[Vorag of Strigos]

After another humiliating defeat at the hands of yet another Necron army I find myself caught between two possible courses of action. The first, it to learn from my mistakes and field more units to combat Necrons. The second option however, is to just not fight Necrons ever again and eliminate the possibility of losing to them ever again.

My opponent was equipped with the following:

Necron Lord x 1
Immortals x 10
Necron Warriors x 10
Necron Warriors x 10
Annihilation Barge x 1
Canoptek Wraiths x 5
Scarabs x 4
Canoptek Spider x 1
Tomb Blades x 6
Destroyer Squad x 3

Whilst I was equipped with:

Company Master x 1
Librarian x 1
Tactical Squad x 10
Deathwing Knights x 5
Deathwing Terminators (Storm Bolters) x 5
Dreadnought with Lascannon
Devastator Squad with Plasma cannons x 5
Ravenwing Command Squad x 3
Ravenwing Attack Squad x 3

The game began with almost no cover due to no other tables being available, what little cover there was I positioned neutrally along with our objective markers. I got initiative and went first, I moved in order to position my troops in the best positions available to gain objectives whilst seeking what little cover was possible.

I lost the game spectacularly due to objectives being constantly contested and my Ravenwing never making it to the objective I sent them to. Secondly the casualty rate was catastrophic due to the fact that my troops were completely annihilated.

Casualties:

Necron

6 Necrons Warriors
1 Canoptek Wraith
1 Scarab (Later rebuild by the Canoptek Spider)

Dark Angels

3 Ravenwing Command
3 Ravenwing Attack Squadron
5 Devastator Squad
1 Dreadnought
5 Deathwing Terminators
4 Tactical Squad

My Ravenwing were gunned down before they could even make it to cover despite my opening salvo taking out the majority of the Necron Warriors. My Deathwing Knights never made it to the battle due to deep strike mishap and my Terminators suffered a mishap and were positioned in perfect range of the Immortals and Necron Warriors. My Tactical Squad were set upon by Canoptek Wraiths and I only held out due to my psyker gaining an invulnerable save on the Perils of the Warp table. My Devastator squad however were wiped out by the Destroyer Squad and my Dreadnought fell to scarabs.

It seems impossible to win against Necrons so I ask you all as experienced players. How the hell do I fight Necrons and stand any sort of chance of winning?

 

[MidnightSun]

Well, take this with a pinch of salt because I haven't actually beaten the new Necrons either, but high-strength low ap large blasts and high strength low ap close combat on units that can sweeping advance seem to be the trick. Unfortunately for DA, that basically just leaves Imperial Knights. Deathwing Knights will do pretty well, seems like you just got unlucky with those - basic Warriors really hate Str6 AP4. The regular Terminators, not so much - a squad of Terminators shooting, even with a Plasma Cannon or Cyclone Missile Launcher, will be lucky to kill a Necron Warrior or two. They're strictly inferior to, for example Hammernators or even Lightning Claw Terminators in this instance because their guns are just going to bounce off of Necrons.

The all-Bolters-all-day Ravenwing list might give a good account of itself as their massive rate of fire should counteract the usual uselessness of firing small arms at Necrons.

Learership modifiers and checks, while hard to come by, are apparently pretty good (Terrify a block of Warriors for example) but I can't say I've ever seen it - too much of the army is Fearless or Ld10 and resilient enough not to take morale very often at all.

Killing the Tomb Spyder first will remove Reanimation Protocols from the Wraiths, taking them down from 'borderline broken' to 'very powerful'. Rad Grenades are also a big help against them.

I would say give me a few more games against them and I'll come up with something (having just completed 1500pts of Space Marines, who are similar to DA), but since the only Necron players I know have quit the army due to the new Codex, I don't think I'm going to get much experience against them.

 

[loki619]

also some times just leave the objectives and let him go form them while u just shoot the bejesus out of him after all his amount of vp's means nothing if hes got no models left

 

[MidnightSun]

also some times just leave the objectives and let him go form them while u just shoot the bejesus out of him after all his amount of vp's means nothing if hes got no models left

You can't table Necrons, not in the Decurion leastways.

Or if you can, I've yet to see the list that does it.

 

[Moriouce]

Sounds like the plasmacannons should have taken their toll. And try to take larger squads, ravenwing. They should reach melee then.

 

[mayegelt]

If what you said is his army he is not going decurion... it is almost there though. The majority is, but that barge and destroyers make it have to be CAD or Unbound. Make sure his list isnt using rules it shouldn't be. He would have a canotec harvest and reclamation legion but then no hq for the barge or troops to make it work.
Remember formations are counted as detachments in there own right. Unless he goes decurion, but then everything he buys in that detachment would have to be bought from that list given. He can not say that because he has X Y and Z units in his army he counts as having those rules but can freely add heavy support choices or whatever to that army. 1HQ unit in that list means he had to go CAD or Unbound. If he went Unbound he would not get the decurion bonus, EVEN IF he took the reclamation legion and harvest he looks like he took What could have made one.

I would not recommend the knight as he will just gauss it down. Vindicator are always good for fighting them but you will need a 3 or so as they will be priority targets for him. At S10 Ap2 it will both ignore armour and take the reanimation down by 1 (what if he isnt decurion would be 6s).
As said killing that spider is a big thing if he has gone decurion. But if not then splat those wraiths with the demo cannons and they are instant death if they fail the 3++ then reanimate on -1. Though the wraiths aren't always your best target because of that save, it depends how clustered they are.
Otherwise removing whole squads of immortals, warriors or tomb blades will stop him holding objectives.

Either way, new marine and dark angels books look to be coming in the next month or so. So you might end up with some fancy new toys like grav guns to eat those wraiths up with.

 

[Kreuger]

I dunno if you can do it, but including ablative wounds in the devastators might help. I don't have the codex, but if you can take a 10 man unit and battle squad it and split the plasma cannons 2 and 2 then they can be separated and have a few protective wounds.

And as @MidnightSun pointed out you appear to be lacking the serious firepower needed to put the Necrons down and keep them there.

 

[Loli]

I'm still yet to win against Necrons with my Sisters and my Dark Eldar. I'm getting closer with my Sisters. I don't play Marines but the weapons of Sisters and Marines are pretty much identical. I'm having a bit more success adding in more Heavy Bolter and Heavy Flamers. Don't know if that helps you as Dark Angels though.

 

[The Sturk]

As a Necron player, the advice given already is solid. AP4 is great against Warriors and the rending chance + higher strength makes it worthwhile against Immortals and the Spyder.

As said before, ensure that he is playing the Decurion correctly, as the Destroyers and Barge are out of place if this is a decurion list. That said, the Canoptek Formation can be added into a CAD as it is a formation that can be allied in. Just ensure that he isn't trying to get the +1 Recon bonus for his army.

Wraiths will always be tricky due to their saves and newly acquired +1 T. Vindis can get lucky and ID them. Infact, high strength/low AP is good in general. I will say I hate going up against massed Plasma from my friends own DA. My friend even makes decent use of the Landspeeder Vengence, though I am quite aware of it's downsides.

 

[Vorag of Strigos]

Sounds like the plasmacannons should have taken their toll. And try to take larger squads, ravenwing. They should reach melee then.

My plasma cannons worked a treat, but the stupid reanimation of a 4+ and some took rerolls which Im not sure if its legit or not. One round two plasma shots killed 10 Warriors and they all got back up...

I'm still yet to win against Necrons with my Sisters and my Dark Eldar. I'm getting closer with my Sisters. I don't play Marines but the weapons of Sisters and Marines are pretty much identical. I'm having a bit more success adding in more Heavy Bolter and Heavy Flamers. Don't know if that helps you as Dark Angels though.

I do like the Sisters of Battle and really want an update to occur to the current edition so I can play them as a second and most likely primary army. I plan to add two Predators to my army, one with Autocannon/Heavy Bolter and one with three Lascannons to go vehicle hunting. I might add a sister allied detachment with a Cannoness and some Heavy Bolters/Heavy Flamers.

Killing the Tomb Spyder first will remove Reanimation Protocols from the Wraiths, taking them down from 'borderline broken' to 'very powerful'. Rad Grenades are also a big help against them.

I would say give me a few more games against them and I'll come up with something (having just completed 1500pts of Space Marines, who are similar to DA), but since the only Necron players I know have quit the army due to the new Codex, I don't think I'm going to get much experience against them.

He always hides his tomb spider out of sight of anything so I can't shoot it whilst his wraiths are out clawing my tactical squad and independent characters to mulch. Else I'd shoot it up to the point where it resembled cheese of the highest swiss calibre. His Wraiths reanimation protocols and the fact that his units aren't just powerful but stupidly cheap mean it's so difficult to fight Wraiths with what I currently have.

 

[mayegelt]

My plasma cannons worked a treat, but the stupid reanimation of a 4+ and some took rerolls which Im not sure if its legit or not. One round two plasma shots killed 10 Warriors and they all got back up...

If the army was as you described then he is a dirty cheat!
You only get the 4+ reanimation protocols for units in a Decurion Formation. As said above his army could not be Decurion because he only had 1 HQ choice in the form of a Lord, what would have had to be his Reclamation Legion, so could not have taken the Destroyers or Barge.

Decurion Formation
Reclamation Legion
Necron Lord x 1
Immortals x 10
Necron Warriors x 10
Necron Warriors x 10
Tomb Blades x 6

Canoptek Harvest
Canoptek Spider x 1
Canoptek Wraiths x 5
Scarabs x 4

But to take an
Annihilation Barge x 1
He would need to make it an Annihilation Nexus. So would need a 2nd Barge and a Doomsday Ark.

To take Destroyer Squad x 3 it would need to be a Destroyer Cult. This means 3 squads of 3 minimum Destroyers and 1 Destroyer Lord.

HOWEVER to take what he did if you were remembering correctly he would have
Necron CAD
HQ
Necron Lord x 1

Troops
Immortals x 10
Necron Warriors x 10
Necron Warriors x 10

Fast Attack
Tomb Blades x 6

Heavy Support
Annihilation Barge x 1
Destroyer Squad x 3 (Though this would be 3 Destroyers as a squad or a 2 and 1 squad as he would have to many Heavy Support otherwise).

Canoptek Harvest
Canoptek Spider x 1
Canoptek Wraiths x 5
Scarabs x 4

This would mean he only gets the 5+ reanimation.

The reroll of animations comes from the Overlord in a Reclamation Legion. It is for anyone in 12" of the Overlord if they roll a 1 for reanimation. Or he could have a Resurrection Orb what allows 1 turn for rerolling all failed reanimation protocol for him and his unit.
Remember as well he needs to keep that Spyder in 12" of the things he wants to give a special rule at the start of his movement phase (so can't move him close, give them the buff and have them dash away) to such as Reanimation Protocols. This is important as he is a monstrous creature so only has 6" move. While the Wraiths and Scarabs are Beasts, so have 12" move. So each turn the units bought with that Spyder are faster and will be getting held back by him if they want to keep the bonuses. Also remember the formation is not a unit. So he can't do things like Look Out Sir for the Spyder or choose to take the wounds on other models who are closer. It also means that if you wish and can see the Spyder with your units, you can shoot it, even if you have other models in the way. Sure he gets a cover save if he is slightly obscured of 5+, but with a 3+ save normally, unless you fire melta or plasma style weapons at him, he is getting a better save than that cover save anyway. So rack up a load of heavy bolters and let rip if you want.
It also means if you charge it in combat, unless you have also engaged the other units with a disorganised charge that you would be able to direct all attacks on it.

 

[Moriouce]

Play him again and tell him to play by the rules! Good luck!

 

[MidnightSun]

His Wraiths reanimation protocols and the fact that his units aren't just powerful but stupidly cheap mean it's so difficult to fight Wraiths with what I currently have.

I hate to say this but with what you have, you're probably boned bar exceptional dice rolls/terrible Necron playing. Dark Angels are very far behind the power curve, and Necrons are right on the cutting edge. With an optimised list, there'd be more in it.

 

[Vorag of Strigos]

Play him again and tell him to play by the rules! Good luck!

I'll have to double check everything he says and does in the future. Cheers!