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Discussion Starter #1
Simply asking what would you take, based on two of the new formations. I'd include the Helfist, but for right now it's too expensive for my army. When I upgrade, I may end up taking it.

Mayhem Pack is three Helbrutes in reserve, deep striking in. They have to roll crazed for movement, but it's essentially back to the old, deep striking multi-melta Chaos dreads. Also, they apparently gain "It will not die".

Helcults give a Helbrute two squads of fearless meatshields. If the brute dies, they lose fearless and gain zealot. The Helbrute itself gains +3 cover saves if the LoS is partially obscured by the cultists. Price is a cultist per save, which isn't much.
 

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I would say it depends on your needs.

The mayhem pack looks fun! Drop them right in the enemy and watch the fun ensue. Great for tarpit units and maybe anti armor.

Helcult looks more like a second line formation. Your front line moves up and deals with the enemy, while the helcult walks behind and takes a few objectives (I assume the cultist still count as troops?). Otherwise a screening unit, or tarpit as well. Plenty of options here.
 

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Warsmith
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Simply asking what would you take, based on two of the new formations. I'd include the Helfist, but for right now it's too expensive for my army. When I upgrade, I may end up taking it.

Mayhem Pack is three Helbrutes in reserve, deep striking in. They have to roll crazed for movement, but it's essentially back to the old, deep striking multi-melta Chaos dreads. Also, they apparently gain "It will not die".

Helcults give a Helbrute two squads of fearless meatshields. If the brute dies, they lose fearless and gain zealot. The Helbrute itself gains +3 cover saves if the LoS is partially obscured by the cultists. Price is a cultist per save, which isn't much.
As I have said at other times, spending 15% of your points on a unit that may not show up until turn 3 -4 is a risk. And the fact that the go crazy all the time, makes them a little to random for me. The Helcult rocks, they are cheep and a good way to to free up elite choice so they are not all full helbrutes.
 

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By being able to deep strike the Mayhem Pack, you allow it to drop in fairly close, and by kitting out the Helbrutes with fist/Melta, you help deal with one of the biggest problems... getting a Crazed Result halfway across the board where it can't use everything. I think this helps it a LOT by allowing you to drop it close where any result is a good one. I wouldn't recommend something like double missiles or even double fists so you can shoot when needed, but that's a lot of armor for an enemy to worry about, even if it shows up late.
 

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There is something pointed out on another forum about the Mayhem Pack I feel is worth noting: since Crazed rolls occur at the start of the movement phase they can't roll on that chart on the turn they deep strike (Reserve rules covers this IIRC). So that first turn they're more manageable than one would expect.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
There is something pointed out on another forum about the Mayhem Pack I feel is worth noting: since Crazed rolls occur at the start of the movement phase they can't roll on that chart on the turn they deep strike (Reserve rules covers this IIRC). So that first turn they're more manageable than one would expect.
Yeah, reserve/deepstrike does cover this. The problem with them is the same as taking any large units, they're not resilient and melta/fist to death quite easily. Where as using a single brute with a TLL and a ML to support with a meatshield while your other cultists take objectives sounds more efficient.

Honestly I'm leaning towards the Mayhem just because it will be cheaper for me and easier to model. I just want more opinions before I commit to a build order.
 

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actually since both the reserve rolls and the crazed rolls happens ''at the start of the movement phase'' you can resolve them in the order of your choice (so in this case, to roll it or not at all), do you like gambles? :)
 

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You don't use start of the movement phase on deployment of reserves though.
uhm..yes you do, roll reserves and deploying reserves are simultaneous. (pg 124 BRB: When reserve arrives choose one and deploy it...)

actually I'm wrong
pg 125 BRB: a unit arriving from reserves cannot use abilities or powers that happens at the start of the turn

no random first turn with helbrutes then :)
 

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Entropy Fetishist
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uhm..yes you do, roll reserves and deploying reserves are simultaneous. (pg 124 BRB: When reserve arrives choose one and deploy it...)

actually I'm wrong
pg 125 BRB: a unit arriving from reserves cannot use abilities or powers that happens at the start of the turn

no random first turn with helbrutes then :)
Yaaay no chance of having to run at an enemy you can't charge, then. Multi-meltas, away!
 

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Yeah. I've noticed from some other battle reports that the multimelta rush isn't so happy, but heavy flamers and other weapons will be just as helpful.
If you don't want to keep them bare-bones cheap with the Multi-Melta, then a TL Lascannon or the Missile Launcher are the other good options for running it with (ML for versatility, TL Las for being, well, TL).
 
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