waist) and in some cases .5mm, plastic card.
Narrow tipped hobby file.

I can't, off the top of my head remember what size I use for the arm magnets on the Sergeants, but you'll want to use one that is close to or the same size of whatever magnets you end up using obviously. But the above tools are pretty much it. I have some snips I use for sprues or cleaning up the old metal bits.

It isn't a master class going on here. Which should be encouraging, because if you like what you're seeing, it's the sort of results that pretty much anyone can achieve with a little patience. I have sculpted nothing. There is no green stuff involved in this project. Everything is crafted out of the existing models, bits of sprue, or plastic card.

Some of the earliest figures are here:


You can also see the difference in the placement of the cuts. I've moved to almost exclusively cutting along the hip joint for two reasons. Easier to file down, and also imperfections are better hidden by all the gear. To answer the other question: The legs are 1mm. The waist is 1.5mm. However, there are examples in there of 1mm. It's only a slight difference. The outer left and right models are 1mm. The one in the center is 1.5mm.

For example, this is one of my favorites, and there's absolutely nothing special about him:

He's the example of how you can file the soft armor at the joints to fix the hand positions, or as in this case, create an entirely unique pose. The arm has also been cut at the shoulder and rotated to 90 degrees horizontal to help achieve the desired look. Left wrist was sliced behind the wrist to rotate the support hand to grip the rifle.



So you can see the arm cuts, I'll show you the magnetized power fist from the most recent Sergeant. This arm was actually the "punching" power fist that was cut from it's shoulder piece and fit to a standard shoulder to achieve the hanging look. I have three of those fists, so I wanted some variation. Figured I'd test proof of concept and try to mod it. I feel it was successful. As you can see, nothing sophisticated here. Wish I'd taken process photos of it. I clipped the tubes free from the arm, then sliced them at an angle to make the arm fit flat to the body, but make it look like the cables were disappearing under the should pad when it was actually assembled. As you can see, it looks rough as hell when by itself. I'm going to finish it with gap fill and some more clean-up, but this is what it looks like when it is on the model without any finishing:



Here's a last one with the top down so you can see that with proper wrist rotation, the bolters will remain straight up and down. Wrist positioning is key, because if you just try to rotate the arms, you'll end up with odd angles. Both wrists on this model have been cut to achieve this look.



When posing, you just have to look at what's important to realism, physiologically speaking.

Think about the angles of comfortable, natural movement and the overall range of motion in the arms. It revolves around the shoulders, elbows and wrists. There is only so much you can do with shoulders unless you're going to be green stuffing or cannibalizing the various arms which have more complicated shoulder attachments. Some of the basic arms sit at different angles at the glue point. Might want to analyze the various arm bits you have. One handed arms seem to sit at a more distinct "outward" angle a lot of the time. Don't be afraid to mix and match arm bits as you cut them apart because most forearms are interchangeable; just keep track of them, lol. Fortunately for Space Marines, almost all good firing stances (in real life) involve shoulders being tight and tucked. So the elbows and wrists are where you need to concentrate. Unlike real arms, the armored arms of Space Marines are more or less cylindrical, so you can rotate them and revolve them without looking strange. Most of my arm cuts are made just below the "under-shoulder pad" that's part of the actual arm bit. At this point, you can rotate the arms pretty much at your discretion since the cut will be hidden underneath the shoulder pad.for the most part If you're picky, you'll need to do some clipping, filling and filing to make them perfect. Depends on what level you're taking your project to. For table-top quality miniatures, there's not a whole lot of heavy work needed.

The wrists are the other point of movement in the human arm you're going to take into consideration. There are two basic ways. Clip behind the wrist ring, or just the hand and soft armor wrist. Behind the ring is easiest, and ideal for the "support" left hands since what you typically need to do is rotate the hand to accept the new firing stance, but not mess with the angle it sits lengthwise. The right hands are probably best cut just in front of the wrist ring, leaving the joint intact. At that point you can carefully file the soft armor at whatever angle you might need. For "one handed" weapon grips like the combi-melta, I suggest using extra Assault Marine arms with bolt pistols or plasma pistols you aren't using (there should be plenty of these lying around if you have any Assault Marines in your army). Can even use the melee weapon arms. They're just more of a pain to shave off sometimes and won't have "trigger finger" hands. The wrists on them are typically already angled where you want them to be, while the bolter cradle arms have this unnatural upward angle to them because they are designed for a "hip firing" look. Whoever modeled them watched too many 80s movies for inspiration. ;) Those wrists will almost always need to be modified, and at the very least rotated so that the weapon doesn't have some kind of oddball cant to it and sits straight up and down (unless your pose calls for a cant).

My own personal philosophy is not to try too hard to make them look down the sights. It just won't work, and will look strange when it does. The guns are too big, and the chests too deep so the heads won't tilt far enough over. Plus, they've got a little nubbin on the gun that looks like a sensor and supposedly awesome helmet targeting (another reason the models need helmets). The iron sights on the gun are like the targeter on the missile launcher. It's an aesthetic thing for the model which is anachronistic to the genre. I've contemplated shaving off all the front sight posts on my models. What you're looking for in these poses is a more aggressive look. Space Marines, with their powered armor, don't need to worry about marksmanship fundamentals. But they're going to use them anyway. It's instinctive at a certain point. As Scouts and neophytes they didn't have power armor. They'd have been taught how to shoot correctly, and by the time they've been practicing doing it a decade or more, every damned day, it's going to be automatic. Plus, it just looks better.
 

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Very cool. I tried to make the chest larger with milliput, but it didn't work out too well. On the legs and chest and arms, I used pieces of leftover sprue to extend the cut, then filled in with milliput. But, it is very messy and tends to get into all the places I don't want it. I'll keep trying to get one as good as yours.
 

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Everyone gets a combat knife?! Yes!

This Plog makes me happy and sad at the same time--happy, because this battle company is going to be F-ing spectacular (hell, it already is), and sad because it has now made me want to go back and saw apart all of my Astartes to make them 2mm taller.

Thanks for sharing the reasoning behind your modeling choices. I have always felt the same way about bolt pistol holsters and the various proportionality quirks that continue to plague GW's 40k model ranges. They probably have a lot to do with the limitations of the modelers and mold-making processes GW faced back in the old days. So, for continuity's sake we are still stuck with a rifle that's the width of a large cereal box.
 
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