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Discussion Starter #1
Hi,

I am interested in starting up an eldar army and I like rangers/pathfinders from a fluff, model and rules perspective (at least 3rd ed anyway - haven't seen the new codex yet). I was just wondering if a list which is ranger/pathfinder heavy is viable and what tactics are successful in your experience. Anecdotes more than welcome as are wacky tactics!

All the best and thanks in advance,

Zeldrin
 

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put it this way with 17 pathfinders i took out.

1 dred
1 land speeder
5 scouts
dev squad
tactical squad
terminator hq squad

YEAH they rock

Wound on 2s
5+ = instant death if wounds
wound on a 4 i believe
so unless they have a invunrable save there screwed
and so are light armored vehicle's
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Wow, impressive stuff (both the pathfinders abilities and your performance)! How do you field them. I imagine cover is essential. Do they fall down against close combat orietated armies?
 

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i usually field them behind cover and if its close combat i field them at the back with my close combat troops ready to flank
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks, that certainly makes sense. What kind of things do you bring along with them? I would be trying to make a relatively pure force of rangers/pathfinders. I wouldn't be too bothered about winnig but would like to make a really fluffy army that I would enjoy playing (crashing in a blaze of fluffy glory would be ideal). I wouldn't be looking for too large a force so what would you suggest?
 

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put it this way with 17 pathfinders i took out.

1 dred
1 land speeder
5 scouts
dev squad
tactical squad
terminator hq squad

YEAH they rock

Wound on 2s
5+ = instant death if wounds
wound on a 4 i believe
so unless they have a invunrable save there screwed
and so are light armored vehicle's
They hit on 2+, wound on 4+, and any roll to hit of a 5 or 6 is ap 1.

Pathfinders are very hard to get out of cover since they can get a 2+ cover save if they're in 4+ cover, so the usual plan is to infiltrate them into some 4+ cover with a good view of the battlefield if it's not too close to the enemy. Then you just have them sit and take targets of opportunity. They are highly vulnerable to melee and to flamers/things that ignore cover, but decently effective at killing your enemy if they have low morale. Pathfinders against big ork/gaunt mobs do pretty much nothing (210 points of pathfinders kill an average of 24 points of orks or 20 of gaunts each shooting phase) but against loyalist marines they're highly effective, especially if they're shooty and didn't bring a heavy flamer drop pod dread.
 

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they are a tough unit. Rangers have infiltrate,move through cover and stealth.
For +5 pts ea you can upgrade to Pathfinders to get the scout move and +2 to cover save (2+) max. So either 19 pts ea or 24 pts ea. A bit pricy but a sqd of 10 pathfinders is a very good unit.

MKG--Not instant death if wounds on 5+. Is AP1 but you still get a cover save or invul save if applicable. If fail, you take an auto wnd. So multi wound creatures will not face instant death. It is a str x wpn.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Wow, thanks for the advice guys. They sound like a really potent unit if used correctly. Please do correct me if I am wrong, but a multiple wound creature, lets say a carnifex, gets hit by a pathfinder who gets a 5+ on the wound roll. It would face having all of its wounds stripped due to ap 1? That is incredibly potent. I know pathfinders are weaker against weak units (4+ rule acts against them) and stronger against strong units but still, thats mighty impressive!
 

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I prefer Pathfinders to Rangers, the extra benefits they get are more then worth the extra points cost. Don't forget they become Scouts as Pathfinders.

As for why they are good against Multi wound units.
First, most of the multi wound models I've seen have good armor saves, good toughness or both. Pathfinders ignore toughness when they roll to wound. They also ignore they're own ballistic skill when they roll to hit, at least with the Long Rifle, the pistol they carry uses the BS of the unit. Pathfinders make they're weapons AP1 if you roll a 5+ on your to hit. You still have to make the wound. This means unless the target has an invulnerable save they are taking a wound. Instant death need not apply here.

Cover is essential for a Ranger/Pathfinder squad. If they aren't in cover they're dead or soon will be. Consider where you deploy them, and remember if you upgraded to Pathfinders they get a Scout move and ignore difficult terrain.

How many you field and how you divy them up is your perogative. Smaller squads can be easier to hide in terrain while larger squads get better salvos.

Close combat is their bane, you'll probably get to strike first as you'll be in terrain, but they're Weapon skill is garbage and you'll likely not do much against your opponent. In all my engagements in close combat I have yet to cause a wound in Close combat with my 5 man squad of Pathfinders.

Hordes of enemies will be a definite weakness if you don't have some troops to take them on. Rangers/Pathfinders don't shoot too fast so you'll soon be overwhelmed by the numbers. I tend to try and shoot bigger targets like Monstrous Creatures or harder to kill targets like heavily armored Terminators and the like.

If you've never used Rangers/Pathfinders I highly recommend trying them out. Maybe use a small 5 man squad at first for a while to get used to them. If they work out for you and you like them, go for more.

Good luck and happy hunting.
 

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Wow, thanks for the advice guys. They sound like a really potent unit if used correctly. Please do correct me if I am wrong, but a multiple wound creature, lets say a carnifex, gets hit by a pathfinder who gets a 5+ on the wound roll. It would face having all of its wounds stripped due to ap 1? That is incredibly potent. I know pathfinders are weaker against weak units (4+ rule acts against them) and stronger against strong units but still, thats mighty impressive!
I am pretty sure that AP1 does not strip all wounds from a target with multiple wounds

They'll put wounds on a Carnifex well yes, stuff with high T is what PFs excel against -- but no instant-deathing them.

as was mentioned above, close combat is their bane, the I10 in cover doesn't even help really. But remember against hordes, if they get close enough, you can doubleshot with your shuriken pistols.

King George: seriously this is a forum for a table-top game, be nice.
 

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I am pretty sure that AP1 does not strip all wounds from a target with multiple wounds

They'll put wounds on a Carnifex well yes, stuff with high T is what PFs excel against -- but no instant-deathing them.

as was mentioned above, close combat is their bane, the I10 in cover doesn't even help really. But remember against hordes, if they get close enough, you can doubleshot with your shuriken pistols.

King George: seriously this is a forum for a table-top game, be nice.
but hitting on 2s, wounding on 4's
5'-6 = ap 1 from a guy other side of board hurts

i would be nice if people corrected the mistake i made instead of hghlighting it and making fun of it
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thanks for the clarification and advice. Tres useful. They certainly strike me as a unit worthy of use.
 

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Alright, let's bring it back on topic. Personal attacks will NOT be tolerated!
 

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wow id so want to see a pathfinder army since u can have 6 troop choices thats 60 pathfinders holy sh**and u dont have to worry about high armored vehicles cuz all snipers have special rules that they can take down vehicles.

so if u took 60 pathfinders that would be exactly 1440pts
which leaves you with 560 pts of close combat potential
but this is if ur making a 2000pt army
i think it would be deadly
 

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Sadly Sniper weapons only roll 2d6 against vehicles so only tanks with an Armour Value of 12 or less can be damaged by them.

Some good units to use with them is a couple of Fire Prisms and a squad or 2 of Striking Scorpions as then you can deal with tanks and will fare a bit better against Hordes.
 
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