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So with the Space Marine codex hitting in October there is a lot of hope for the new book, and I'm sure we've seen some wish listing already, or have our own personal hopes for the book. So I want to see how you'd do it. Don't worry, there are no wrong answers, just ideas.

So Heretics, how would you update the 6th Edition Space Marine codex?
 

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Honestly, NO. Space Marines already have far too many options, imho, compared to other armies. They already have their tacticals, which are so very flexible, and Scouts. Perhaps going the route of Blood Angels and giving scoring Assault, but that's a Blood Angels thing, so no. They've already got numerous Dreadnought configurations, so they don't need more of those. They have speeders with lots of weapon load outs, they have a flying land raider and a flying gunship. They have a decent tank with different weapon load outs, plus a monstrous armored transport tank. They've got Assault Marines, Dev squads, different classes of HQ units for different playstyles...

the only thing I'd like to see? I want chapter traits back.
 

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Chapter traits is a good idea. I want it to be less Ultra-centric in general. There also needs to be a slight point reduction to bring them in line with Dark Angels for the similar units. What I really want to see is the inclusion of Sergeants and Vet Sergeants like Dark Angels did. It fits the storytelling aspect and the fluff. You can get a field-promoted Sergeant who is not a veteran. But I'm not really expecting new kits. I'd rather see some re-sculpts. But I doubt that will occur.
 

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blahblahblahblah
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Chapter traits were one of the dumbest things GW ever did, bring those broken rules back and I'll ram the codex up your ass.

Fluff wise I want to see more mention of more interesting chapters, if you want to babble about ultrasmurfs then give them a seperate £80 codex so nobody will buy it, but don't fill a space marine codex with a chapter so boring and lame that it kills the reader through shear boredom.

Rules wise I want to see the ability to take ALL the companies, which doing so alters the FOC, you take a captain of X company, you get 10 troops choices that must be tacticals, but you get limits on other choices, you take a captain of Y company you get 10 troops slots of veterans and terminators but limited for other choices etc etc etc.

And make scouts scouty, give them bonuses that actually give the impression of scouting, at the moment their just a cheaper tactical squad, nothing special at all, have them sacrifice shooting so another unit within a distance can re-roll hits or wounds or something, keep them off board and have the enemy re-roll reserve rolls to show disruption, anything like that.

Bring back captain Cortez, let us use the previous lysander.
 

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All I want is the codex we have, with appropriate rules/wording updates and maybe some point reductions. Make scouts and vanguard veterans cheaper, leave the other squads as they are (I rather like certain older chapters, like the Dark Angels and Space Wolves, paying slightly less for their troops.)

Give us more characters from different chapters, and for the love of gods do not bring back chapter traits!

Rules wise I want to see the ability to take ALL the companies, which doing so alters the FOC, you take a captain of X company, you get 10 troops choices that must be tacticals, but you get limits on other choices, you take a captain of Y company you get 10 troops slots of veterans and terminators but limited for other choices etc etc etc.
Wholeheartedly agree with this. If codex marines is supposed to be codex adherent chapters then let us play with all of the appropriate companies.

And make scouts scouty, give them bonuses that actually give the impression of scouting, at the moment their just a cheaper tactical squad, nothing special at all, have them sacrifice shooting so another unit within a distance can re-roll hits or wounds or something, keep them off board and have the enemy re-roll reserve rolls to show disruption, anything like that.
This seems like a pretty cool idea, and fits in with Raven Guard oriented tactics.
 

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The problem with marines is the specialist units are not specialist enough. An assault squad is ok at assault, but it no where near as good as other specialist assault units. Give them better options such as mpre power weapons for assault troops (at the right points cost obviously) and let devastators have some form of trageter that makes weapons twinlinked.

I am wondering what new stuff Marines will be getting as there is very little room in the codex. We have multiple dread configs, plus several skimmers, a heavy and a light flyer, 3 heavy and 2 medium tank plus 3 dedicated transports, and thats just vehicles. Maybe a medium flyer would be nice, one that looks like a plane rather than a slab of concrete with motors.
 

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First I would remove their power armor, they don't need it. Then I would get rid of their frag and krak grenades, they carry to much stuff. Next I would allow them to come in much bigger groups, like 30 or so. Their tanks are to perfect, they should look more rugged and more like they where built in a hurry. Also I don't like how their skin is the same color as normal humans, it should be Green.
 

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(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
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Rules wise I want to see the ability to take ALL the companies, which doing so alters the FOC, you take a captain of X company, you get 10 troops choices that must be tacticals, but you get limits on other choices, you take a captain of Y company you get 10 troops slots of veterans and terminators but limited for other choices etc etc etc.
That would be cool.

I would make tactical's more dynamic. Perhaps we can give them options to take different marks of armour that gives different bonuses. E.g mk 6 gives you fleet for X points. They could do the same with boltguns, Tigrus pattern boltguns could be assault 2 but lose rapid fire. Or umbra ferrox could allow you to raise your ballistic skill if you do not move that turn.

Similar improvements could be made to the rhino, upgrade it to a command tank and get free leadership re-rolls withing X inches. Take a med tank, get feel no pain within X inches.

Nothing really big to change the core purpose of the units but nice little upgrades to specialise their roles a bit more because just now i find space marines boring because every unit has a little bit of everything which eliminates too much risk.

However most of all i would ignore the bitching from players of other races and go all out in giving new units and rules. It is stupid of them to think they are going to get as much stuff as Gw's flagship army.
 

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Rattlehead
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Nothing really big to change the core purpose of the units but nice little upgrades to specialise their roles a bit more because just now i find space marines boring because every unit has a little bit of everything which eliminates too much risk.
You know that's the idea of the army? Specialising Marines is going against their editions upon editions of existing playstyle. Marines have always been generalists, always will be.

They already have their tacticals, which are so very flexible, and Scouts.
Tactical Squad's flexibility ranges from shooting basic infantry to Combat Squads. That's it. They suck at killing vehicles, killing real infantry threats, killing flyers, sitting on objectives (yeah, ok, they're fairly resilient and Scoring, so they're not really really awful, but compared to Guardsmen or Strike Squads or Termagants, nuh uh). Scouts are just plain bad.

I agree with Stella; have a system whereby your Captain can take a Jump Pack, Heavy Weapon or aura-giving Banner to make Assault Marines, Devastators, and Tacticals Troops (or better) respectively.

Midnight
 

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I had no idea that Chapter traits were so awful. It sounds like a good idea. But I'm a newer player and missed out on them. But some of the Company specific ideas sound pretty cool. But seeing as I play Blood Angels, I'm really just using this codex to gauge what I'll be getting when updated.
 

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Critique for da CriticGod
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The "chapter traits" were a build-your-own system and while cool in theory, were eminently exploitable, and lead to a lot of abuse.

Rule #1 of game design should be "never trust the players."
Ease of rules abuse is directly proportional to the frequency of abuse.
 

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blahblahblahblah
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Chapter traits: advantage: +1 to all marine stats, boltguns are +1str ap4 36" assault 4 rending, all close combat attacks are rending, all marines have feel no pain, rhinos armour 14 all round for 5pts

Chapter traits: disadvantage: you can only take 1 speeder.

Whoop-de-fucking-doooooooooooo
 

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I suppose at this point we can point out that Chapter Traits were such a bad idea that Forgeworld reproduced them for the Horus Heresy books.
 

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Well I like chapter traits IF: They are a pre-packed set of traits that you can choose from that are relatively balanced. The system already has a defined number of founding chapter ("legions") so that gives you a number of different fluffy ways to include packages. You see it already in the special characters and replacing combat tactics (khan gives outflank, vulkan gives weapon rerolls on certain weapons, etc). I would like to see this system expanded to included all founding chapters. This would give a decent range of variety and is much easier to balance.

Another thing in the same vein that expands on the current system would be a list of abilities you could take instead of combat tactics. This would basically be like the current system, but would untie it from the fluff (and would cause great rage amongst the chaos player base).

What I don't want to see in chapter traits: A min/max system of abilities where the disadvantages are easily nullified and the advantages are too good. (ala 4ed codex).

As for the codex itself, in addition to an expanded Chapter Tactics rule I think the codex should stay pretty simple. Provide expanded options for basic units like the rhino variants, no vet sgts, 5 man tacs w/ weapons, bring back the melta razorback, etc. Between that and the expected points rebalancing the Space Marine codex is solid and versatile as-is and doesn't need much in the way of tweaking.

...and please no Mega Walker for codex marines. There is no room for it in the fluff like there was for Tau (experimental new suits in response to new threats) or Eldar (knight walkers being an old staple) and it would take a lot of work to integrate one into lore.
 

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blahblahblahblah
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Iamtheeviltwin: the chapter traits were exactly that, a min max system, the advantages were never offset by the negatives and were always abused by marine players, I found no exception to this.

As was mentioned above, you never trust the players, and that's damn true, players always make a habit of taking something with potential and fucking it up for everyone else.
 

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Lower points cost, chapter relics, FOC manipulation through different HQ choices.

Basically, if the SM codex is half as cool as the DA codex currently is it will be a vast improvement.

First I would remove their power armor, they don't need it. Then I would get rid of their frag and krak grenades, they carry to much stuff. Next I would allow them to come in much bigger groups, like 30 or so. Their tanks are to perfect, they should look more rugged and more like they where built in a hurry. Also I don't like how their skin is the same color as normal humans, it should be Green.
This sounds just...so familiar. It's like...it's like you're talking about another army almost...
 

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If I were responsible for the new marine codex, I would not include traits of any kind in the book, I'd leave variations between the chapters of legend, ie first founding plus CF and maybe a few others, to be done via suplements. I'd get rid of army wide special rules confered by special charcters and limit their influence to a single unit or force organisation change, once again leaving variations between chapters to supplements. Two levels of chaplian just like BA and DA get. Maybe a set of psyhcic powers unique to SM librarians pehaps clled the Emporer's Tarrot. I'd like to see an extra special charcter forf each of the firstfounding and the CF, and two for the IH. NO and I mean absolutely NO Riptide/Wraithnight style large walker. I'd like to have the option to uprgade a single capatain or librarian to be a Deathwatch character, or perhaps aDEathwatch special character that unlocks a Deathwatch kill team as either an elites or HQ choice that takes upo no FOC slot like a command squad or a techmarine's servitors. I don't know what I'd add as far as other new units go, but model wise I'd like a Deathwatch/Sterbguard/Vanguard/Honourguard upgrade kit, and a recut Razorback/Predator tank with sponsons that don't break, all of the weapons options for the RB and a dozer balde that could be used on any 'non-Vindi' Rhino Chasis
 

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Jac "Baneblade" O'Bite
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A traits system that is actually well thought out and balanced so this:

Chapter traits: advantage: +1 to all marine stats, boltguns are +1str ap4 36" assault 4 rending, all close combat attacks are rending, all marines have feel no pain, rhinos armour 14 all round for 5pts

Chapter traits: disadvantage: you can only take 1 speeder.
doesn't happen. Then again seeing as what they did with the SW sagas was "Get A because the character in question has sworn to do B" and if they don't do "B".... there is no negative penality I can't see GW actually thinking through the system.

At the very least give vanilla dex players the ability to run Terminators as troops so a first company is able to be made without resorting to Deathwing.

Oh yeah and fuck the boys in blue.
 

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A traits system that is actually well thought out and balanced so this:



doesn't happen. Then again seeing as what they did with the SW sagas was "Get A because the character in question has sworn to do B" and if they don't do "B".... there is no negative penality I can't see GW actually thinking through the system.

At the very least give vanilla dex players the ability to run Terminators as troops so a first company is able to be made without resorting to Deathwing.

Oh yeah and fuck the boys in blue.
As I have understood it the Chaptermaster often leads the first company if he joins battle so make Terminators troops if you choose a Chaptermaster as your warlord.

The more known chapters should be shown in their company organisation, not only the smurfs.
 
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