[alphadog0309]

Hi all, this is my first post on the forums but i have been reading these forums for years now for inspiration. A few years ago I splurged and bought a something like a 3000 point eldar army. I got like 75% of the way through it and then sorta fell out of love with the whole idea because I realized what squishy wimpy characters the eldar are. I guess I wanted something slightly more space marine style, with bigger and badder soldiers. What I thought up was a sort of Eldar and SM hybrid army. Baisically an unheard of Primarch who mysteriously landed upon an eldar world and formed a secret chapter of Eldar Space Marines with the modified genetic code. Baisically i want to take my existing models, bulk them up, and turn them into a Space Marine army. I'm still working out the idea, I literally though about it as I was cleaning up my basement, but I wanted to know if it had ever been done before and/or if it was a valid/good idea. Thanks in advance!

 

[hungryugolino]

Expect nerd rage.

 

[Dave T Hobbit]

...an unheard of Primarch who mysteriously landed upon an eldar world and formed a secret chapter of Eldar Space Marines with the modified genetic code.

Eldar genetic structure is different from that of Humans, so Gene-seed would not work. However. that is not insurmountable assuming a very intelligent Primarch assisted by Eldar knowledge.

A bigger issue is why the Eldar, prissy species-ists that they are, would want to do it. The only thing that springs to my mind is a small group of Dark Eldar using it as protection against Slaanesh (by ceasing to be Eldar), which is still very unlikely.

Why do you say it happened, as a good story justifies many unlikely actions?

...i want to take my existing models, bulk them up, and turn them into a Space Marine army.

I have no issue with an SM army that uses Eldar models for things. Particularly if the unit choices fit a story rather than just being a reason to field an unbalanced army.

From a modelling perspective, making enhanced Eldar sounds intriguing; I for one would like to see your efforts.

So, to precis, if you have a good story for how and why it happened and an army list that has a strong theme you are more likely to not get raise eyebrows.

 

[alphadog0309]

Eldar genetic structure is different from that of Humans, so Gene-seed would not work. However. that is not insurmountable assuming a very intelligent Primarch assisted by Eldar knowledge.

A bigger issue is why the Eldar, prissy species-ists that they are, would want to do it. The only thing that springs to my mind is a small group of Dark Eldar using it as protection against Slaanesh (by ceasing to be Eldar), which is still very unlikely.

Why do you say it happened, as a good story justifies many unlikely actions?

baisically its a twisted version of the Eldar Paths... a primarch who formed SM paths that correlate exactly to the eldar paths except they are bulked up and using SM tech. An idea i had earlier would be an offshoot of an Altansar craftworld which fell into disarray and like Altansar, rode through the shockwave and narrowly missed the eye of terror. The Primarch who landed on the Craftworld though proved himself to be far superior and he displayed numerous psychic powers. He formed the Space Marine paths by converting the followers of the current Eldar Paths. As I said its still pretty rough.... but I hope that kinda spins it to make it more believable.

I have no issue with an SM army that uses Eldar models for things. Particularly if the unit choices fit a story rather than just being a reason to field an unbalanced army.

From a modelling perspective, making enhanced Eldar sounds intriguing; I for one would like to see your efforts.

So, to precis, if you have a good story for how and why it happened and an army list that has a strong theme you are more likely to not get raise eyebrows.

Modeling wise im looking into doing something pretty interesting that involves a 3d printer and my current parts so more on that later thanks for your comments.... i need all the help i can get!!!

 

[Cocakoala]

I agree that the idea that its some dark eldar who thought it would be a good way of averting slannesh is much easyer to make believeable. Craftworld Eldar would never say that a human is superior to them. Humans are vermin to them. Its like you saying a rat is a superior life form to you because it can run faster then you. Tho you could have in the story the eldar in the craftworld the primarch landed on had run out or didnt have in the first place and spirit stones which put them in the same position as the dark eldar meaning theyre more likely to accept this space marines ideas.

 

[alphadog0309]

Yeah I think that attempting to avert the wrath of slaneesh makes good sense... I also like the spirit stones idea baisically allowing me to get some wraith lords and space marineify them..... On another note... Does anyone know of any 3d models of space marine/eldar figures? Google sketchup, pro/e, autocad are all fine

 

[Calamari]

A primarch that landed on the craftworld wouldn't know what a "Spezz Mehreen" is so this point is unlikley...

 

[LJT_123]

Expect nerd rage.

Hahaha! Perfect

 

[alphadog0309]

The primarchs landed on different planets and adopted the local cultures and practices. The primarchs became heros in the worlds they planers on so it wouldn't be a strech to say that there would be a large following wherever the primarch landed. Once the primarch was discovered by the emporer he would probably adopt the culture and fighting style of the place where he came from. In this case the primarch chose to recruit
eldar who were loyal to him for his legion and genetically modify them to be ideal space marines. I see the army being a mix of the eldar type path warriors with space marine weapons and armor, but the fighting style of each of the different Aspects. Do you think i would be able to justify having eldar weapons if they are more powerful?

 

[Katie Drake]

Or you could just take a leaf out of the various books of comic book writers and say that your army comes from an alternate universe where the Eldar were the ones to create genetically modified super soldiers and somehow a Legion/Craftworld ended up in the "real" 40K universe.

Personally, whatever the back-story is, I say go for it. If nothing else it would result in a cool looking army.

 

[PapaSmurf124]

Do it man. I like the Slaneesh idea the most. You can basically do whatever you want so long as you dont break whatever sacred covens there are out there. Case in point I wanted to make the leader of my new CSM Legion a fallen Grey Knight Termie. After speaking with a friend who read the book and posting here, the idea fell out, because GKs are incorruptable Oh well, the current plan of action still works with the design ideas I have in mind. Good luck with the army. Looking forward to seeing them

 

[wombat_tree]

//WARNING: RAGE//

NOOOOOOO!!!

Why do I say this? Well read on.

1. There are no Eldar worlds that have any sort of substantial population, the few Eldar inhabited worlds with a population are a bunch of farmers, not warriors of any sort.

2. The Primarchs had no idea what a Space Marine was when they were scattered around the galaxy and definitely did not have the capability to mix them with Eldar genes

3. Do you realise that what you are suggesting basically is destroying the personality of each race? Eldar would look ridiculous in power armour and skinny Space Marines would be stupid.

4. Do you realise what would have happened if a Primarch had done this? The Eldar would go bonkers and try to kill the mutant Eldar and all the Humans for that matter. Meanwhile the Emperor has been betrayed by his son who is comiting heresy, starting an earlier version of the Horus Heresy. We now have a war raging between the Eldar, Humans and this Primarch with his mutant creations. Guess who gets whipped out? Yep, your idea.

5. Why the hell would Eldar or even Dark Eldar want to do this in the first place? Both races hate humans. What is more, I can't even think of a benefit that the Eldar get from this. Sure the Space Marines might get heightened reflexes or something like that, but what about the Eldar?

6. The general concept just makes my head explode with rage, and that is not a pretty sight.

So has this been done before? No. Thank Khorne.

//END RAGE//

 

[Tzeen Qhayshek]

All power to you, man. Make sure you put up some pictures!

 

[bitsandkits]

Im all for people using imagination(hell i wish more would) but i just get the feeling your trying to push a square peg into a round hole because your eldar army got its ass owned by marines.
As a long time fan of Eldar i would say bite the bolt and sell the army and buy some marines, the way i see it your gonna have to use the space marine codex for this project and thats on the understanding that you know a group of people who would allow you to use the army anyway.
The fluff for the creation of this army is not important as you cant actually come up with a realistic and worthwhile reason for Eldar marines to be in the history of 40k so any reason would work , your primary concern should be, what rules are going to be used for the models.
If your going to use the standard marine codex then you would be better off selling the eldar or just buying marines. But if your going to produce some form of home brew eldar/marine codex hybrid then i get the impression that you will produce something over powered by taking the elements from both races that will work to your advantage and that means you will not get a game.
From a model point of view, if you have access to a 3d printer as you claim then your gonna have to produce your own CAD designs for models as this isnt stuff that just floats around, plus even if marines or eldar had CAD's it would be owned by GW and it wouldnt match what your looking for anyway,as you want bulked up eldar??

On the ideas front, why do the marines/primarch have to involved? Eldar are far more technologyically advanced than humans and if choose to do so they could produce super soldiers with powered eldar armour without any human involvement.

So fluff reasons aside for a moment.

What codex will you use? and why?
what models will you use?

 

[Dave T Hobbit]

I tend to agree with bitsandkits that the actually getting to play a game part is the least likely part to work.

However, if your primary intention is to come up with a good backstory or to do some really great modelling, and you do not mind the risk that you will not be able to take the army to a formal game, then I am happy to bounce ideas around.

 

[nocturnalK]

Give it go, at the the end of the day the 40k universe is big and vast with many things going on.

Though, if it is just the look you want then why not base it pre-heresy, Power Armour existed before the SM and humans did ally before the crusades

 

[Tzeen Qhayshek]

In all honesty, you don't need anyone's "blessing" to do what you want with your army. I wouldn't have even posted it on here. As long as you use an official codex, people can't say a single thing.

 

[alphadog0309]

//WARNING: RAGE//

NOOOOOOO!!!

Why do I say this? Well read on.

1. There are no Eldar worlds that have any sort of substantial population, the few Eldar inhabited worlds with a population are a bunch of farmers, not warriors of any sort.

Obviously this kind of thing would require that the Primarch was able to lift an Eldar world to the position where they supported him and that they were at a substantial enough strength where they would be able to fight.

2. The Primarchs had no idea what a Space Marine was when they were scattered around the galaxy and definitely did not have the capability to mix them with Eldar genes

the idea is that he learns the culture and the ways of the eldar then starts his own legion when he is found by the emperor made of Eldar-SM hybrid army

3. Do you realise that what you are suggesting basically is destroying the personality of each race? Eldar would look ridiculous in power armour and skinny Space Marines would be stupid.

I agree... which is why I'm going to post all my designs before I go through them... and there is a lot more to merging the two then just having a large Eldar or a skinny space marine... I'm working on some renderings right now and I will definitely post them online for constructive criticism.

4. Do you realise what would have happened if a Primarch had done this? The Eldar would go bonkers and try to kill the mutant Eldar and all the Humans for that matter. Meanwhile the Emperor has been betrayed by his son who is comiting heresy, starting an earlier version of the Horus Heresy. We now have a war raging between the Eldar, Humans and this Primarch with his mutant creations. Guess who gets whipped out? Yep, your idea.

The initial idea would be that the Eldar would have given their full blessing as well as this was all part of the grand scheme of the Primarch plan set in place by the Emperor. After all, he was attempting to engineer a better army and with the average Eldar being far superior to a human, it is not to much of a stretch to say that there may be some genetic experiments going on with Eldar DNA

5. Why the hell would Eldar or even Dark Eldar want to do this in the first place? Both races hate humans. What is more, I can't even think of a benefit that the Eldar get from this. Sure the Space Marines might get heightened reflexes or something like that, but what about the Eldar?

The idea was that the Eldar would have been saved by this Primarch and thus have seen his powers and then begun to follow him and love him just as they did for the other 18 primarchs and then eventually agree to join him in battle. The other idea I had was that these could all be genetic experiments of the Emperor to mix Eldar DNA with Space Marines to further enhance the SM. Then the mutants would follow the paths of the Eldar Aspects and become specialized warriors just like their Eldar Counterparts except as Space Marines.

6. The general concept just makes my head explode with rage, and that is not a pretty sight.

So has this been done before? No. Thank Khorne.

//END RAGE//

Haha that's the idea... try to make something so unheard of! Thanks for your comments!

Im all for people using imagination(hell i wish more would) but i just get the feeling your trying to push a square peg into a round hole because your eldar army got its ass owned by marines.
As a long time fan of Eldar i would say bite the bolt and sell the army and buy some marines, the way i see it your gonna have to use the space marine codex for this project and thats on the understanding that you know a group of people who would allow you to use the army anyway.

Unfortunetly this "army" is sitting in their boxes waiting to be touched. I like the general style of Eldar but i just feel they are kinda like the wimpy crybabies of all the races. I mean all they do is sit and bask in their past glory as they watch as their worlds crumble around them. They have no active part in anything anymore and all they do is sit around "waiting" for the "right" moment. I have not yet played a game with my Eldar army, only with a Space marine army I sold for this army. I would sell the stuff... but before i do that i wanna try and do something a little different.

Yeah I agree that the fluff isnt important but that will influence everything from model design to paint so it must be addressed. I was intending to use the Standard marine codex and attempt to make a 1-to-1 relation of the Eldar weapons that the aspect warriors use to the weapons of the space marines. This whole idea revolves around Space marine aspect warriors and I'm trying to make different styles of space marines within one army rather than all of them being with very similar gameplay and visual styles. I would also use this because i feel that the marine codex is better because it will allow me to have the ability to sort of be stronger and more hardy then the Eldar codex would give me. I'm not much of a gamer due to time though so this isnt my primary goal in this whole thing but hey i enjoy a good game every once in a while like anybody.

From a model point of view, if you have access to a 3d printer as you claim then your gonna have to produce your own CAD designs for models as this isnt stuff that just floats around, plus even if marines or eldar had CAD's it would be owned by GW and it wouldnt match what your looking for anyway,as you want bulked up eldar??

I have found Space Marine CAD models (here, here, here), so really it is about doing models for Eldar stuff..... yeah i know im just trying to build like modified weapons/helmets etc. that have a different feel.... so its a bit easier from the modeling stand point.

On the ideas front, why do the marines/primarch have to involved? Eldar are far more technologyically advanced than humans and if choose to do so they could produce super soldiers with powered eldar armour without any human involvement.

thats a good idea but its too boring and it doesn't get people thinking about it too much. if i would do that i would just say that the Eldar are superior and therefore they can make everything that every other race can and then just pick and choose what i wanted from each race... and doing this just makes people think more and its a bit more controversial... you know basically what would happen is a space marine and a eldar girl got it on





..... thats enough this is a family forum

I tend to agree with bitsandkits that the actually getting to play a game part is the least likely part to work.

However, if your primary intention is to come up with a good backstory or to do some really great modelling, and you do not mind the risk that you will not be able to take the army to a formal game, then I am happy to bounce ideas around.

I don't mind not being able to game but having it as a legitimate army would be nice.... I dont get that much time to game but we shall see....

Give it go, at the the end of the day the 40k universe is big and vast with many things going on.

Though, if it is just the look you want then why not base it pre-heresy, Power Armour existed before the SM and humans did ally before the crusades

thanks! yeah im just trying to make it more of an idea of what can happen between races during this period of tension... i mean if i did it pre-heresy it would be easier but i would say that its kind of me wanting to make it about genetic engineering and all the weird creepy things that go on with that....

In all honesty, you don't need anyone's "blessing" to do what you want with your army. I wouldn't have even posted it on here. As long as you use an official codex, people can't say a single thing.

haha yeah but this kinda needs some peoples input cuz i'm not exactly capable of making it a full blown idea myself... ill have a good idea and then it'll just kinda die. thanks though and yeah the idea is to use an official codex

so im working on getting the 3d models for the Eldar parts going so i can begin fusing them together and creating a 3d model of some of the finished army... i mentioned a 3d printer and what i will be using is a Cupcake CNC Makerbot from Maker Bot Industries (here)... its a pretty cool machine that lets you create any part 10cm x 10cm x 10cm out of ABS plastic (same thing legos are made out of) so its perfect for this kind of use. Thanks everyone!

 

[bitsandkits]

To be honest the fluff side of this project does not interest me in the slightest, the idea of space marine eldar for me is as wrong as you can possibly get in the 40k realm of fiction, it simply goes against the established back stories and fluff of both races,But as i support imagination and originality then what ever you come up is good enough for me.
The part im interested in is the models, im always interested in new ideas and technology in producing minis, obviously computers and rapid prototyping is getting more established for the large companies and casting seems to be on the decline. So what ever you decide please share the processes in volved in great detail with us, if any of your project is link worthy i will also include it on my bits site as alot of modelers may want to try out wat you are intending.
But from a purely personal level mixing Eldar and Marines is Heresy and there is no way either side would allow the union, they would be hunted down by both sides,but maybe you could also add that fact into the back story/fluff.

 

[hungryugolino]

If anyone argues, point out that the RT-era Trader Ultramarine Chief Librarian was an Eldar-human hybrid.

Look it up, it's true!