How do the Dark Angels explain what happened to Caliban and the Lion??

6098 Views 53 Replies 19 Participants Last post by shaantitus, Oct 26, 2010

Angel of Blood

Discussion Starter · Oct 8, 2010

Was just thinking earlier, i wonder how the Dark Angel explain what happened to the Lion and the Rock? I imagine Russ and others would have been rather curious as to how Caliban was destroyed and the Lion lost. We know the Dark Angels don't tell anyone about the Fallen or what happened. Looking for some serious answers but feel free to add more entertaining ones.

I've got an image of Russ, Guilliman and any other currently survivng primarchs turning up at the remains of the rock

Russ and co. - wtf happened here? wheres the lion?!
Dark Angel 1 looking at whats left of Caliban - fuck me! when the fuck did that happen? Did you see that happen
Dark Angel 2 -me? fuck no, you?
Dark Angel 3 -no way, shit, guess um it must have exploded or something........
Russ and co. - exploded........?
Dark Angel 1,2,3 - .........yes, because of.........Horus!
Russ and co. - Oh yes horus of course, yes that could make sense. um sorry for your loss
Dark Angel 1 - Thank you brothers, this is a hard time...
(dark angels in the background taking luther inside to his cell)
Russ and co. - Hey is that luther?
Dark Angel 2 - Who? luther? noooooo.
Russ and co. - There! right there shackled up and mumbling
Dark Angel 3 - Naaaaah that's um......
Dark Angel 2 - Bob!
Russ and co. - Bob?......
Dark Angel 1 - Yeaaaaah, you know bob! always joking about, no doubt pulled a prank on someone again!
Russ and co. Random marine - Oh the guy who replaced our Librarians staff with a magic wand??
Dark Angel 1 - .........yes!
Russ and co. - Hmmmm well ok then, good luck with the cleaning, and if Jonson does turn up tell him to return my calls

41 - 54 of 54 Posts

Baron Spikey

· #41 · Oct 16, 2010

Not according to the 4th Editon Codex, and the 2nd Editon (Angels of Death) states that only the Supreme Grand Master of the Dark Angels speaks to Luther.

gen.ahab

· #42 · Oct 16, 2010

Speaking to and knowing of are two different things.

Angel of Blood

Discussion Starter · #43 · Oct 17, 2010

Well the direct quote from the codex is "As Supreme Grand Master, Azrael alone is privy to the greatest secret of all. At the very heart of the Rock is a cell, shielded by metre upon metre of adamantine armour and inscribed with the most potent runes of warding. Withing, kept alive for ten thousand years inside a stasis field, languishes the broken Man who was once Luther."

So yeah, only him. Something that irks me a little, i think at least the Masters of the Deathwing and Ravenwing as well as the Grand Master Librarian and Master Interrogator-Chaplain should also know

Baron Spikey

· #44 · Oct 17, 2010

Angel of Blood said:
Well the direct quote from the codex is "As Supreme Grand Master, Azrael alone is privy to the greatest secret of all. At the very heart of the Rock is a cell, shielded by metre upon metre of adamantine armour and inscribed with the most potent runes of warding. Withing, kept alive for ten thousand years inside a stasis field, languishes the broken Man who was once Luther."

So yeah, only him. Something that irks me a little, i think at least the Masters of the Deathwing and Ravenwing as well as the Grand Master Librarian and Master Interrogator-Chaplain should also know

I don't know it speaks of exactly how paranoid and secretive the Dark Angels are, the Ultramarines adhere strictly to the Codex and the DA take the concept of need-to-know to the most extreme levels.

Angel of Blood

Discussion Starter · #45 · Oct 17, 2010

Aye i get that, but just at least one other individual perhaps, the Master Interrogator for instance, would make sense for him to know at least, to further interrogate him. Got to assume the Grand Master goes through some solo ritual when elected in which it is somehow revealed to him, or the midgets tell him somwhow, tugging at the hem of his robe until he follows them to Luther ^^

gen.ahab

· #46 · Oct 17, 2010

Yes, but they know of his treachery, correct? It is what I was saying, not that they knew he was still alive and kicking.

Baron Spikey

· #47 · Oct 17, 2010

gen.ahab said:
Yes, but they know of his treachery, correct? It is what I was saying, not that they knew he was still alive and kicking.

Oh right, yeah I'm sure they know of Luther's treachery.

gothik

· #48 · Oct 17, 2010

well if thats the case and the Lion is fast asleep in the deepst bowles of the rock (maybe he is and maybe he isn't) why keep it a secret? but then again this is the DA we talking about paranoia and secrey and fear of others finding out about their chequered history seems totake precedence these days

Angel of Blood

Discussion Starter · #49 · Oct 17, 2010

The Lion IS in the rock, it's not an if or maybe, he is. And who knows why the Watchers are keeping it a secret from the Dark Angels, they are enigmatic as it comes.

gothik

· #50 · Oct 17, 2010

in that case could it be that they have plans for him just as the Cabal had plans for the Alpha Legion or maybe f we go along with the Conspiracists for the moment maybe he is too far over the line and they think its best to keep his slumber a secret lest he wake up and complete what he may or may not have started who really knows the motives of the Lion except the Lion himself

Phoebus

· #51 · Oct 26, 2010

The Inner Circle is a very small group of people. It includes Azrael and the Successor Grand Masters, for certain. Someone with his hands on the 4E Codex can look to the page that outlines the Chapter's structure; it qualifies what Dark Angels are in the Inner Circle besides Azrael (I believe it's just Ezekiel and the Interrogator-Chaplains).

Members of the Deathwing are inducted to some of the secrets of the Chapter's history. Librarians, (non-Interrogator) Chaplains and Company Masters are privy to even more secrets. They do not, however, possess the knowledge of the actual Inner Circle.

As for keeping the secret? I don't see how this would be a big deal. The Imperium had undergone the Heresy, and was still undergoing the Scouring. They had a million worlds to keep track of--a great number of which were still burning, a wrecked infrastructure, ruined lines of communication, etc. How would anyone have even blinked if, at that point, the Dark Angels reported that a single planet, just one of maybe thousands that suffered similar fates, had been destroyed?

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Angel of Blood

Discussion Starter · #52 · Oct 26, 2010

Aye but it wasn't just that any planet had been destroyed. The planet was an astartes stronghold, a very effective and efficient one at that by all the reports. And it just gets completely destroyed with no explanation at all. I know alot of shit went down in the Heresy but i still think that would get flagged up. Theres also the fact that it occured after the Seige of Terra(do we even have an rough estimate of how long after?) But most pressingly, The Lion himself was lost, the surviving primarchs themselves would want to know how their brother was lost/killed in the wake of the heresy.

I dunno, it's just a very very large and important event. Alot of very high up people would be wanting to know what happened, they must have had to make up one hell of an excuse to satisfy them

Phoebus

· #53 · Oct 26, 2010

Oh, I hear you. I guess I look at it this way.

1. Heresy ends. The Imperium is in chaos (no pun intended), shambles, etc.
2. The Dark Angels, led by the Lion, head to Caliban.
3. Luther's treachery is revealed; Caliban is destroyed.
4. A certain period of time passes, by which time the Dark Angels arrive at a consensus for their secret.
5. That period of time falls during the Scouring. During this same time, Vulkan's fate remains unknown, Dorn and Guilliman are (presumably) killed, and, more importantly, Corax, Leman Russ, and the Khan depart on more or less unverified journeys confirmed only by their Chapters.
6. The Dark Angels "reveal" to the Imperium what happened to the Imperium probably some time after knowledge of one or more Primarchs departing became common to other Astartes.

How plausible would all this be? Enough that the Dark Angels got away with it, I guess.

Ultimately, I think it was a matter of there being enough insanity going on at the time that a planet (belonging to the Imperium for only fifty years) being destroyed and a Primarch disappearing simply weren't considered that wild an occurrence.

Just my two cents' worth, though!

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shaantitus

· #54 · Oct 26, 2010

I agree with Phoebus, the thing is who else knows about it anyway. Everyone on the planet died so they aren't much help. The only others are the fallen that remain, who are continually hounded by the loyalists and who are portrayed by the legion as traitors anyway, so who would believe them? The truth could be slightly modified, chaos taint of the non astartes population.

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