Definitely sounds like something they would do. And it would be a massive shame if that happens, they realize people will pay instead of getting replacements, and the finecast product control never improves

 

Actually, I dont think they will. The reason I think that is that they already told you how to fix them in the latest white dwarf - and they already sell super glue which is what they recommended. (as well as green stuff and modeling stick thingi).

And, I dont think they genuinely have Balls THAT big.

 

And, I dont think they genuinely have Balls THAT big.

Lets certainly hope not.

 

Balls? Doubtful.

Greed?

...

Yes. Yes they do.

 

Balls? Doubtful.

Greed?

...

Yes. Yes they do.

I dont want to get involved in another GW is great/GW is bad thread - but I just dont understand comment like this.

If GW think they can make profit out of something, then thats what they will do. Its not greed, its purely a business decision.

Ive even got a great example from 10+ years ago of 'business decsions' affecting how GW works.


Remember the old Rhino - the really crappy one. Well The studio asked the 'money men' if they could make a new Rhino. The money men went away and looked at the figures and came back saying 'no chance, the current Rhino is one of the best selling kits we have, there is no business justification for making a new one.'

Well, the studio team werent going to let this get them down, so they went back and came up with a cunning plan. Dear Mr Money men - we have heard and understood you, we have also looked at the figures and we notice that the predator doesnt sell very well - can we make a new one of those....

And, low and behold, we got a new rhino via the back door, because you cant make a predator without the rhino body.


So, GWs money men will do anything to help the company make money, even if it doesnt make sense to us 'plebs' who buy the stuff. It doesnt make it greed, just normal business decsions.

 

There is a huge amount of GW hate going on. I'm tired of defending them for simply 'doing their job' (making rules and models and selling them).

When they do something really wrong I'll be right there taking pot shots as well, but at the moment it's really painful.

 

Don't get me wrong I have no problems with GW making money, lets face it they are a business and that's the purpose.

I enjoy the soft and cuddly memories of the old days when GW were a bunch of hobbiests doing what they love, but also know if they were still like that they would have died off a good 15 years ago.

Price rises? I bought my first RTB coded Rhinos as a two pack for a tenner, I'm used to them and will buy what I can afford when I can afford it. No problems.

I don't hate them, I love their stuff, have done for 24 odd years.

What I do not like is the fact they think I'm thick enough to buy into the bullshit they have spouted about the FC material.
I don't care what price it is either, with in reason.

It's just the fact they keep banging on about how great the stuff is when it so clearly is not.

The amount of air bubbles in it are beyond belief , the amount of prep work needed to sort this out is a danger to the hobby.

I went through every blister of the mini that I wanted to buy to try and find one that was OK.

I didn't.


I am hoping that quality improves with some time, maybe in six months I will try again.

Consistently crappy quality is the one thing that will kill GWs in the UK, more than any price hikes.

As a long term GW game player I am more worried about G-dub now than at any time before.

VV

 

Maidel, you don't understand comments like that because you've gotten to the point where you're seeing attacks on GW everywhere. I like GW well enough. It's sort of like a puppy to me. You can't quite understand what it's doing, it occasionally makes a mess, but you're still fond of it

 

Maidel, you don't understand comments like that because you've gotten to the point where you're seeing attacks on GW everywhere.

But, but, but - you said this:

Balls? Doubtful.

Greed?

...

Yes. Yes they do.

How is that anything other than an 'attack' - you are claiming that what they are doing is motivated by greed - surely Im not missing the point?

What I do not like is the fact they think I'm thick enough to buy into the bullshit they have spouted about the FC material.
I don't care what price it is either, with in reason.

It's just the fact they keep banging on about how great the stuff is when it so clearly is not.

The amount of air bubbles in it are beyond belief , the amount of prep work needed to sort this out is a danger to the hobby.

I went through every blister of the mini that I wanted to buy to try and find one that was OK.

I didn't.


I am hoping that quality improves with some time, maybe in six months I will try again.

Consistently crappy quality is the one thing that will kill GWs in the UK, more than any price hikes.

As a long term GW game player I am more worried about G-dub now than at any time before.

VV

Now - that is something that I can legitimately accept as an issue. I havent had the problem with finecast that you describe, but there are quite a few threads on it, some legitimate and some very silly.

As I said above, Im not here to 'defend GW', but I just get fed up with the constant jibes about them which seem to be made for no reason other than its currently 'fashionable' to bash GW at the moment.

 

 

Success makes people/companies a target.

I don't see you as a G-Dub defender, it is cool to see some balance, carry on.

One of the reasons my little froth is in here rather than in those threads is I don't want to encourage the bashing.

The Red Name tag carries some weight that the less adult members may see as licence to get even worse in their GW bashing efforts.

In here there is a chance of a more thought out set of replies not just a load of 'yeah GW are wankers' etc.


But I still bet they flog some additional stuff for sorting FC at some point. :biggrin:

 

I don't see you as a G-Dub defender, it is cool to see some balance, carry on.

Wow - you are just about the only one then!

Actually, thats not fair, I do appear to be in the position of being one of only a few vocal voices, however the numerous people who have +repped me for my defence of GW shows that there are a fair few people out there who feel the same way, but dont want to 'stick their head above the parapet.'

One of the reasons my little froth is in here rather than in those threads is I don't want to encourage the bashing.

The Red Name tag carries some weight that the less adult members may see as licence to get even worse in their GW bashing efforts.

No, no, from modding years ago I do understand that, anything said by a mod/owner carrys a lot of weight and can easily 'guide' people into channels that they werent going down of their own accord, so I completely understand why you try to stay 'balanced' in general postings.

But I still bet they flog some additional stuff for sorting FC at some point. :biggrin:

How about this - Ill take you up on that bet. Ill still be around at christmas (sorry!) and if they have sold tools especially for finecast (ill be generous in what that means) then ill put in for a year or twos sub, rather than just freeloading off 500+ posts a month.

Sound good? :biggrin:

Don't get me wrong. I LOVE GW, love their game and love their models. I'm only so opinionated on this matter because I really don't want to see them hurting themselves with continuous foolish moves. I want to be able to play 40k when I'm on my own golden throne lol

Your toilets made of gold? :shok:

Well you are probably one of the few that can afford GWs prices then :biggrin:

But seriously - I think there is a major 'misalignment' in your thoughts and mine (well duh!) frankly, I think that if GW DONT increase their prices, then they will go out of business - and you clearly feel the other way around. I feel its the only way they can stay in business with their current model (lots of stores.)

And I'm in no way saying your opinion is wrong in any way. There is a lot of GW hate around, but how often do you see spontaneous praise threads pop up? If something is going right, you usually don't here anything mentioned about it until it goes wrong/

100% agree - and its what Ive said a few times about finecast. Including 'His Lordship' Vashes comment above, I think there are maybe 15 people reporting issues with finecast models.

For me, given that there are 600+ people on every time I log on and the site said that 8000 or so have been active in the last month (or whatever the stat is) that 15 people out of 8000 potential complainers isnt really a large proportion.

Now whether that means lots of people have lower standards, or lots of people arent buying them or lots of people dont feel like complaining, I simply dont know - but it doesnt 'feel' like a lot to me.

 

Specifically not increasing control and sending out more problematic finecast in order to sell kits to fix them would take balls I don't think GW has... as well as the loss of GW's soul. They may make stupid mistakes, but they're not being actively malicious.

On the other, realizing that resin has issues, and you'd be better off making some money selling kit to fix those issues rather than giving people replacement models, that's being motivated by (a healthy amount of) greed

If GW wasn't motivated by greed (in this scenario or others) I'd be highly disappointed in them. They're not a charity foundation no matter how many people appear to feel they should be

 

If GW wasn't motivated by greed (in this scenario or others) I'd be highly disappointed in them. They're not a charity foundation no matter how many people appear to feel they should be

But thats my point entirely - 'greed' has only negative connotations, its even one of the 7 deadly sins, if you believe that sort of thing.

Whereas 'business reasons' is simply what it says - its their job.

Greed implies there is some form of malicious intent behind it, when at the same time you are saying that they arent malicious.

Im not trying to be pedantic, Im just trying to explain why I see that as yet another dig at GW. Whereas I am quite sure you meant it as a throw away vaguely humorous comment (god knows I make them all the time and they get misinterpreted!)

 

I suspect it's just one of those cases where people (possibly due to culture) attach a different emotional context to a word. I'm using the word more in terms of an intense (and selfish) desire, where you seem to be emphasizing an element of excessiveness. In which case it would indeed be a dig at GW

 

I'm using the word more in terms of an intense (and selfish) desire, where you seem to be emphasizing an element of excessiveness.

Im lost.

Neither of those things when written in english are anything accept a negative dig.

'intense and selfish desire'

is worse than saying 'excessive'.


So, yea, I think we are going to have to 'chalk this one up' to being a cultural issue...

 

As an example, "I want cookie dough ice-cream" is currently an intense and selfish desire for me, but it's hardly negative as I'm not harming anyone with it (well, except maybe myself if I actually get my hands on a large amount ) and others might well agree they want some too

 

I've not been following finecast much as I'm not that interest in anything they've released, but what's the issue with them? Also why do High Elves have like one model?

 

As an example of the issues, my Son and a mate went to the local GW on the weekend with intentions of spending round about $200 each on Models they wanted...they didn't even spend $100 between them as the vast majority of the models were damaged to such a degree they shouldn't have been put on the shelf in the first place.

They were told that if they couldn't be repaired to a decent standard they could bring them back for a refund, but in the end even though the models were (are) defective GW still expect to get full price for them.

GW are expecting their customers (us) to perform the quality control side of this product, obviously in the hope that the amount of refunds they have to make doesn't equate to the total amount they sell.

 

Well that just sucks, I know Forgeworld has problems now and then but not to that extent.

 

Yea much worse than FW...I've bought many FW models and had maybe half a dozen pieces that needed major GS (whatever) work, and I've never had to return any for replacement. Hell, even the few models my Son did buy weren't perfect...bubbles/cracks in plain view that will need to be filled perfectly otherwise will easily be spotted on the finished model. One model had an arm missing so he has to use a similar piece from the Bitzbox to sort it out.

All that said, the Finecast models are really well detailed, much more enhanced that the metals they replace...but the company's QA standards are very poorly met overall.

 

06-10-11, 03:14 PM - How long before GW cash in on fixing your Finecast?

With all the Finecast threads popping up I'm loathe to mention the stuff.

That said, and here is the point of this post.

How long do you reckon it will be before GW cash in on the bad finishing quality by selling tools and materials for you to fix them?

I think we will soon be seeing GW Clay Shapers and 'Wonder Filler' for sorting Finecast fuck ups.

What other products do think we might see?

About five months then.
I so wish I had posted this on the main boards.:victory:


Found a snippet online at Dakkadakka.

White Dwarf 382


- Citadel cleanup kit: Contains a flash brush with right rigid bristles for removing flash from resin and a mouldline scraping tool, ideal for metal, resin and plastic. €10,50

- Citadel Emery boards: Pack contains three emery boards that are great for smoothing resin surfaces. Contains two fine-grade and one super-duper-extra-fine-grade board. €4,55

- Citadel liquid green stuff: paint bottle of liquid green stuff. Water soluble, designed for gap filling and removing air bubbles. €2,95

- Revamped Citadel tool kit: Contains all previous tools along with the new clean up kit.

How about this - Ill take you up on that bet. Ill still be around at christmas (sorry!) and if they have sold tools especially for finecast (ill be generous in what that means) then ill put in for a year or twos sub, rather than just freeloading off 500+ posts a month.

Sound good? :biggrin:

Looks like I need to PM Maidel and cash in this bet. :biggrin:

 

As a modeler I am happy about the additional items coming out, the fact that they are cashing in on resin issues sucks. I want to test the new liquid greens tuff and see how it compares to milliput juice.

 

Interesting. I will certainly look into this.

Plugging up the joins on a hive tyrant`s back has been a pain in the arse for a long time now. Especially since I buy one of the damn things every month or so... :crazy:

 

I like the fine cast, I do think it is for the better of the hobby and GW as a company. However I do feel it is somewhat wrong for a company to more or less say 'ya we cant be bothered about the quality of product we are producing, but here have some tools to fix our screw ups for an additional fee.'

It just does not sound right to me. Their markups can be justified if the product quality is there ie. detail, and the product is not miss cast. But if they can't do those simple things how can they justify the mark up?

My 2 cents
Chaosftw

 

GW are obliged to replace miscast models.

This tool kit would be more for optional modifications and such I imagine.

 

Overall I am happy with the kick though I can see this being an issue due to its timing of finecast. Yesterday I was at a FLGS and looked through its Finecast blisters and noticed very few mistakes. These have all come from later runs so I am guessing that they have finally fixed the issues in their QC department.

 

Ya i have noticed the same thing...Plus i have dropped a few fine cast models and had them not break or scratch! So far i am loving this change! (other then the price)

 

I have not had an issue with the FC yet... but that said I am very aware of the issues with it. But overall, I can see why GW did it and why they are heading down this road.

Any new change to a product... especially one that seems to get so many people passionate about it is going to create some problems.

I say good work GW for taking the models in a new direction and breathing life into some of the older more dated figures.

I am sure like most things it will QC wise improve as well dramatically as time goes on. This is always the way with anything new.

As for the GW bashing... I tend to agree that people are totally unrealistic in how they view GW. It becomes almost outrageous that they change something or do certain things to the point that anything they do seems to attract negative attention on the net and from aspects of the community.

Everyone forgets that they have to make money..... it is part and parcel of the company to make profit for shareholders. The same happens in my industry now unfortunately to the extent that the word "BANK" and "BANK MANAGER" have become almost like "Hello would you like a visit from the Grim Reaper?".....

Gamers have the right to choose, right to play what they want and how to do it... I worry more about the negativity affecting the longer term survival of the company. They are not that huge or large that they are immune to negative publicity waves with buckets of saved up dollars... it is returned to shareholders. So to my mind bashing them over everything leads more and more people to question/ to complain to stop buying all over some net trolls "They didn't do a good job on my codex this game sux forever" post.

If that is the case.... then yeah awesome we fixed GW yeah take that assholes! Oh hang on the company went under... um... who is bringing out 7th edition 40k then? Oh its now like... nobody? Um.....People just seem to forget that! We might be critical but for some it appears to have become a hobby in itself to slag GW at every chance they get.

And yes I do appreciate they have done what we all may think are silly things... but we never see board meeting minutes, RD meetings, etc. So how can we make an informed judgement really? If you really want a voice.... buy some GW shares and have your voice heard... I did.

 

Hmmm... Buy GW shares...? :scratchhead:

 

So did Maidel honour his bet?

 

I doubt it'll be very long before GW start to cash in on this. My grandmother's husband paints models professionally, metal ones primarily, and he was amazed at how light the resin models were when I showed him my Incubi. He told me they won't last for very long, eventually they'll be worn down.


Lord of the Night