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Discussion Starter #1
I am just starting to get into fantasy and am reading the 8th edition rules. I think this list ought to do good in 8th edition but it will likely require some tweaking advice from the experts.


Lord:
1. Prince- Armour of Caledor, Vambraces of Defense, ring of corin, Halberd (265) Accompanies the PG

Heroes:
1. Mage- Lv2, Silver wand, guardian pheonix, relic sword, iron curse icon (185) Lore of Shadow
2. Mage- Lv2, Jewel of the dusk, amulet of light, amulet of fire (185) Lore of Death
Each mage accompanies a SM unit

Core:
1. Spearmenx35- FC (340)
2. Archersx10 (110)
3. Archersx10 (110)

Special:
1. Pheonix guardx20- FC, Lion Standard (355)
2. Swordmastersx15- FC, Banner of Sorcery (305)
3. Swordmastersx15- FC, Banner of Arcane Protection (280)

Rare:
1. Repeater Bolt Thrower (100)
 

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Looks alright, but one thing. Give your prince a great weapon. No reason not too. When you ASF anyways, and +2 strength is always fun!
 

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What about replacing the 2 archer units and the spearman unit with one sea guard unit, that way you could take advantage of the hoard rule?
 

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Because Sea guard are useless everyone seems to think they are the new be all end all. They really arent. Keep the variety. Otherwise you end up with a unit with no place that is to damned expensive for what it does.
 

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Looks alright, but one thing. Give your prince a great weapon. No reason not too. When you ASF anyways, and +2 strength is always fun!
ASL + ASF = normal Init. That means no rerolls for the prince.

The list looks good, though I'd switch out Swordmasters for White Lions. 3+ save versus shooting = awesome.
 

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Not quite,

Q. The Speed of Asuryan special rule states that “all High Elves
have the special rule Always Strike First, regardless of the weapon
they are wielding.” How does this interact with a great weapons
Always Strike Last? (p43)
A. The army book will take precedence in this situation. For
example, a Sword Master would strike first with his great
weapon. If his Initiative value is equal to or higher than his
opponent’s, he will also benefit from a re-roll to hit.
Aramoro
 

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:shok: :)
:)
:)
:)
This makes me extremly happy!
 

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You are both right- ASL+ASF cancel, but HE's dodge the ASL rule of their weapons...

The prince should have a great weapon for sure... but he's also wrong in 2 other ways. First is his points, atm he's only 256pts (I assume that was a typo) which will increase to 262 with the great weapon... still 3pts cheaper. second is the ring of corin... its an arcane item so he can't take it. I would either save the pts or take a new enchanted item from the rulebook; the potion of strength looks tasty- an S9 elf with 'hatred' like rerolls to hit against almost everything would be very nasty.
Personally though I would swap your hero/lords choices about and have an archmage and 2 nobles- the extar +2 to cast/dispel is nice, and you still get the same number of spells. If you are willing to use SCs and dont care about being called names take teclis and caradryan... they are just about the best 2 characters in the game.

I would scrap the relic sword off that mage- so what that you'll wound anything on a 5+... your still pathetically weedy (no armour mods), have low WS and only have 1 attack... its just not worth it. Instead knock it down to a shrieking blade- the mage causing fear is pretty much teh same as the unit causing fear (except that the SMs arent immune to enemy fear causers).

Rest of the army looks good, although I would swap the banners arouns a little- you have the immune to fear/terror banner on a uinit that causes fear and has the best Ld (both with and without the general being there) and you have the banner of sorcery on a unit thats relatively easy to kill. Swap them over and you'll protect the SMs from both fear and terror and have a nice bunker for the banner of sorcery.
Additionally I would give the SM champions a few points of magical equipment: I would give 1 the dragonhelm and the other the dragonbane gem. That gives both of them a 2++ against anyone using fire... which means if you do face an enemy army with something big and nasty with flaming attacks (such as say... most bloodthirsters) then you'll be laughing... since 3/6 units you have are all but imune to his attacks for at least 1 turn (SM champ challenges BT- you should need to pass 5-6 2++ which gives you a 30-40% chance of survival... but more importantly means the enemy is likely to get 0-2 wounds, which your SCR will counter).

Depending on what types of enemy army you fight you might want to think about swappin the RBT for a couple of eagles- war machine hunters might serve you better then a warmachine of your own. Then again the heaviest war machine armies tend to be gunlines... and HE dont do well against gunlines (S4 AP wounds elves on a 3+ with no saves to any infantry but PG and WLs).
 

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I really think that you need a lvl 4 in 8th edition, especially with the sorcery banner. Lvl 4 gives you a high probability of getting what you want (76% chance of getting a key spell) due to ability to choose a spell if you roll a duplicate (rather than re-roll) and the boost to casting and dispel (+5 with HE bonus) attempts. I've looked at putting a archmage with the PG unit and giving that unit the magic resistance (2+ ward save to magic spell damage) and even considered the book of hoeth (IRF on doubles one-sixth of the time but no miscast unless double 6's) and using lore of life for its boosts. I like death. You will have to give some things up to run an archmage but it is worth it for the casting and dispelling boosts. I like death, not totally sold on shadow.

Agree on GW due to HE FAQ and rule book giving ASF with no cancelling due to GW. I like the swordmasters.

I'm not sold on archers. They are just too weak and don't have enough hitting power (no multiple shooting, no AP in comparison with Dark Elf RXBs). Sea Guard are only one point more expensive and you can get spears, shields, light armour and bows with the same BS as archers, so the choice between sea guard and archers is trivial with the ability to shoot and fight in ranks now.

This army lacks punch. I've thought of putting Bow of Seefarer for its punch and ability to take out big threats and a second RBT is needed.

We're playing 2500 or 2400 as the standard army size now, so obviously we can fit in a few more things than you have here.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanx for the responses everyone. I have certainly taken in some suggestions and made changes to the list. The most notable change being the removal of my prince for an archmage. Levels count for a lot with the new magic rules so it only made sense. i wish I had enough points for a noble, but I didn't so i simply added some magical items to my special units. So here is the new list:

Lord:
1. Archmage- LV4,loremaster's cloak, floriath's robes, silver wand (355) Lore of Life

Heroes:
1. Mage- Lv2, Jewel of the dusk, amulet of light, amulet of fire (185) Lore of Death
mage accompanies a SM unit

Core:
1. Spearmenx35- FC (340)
2. Archersx10, musician (115)
3. Archersx10, musician (115)

Special:
1. Pheonix guardx20- FC, Banner Sorcery, the skeinsilver (405)
2. Swordmastersx15- FC, Lion Standard, dragon bane gem, potion of strength (330)
3. Swordmastersx15- FC, Banner of Arcane Protection, drogon helm, obsidian trinket (305)

Rare:
1. Great Eagle (50)
2. Great Eagle (50)
 

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Good choices. It kills me, but I'd combine the two swordmaster units into one unit or cut down the swordmaster units enough to take two RBTs. You really need the long range shooting threats to defend the small size of the army against horde armies and to force the opponent to go after something else.

I'm really surprised you're playing at 2250 (odd number of work with percentages) and not 2400 or 2500 or 2000.
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Alright i have looked at the list again and made a few minor adjustments. I decided to take out the spearmen and archers for 2 units of 20 sea guard. I like versatile units and plus the 2 units worked out to be 570 points which is pretty much exactly what I needed to get my 25% minimum in. I've also removed 1 unit of SM and made the other unit 20 strong, and added in some white lions. Not sure how they will do but I expect some good things from them. I was also fortunate to be able to afford a RBT and a great eagle to hunt down enemy war machines.
Here's the new list:

Lord:
1. Archmage- LV4,loremaster's cloak, floriath's robes, silver wand (355) Lore of Life
Accompanies PG
Heroes:
1. Mage- Lv2, Jewel of the dusk, amulet of light, amulet of fire (185) Lore of Death
mage accompanies a SM unit

Core:
1. Sea Guardx20- FC, shields (285)
2. Sea Guardx20- FC, shields (285)


Special:
1. Pheonix guardx20- FC, Banner Sorcery (380)
2. Swordmastersx20- FC, Banner of Arcane protetection (355)
3. White Lionsx15- FC (255)

Rare:
1. RBT (100)
2. Great Eagle (50)
 

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Well Im pretty sure your maths is off there WLS, its more like a 1in64... but thats still small enough to be totally ignorable- I've had my HE for a year and doubt that Ive played anything like that number of games.
I think you shouls keep the archmage exactly as it is- the immunity to damage from any non-daemon/ethereal combat will mean that you are able to keep casting those life spells and use throne of vines far more then if you took the seerstaff. In fact that build is so useful I think I might steal it off you (I knew it existed but only thought of it in terms of throwing the archmage at a unit and casting courage of aenarion, rather then just being an awesome way to keep mages alive in combat).
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Haha of course you can take it Tim/Steve. I thought it was too good to be true when I equipped that Archmage. I really needed a powerful support character to help boost my relatively small army and you get nothing short of this with the high elves. I should also thank you Tim/Steve for suggesting to replace the Prince for the Archmage. I might not have ever thought about it otherwise.
 

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I've used it in a couple games before and its a fun build... but I was using it to counter deathstars. Throw that mage into the enemy, make sure courage of aenarion is cast within 12" (I had him and 2 other lv2s all with high magic just for that occasion) and laugh as the enemy 1500pt deathstar gets stuck in combat until you fail a stubborn Ld9 test (or fail to get courage cast)... it worked ok, but wasnt really fitting to my playstyle.

Princes are very useful and thier Ld10 bubble is great... but the differnce between a noble and a prince isnt all that great, while the difference between a mage and an archmage can be gamechanging. I would always try to get a prince into an army if you can, even if its just with minimal equipment (eg great weapon and dragon armour) but not at the expense of an archmage- at 2.5k games and over I'll certainly be taking both.
 

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Well Im pretty sure your maths is off there WLS, its more like a 1in64... but thats still small enough to be totally ignorable- I've had my HE for a year and doubt that Ive played anything like that number of games.
Errr, yes. That was my mistake. I forgot to take the combinations of the rolls that would deny Throne of Thorns. My mistake. 1/65 it is. (Yes, I said 65 :p)
 
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