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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Now in the last couple of month with much debate on falling active members, new threads and posts it has always come down to a few peoples attitude. Therefor I'll start a crusade against just this. As soon I see a post I find rude or impolite in any way in the 'new posts' I'll take a look what gave rise to the reply and point my little flour-white finger at it, not the member behind it but the post itself or urge the first poster to continue in a civilized manner. I hope as many as possible will join me in this crusade!

Special thanks to @nefehet who inspired this with his crusade against unanswered posts.
 

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Well not a bad idea, but I suppose you could get the same result jusy by encouraging people to ignore sarcastic or nasty posts and just crack on with the conversation rather than finger wagging. Of course we should all debate in a civilized manner but things will sometimes get heated and tempers may fray. At the end of the day there is a report button and we do have mods, so while I would not tell you not embark your crusade, I think we should be encouraging Heretics to be more self disciplined and grown up in debate and to ignore and bypass deliberate negative posting. That being said I applaud your stance and integrity to the forum
 

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Now in the last couple of month with much debate on falling active members, new threads and posts it has always come down to a few peoples attitude. Therefor I'll start a crusade against just this.
Not to be a terrible downer or defend the worst action of certain people, but you do realize that people being rude is nothing new to Heresy. In fact, its one of the things the site was founded on: everyone not having to conform to an only nice attitude.

point my little flour-white finger at it, not the member behind it but the post itself or urge the first poster to continue in a civilized manner. I hope as many as possible will join me in this crusade!
So your plan is to make posts highlighting posts you find rude or impolite? Correct me if I'm wrong, but that would mean your plan is to go into threads, essentially post spam, and police the attitude of members?

crusade against unanswered posts.
I thought you were crusading against members attitudes, not unanswered posts?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I know Heresy was founded on the non-censor basis and I respect that. I will more use the aproach and environger people to ignore rude comments being throwing at them to avoid legit threads from becoming pie-throwing contests.
 

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I know Heresy was founded on the non-censor basis and I respect that. I will more use the aproach and environger people to ignore rude comments being throwing at them to avoid legit threads from becoming pie-throwing contests.
although i completely agree with what your trying to do here..and since i joined i have seen some really cool guys quit do to this very thing and i miss chatting with them..
if the mods have not intention to take any action your efforts will be wasted.

unfortunately there will always be haters trollers and assholes that have nothing better to do with themselves than to rip other people down.

i personal feel that the mods will eventually be forced to change their perceptive on this subject if they wish heresy to thrive again..i personal think twice before i post now because i think well whats the point..it will just be derailed for what ever reason..so why waste my breath. and im probably not the only person who feels this way.

you have my support on this..
 

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Our little space on the web is crumbling thats the long and the short of it, things have changed, MODs (some not all) have moved there priorities elsewhere, we have lost some very vocal and influential and prolific posters/members, some have moved because they didnt like what was going on here and others , well lets just say some people didnt like what they had to say, so they got banned despite being a significant driving forces for forum content and discussion, plus changes get made to the site without members being consulted, the rep system change for example, pissed loads of people off, not even sure if the awards system is still running or not, the pets thing,the arcade blah blah.

I keep posting because i love heresy online, despite being told i cant have an opinion because im a trader or that im simply a cunt and biased by the staff, the other places have a much stricter policy about what can be posted,yeah they still have trolls, but they are far more active and have far more members without putting up with the shit @Moriouce mentions above, I used to be a supporter and donated towards the site in the past, but i have stopped handing over money because i dont feel my opinions or presence is wanted and i know im not the only one who feels/felt that way, now i totally get that the website isnt a democracy, but sometimes i think certain people forget that without the members contributing (and there money) there would be no site.



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Not to be a terrible downer or defend the worst action of certain people, but you do realize that people being rude is nothing new to Heresy. In fact, its one of the things the site was founded on: everyone not having to conform to an only nice attitude.
it may have been one of the things the site was founded on but that doesnt mean it was a great idea or that it should carry on,particularity if it could be hurting the site? how do the new owners feel about that founding principle?, personally im pleasant and nice as a default(i hope) in person and online, i dont think its a need to "conform" or check my behavior to post, its perfectly possible to express an opinion about our hobby without being an obtuse cunt and i dont for one minute believe that posting like a rational well balanced adult is "conforming" to anything, all too often certain members have been allowed free reign to be essentially nasty twats and generally unpleasant on the site,while not breaking any direct rules, but at the same time making the place far less friendly and quite unwelcoming to potential new members/lurkers yet to join.



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The site is struggling due to lack of content, random painting blogs and arguments over fluff is not enough to draw people in. Tactics for 7th ed, hobby tutorials and other things of that nature was what drove this place. Nice, mean, angry, happy, and other assorted temperaments don't matter. Content does. Instead of making a thread of this nature every other month, post hobby related content.

The downturn of this site was not the hacker, it was not attitudes. It was 6th, hitting. We never truly updated to that edition. Now we have another edition making us even more out of touch hobbywise. If we went and archived all of the pre 6th content, large sections of this site would suddenly be completely empty.
 

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Pretty much what scscofield says

Niceties and helpfulness wont make one jot of difference. If you want to help increase the appeal of heresy there is only one way and that is content.

We need to post tutorials and tactics guides. That'll feed google, who will bring extra traffic who may decide to join and post.
 

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Our little space on the web is crumbling thats the long and the short of it,
I'm sorry but wow...its almost like certain people have been claiming this for nigh on two years and it still hasn't happened yet.

we have lost some very vocal and influential and prolific posters/members, some have moved because they didnt like what was going on here and others , well lets just say some people didnt like what they had to say, so they got banned despite being a significant driving forces for forum content and discussion,
This is true, we have lost members over time, and some of them did leave because Heresy was no longer a place for them. Others have been made to leave, but for some of them it was for more than just others didn't like what they had to say. I can certainly recall several members essentially harassing others until they left, and then going on to bemoan the state of the forum and how a decline was in no way their doing.

plus changes get made to the site without members being consulted, the rep system change for example, pissed loads of people off,
The rep system was almost constantly abused by select groups of people from day one. From what I saw, it inflated the ego's of certain people and intimidated others; to me it did more harm than good and saw more than enough complaints.

not even sure if the awards system is still running or not,
It is, the staff are actually working on getting them done for the end of the month. A big factor on this one is that Viscount Vash and myself were mostly in charge of getting the awards out, and with Vash generally no longer around and work picking up dramatically these last few months for me, awards to a bit of a hit. That'll be sorted before long though.

the pets thing,the arcade blah blah.
Unfortunate casualties I'm afraid. These were not discussed with the members because there was no discussion to be had. As Heresy has grown and aged through the years, our need to upgrade software cannot be denied. Sadly we were left without choices when it came to those upgrades, one not supporting the arcade and another the pets. We are talking upgrades that have added additional security to the forum, updated scripts, decreased page loading speed, and I'm sure many other things that feel beyond me.

I keep posting because i love heresy online, despite being told i cant have an opinion because im a trader or that im simply a cunt and biased by the staff,
To be fair, and unless I'm mistaken, you have decried third party modelers and come off as rather stubborn when it comes to anything against GW.

it may have been one of the things the site was founded on but that doesnt mean it was a great idea or that it should carry on,particularity if it could be hurting the site?
Well seeing as we've done this since the start, and people only now appear to be having a problem with it, I think the question to be asked isn't how can we change the people who are 'being rude' or 'impolite' and instead who suddenly thinks this is a problem.


how do the new owners feel about that founding principle?,
Well given that they have kept everything in place and demanded no changes as of yet, I don't think they have a problem with it.

all too often certain members have been allowed free reign to be essentially nasty twats and generally unpleasant on the site,while not breaking any direct rules, but at the same time making the place far less friendly and quite unwelcoming to potential new members/lurkers yet to join.
And unfortunately when members act that way, others choose to try and take matters into their own hands rather than report the problem and trust in the staff far more often than not. Hard for things to get better when everyone is trying to remove the things that they don't like.
 

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Pretty much what scscofield says

Niceties and helpfulness wont make one jot of difference. If you want to help increase the appeal of heresy there is only one way and that is content.

We need to post tutorials and tactics guides. That'll feed google, who will bring extra traffic who may decide to join and post.
yes post more content...but whats the point if people are just allowed to rip wht ever content you post down?
this to me is a double edge sword..while people are allowed to abuse intimidate etc why would people want to post? is it really that hard to see?
i keep reading post content post content and people will join...maybe.but what about the lurkers that are reading old posts and see the level of abuse that can be allowed to be left unchecked?
thats what i feel stops people from joining..they see it read it and probably think nah not worth it.

and as for how the site was founded on "freedom" there is a difference between abusiveness and freedom of speech. im all for difference of opinion..but you should be able to convey your opinion WITHOUT having to verbally debase people.
 

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Fuck sake lads, Heresy is about the friendliest place on the web for us geeks, sure things get heated and you get some sarky or meanish posts put I have yet to see anything that would make you cry yourself to sleep, you have a report button you have the best option of just not replying to a shitty post, just ignore it, we are not here to just positively reinforce each other, this is not a self help group. Yes lets not end up like some of the more elitist snobbish forums, lets have good clean hobby debate but lets keep it grounded, I have locked horns with a few members but I never take it personal, if someone pisses you off with a shitty post just treat it like a minefield, mark it, move around it, and carry on!
 

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Fuck sake lads, Heresy is about the friendliest place on the web for us geeks, sure things get heated and you get some sarky or meanish posts put I have yet to see anything that would make you cry yourself to sleep, you have a report button you have the best option of just not replying to a shitty post, just ignore it, we are not here to just positively reinforce each other, this is not a self help group. Yes lets not end up like some of the more elitist snobbish forums, lets have good clean hobby debate but lets keep it grounded, I have locked horns with a few members but I never take it personal, if someone pisses you off with a shitty post just treat it like a minefield, mark it, move around it, and carry on!
course thats what makes this entertaining aswell.....no people dont always want snippy comments but to be fair, if gonna post without your facts as well...better be prepared for the corrections, which in turn lead to others agreeing/disagreeing and thats when the fireworks can start. like Oldman says, remember where not to put the foot, watch out for the tripwire and get on with life.
 

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Well it may not exactly be content but I postes a rumour and got asked for a source or it was just bullshit
well, if i offended you i am sorry. for the records it was "bulldust", and yes, i still think that :) you know, tomorrow GW will release an emperor titan plastic kit. source is me. Anyhow...sorry again and back on topic.
scscofield has it right i think, there is no new content about 6th ed, let alone 7th ed. Maybe i am a bit obtuse and maybe i'm a bad person, but i think that "abusive" and "offensive" have stayed the same since 2012 (year i joined) or even reduced due to banning of certain people: what has changed is that users seems to be more edgy (not everyone, but...)
I say: you don't like it? ignore it, report it, don't feed the shitstorm. Also, don't be an asshole yourself. That's it. Stop bitching. Report to the mods. Also, there is an arcane device called Private Message, where you can state to the offender your peculiar state of mind without causing a thread to derail. Use it. Or maybe not.
 

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I'm sorry but wow...its almost like certain people have been claiming this for nigh on two years and it still hasn't happened yet.
i didnt say it was dead and buried i said it was crumbling, and its far from the vibrant lively place it was say three years ago is it?


This is true, we have lost members over time, and some of them did leave because Heresy was no longer a place for them. Others have been made to leave, but for some of them it was for more than just others didn't like what they had to say. I can certainly recall several members essentially harassing others until they left, and then going on to bemoan the state of the forum and how a decline was in no way their doing.
yes and some were given the boot because they spoke out against the staff, now i get heresy isnt a democracy, but when members have contributed both content and cash,there opinions and feelings should be given a little more thought

The rep system was almost constantly abused by select groups of people from day one. From what I saw, it inflated the ego's of certain people and intimidated others; to me it did more harm than good and saw more than enough complaints.

the whole point of the rep system is to inflate peoples ego's, while it was in place i was very active in the paint and modelling sections as i could give people a reward,ok its was a pointless virtual cookie but that reward lead to people posting about the hobby,and encouraged them to carry on doing so, taking it away effectively killed it and bringing it back just made a mockery of it

It is, the staff are actually working on getting them done for the end of the month. A big factor on this one is that Viscount Vash and myself were mostly in charge of getting the awards out, and with Vash generally no longer around and work picking up dramatically these last few months for me, awards to a bit of a hit. That'll be sorted before long though.

To be fair there seem to be quite a few absent staff,some are certainly committed to other wargame forums/blogs but not so much to heresy,none of my business to be fair, but its hard to take a MOD or admin seriously if they are not active on the forum they are a mod (while being active elsewhere) or participating in the hobby(GW games mainly as we are a 40k focused)
Just saying


Unfortunate casualties I'm afraid. These were not discussed with the members because there was no discussion to be had. As Heresy has grown and aged through the years, our need to upgrade software cannot be denied. Sadly we were left without choices when it came to those upgrades, one not supporting the arcade and another the pets. We are talking upgrades that have added additional security to the forum, updated scripts, decreased page loading speed, and I'm sure many other things that feel beyond me.
fair point,i just miss some of the arcade and chat etc

To be fair, and unless I'm mistaken, you have decried third party modelers and come off as rather stubborn when it comes to anything against GW.
As i have said in the past this is a myth, people think i have an issue with third party modelers, i do not, there are plenty of products out in wargame land that could be used in GW games that i think are excellent(so much so i have even bought and sold them on bits and kits), but sadly there are also a shit ton of poor ass low quality poorly sculpted trash being pumped out as alternatives for GW minis that people have a huge boner for simply because they see it as sticking it to the man( the man being GW), plus if i ever post an opinion about a product im careful to make it factual and based on comparison with other minis in other ranges or the mini its trying to compete with within GWs range, i dont just walk into a thread and say "Thats a load of shit the GW mini is better" and walk out again.
But hey im just a biased cunt at the end of the day


Well seeing as we've done this since the start, and people only now appear to be having a problem with it, I think the question to be asked isn't how can we change the people who are 'being rude' or 'impolite' and instead who suddenly thinks this is a problem.
i think your missing the point, the people who think its a problem are likely not here anymore,but maybe the rudeness and "say it as you see it" is keeping people from joining and staying?


Well given that they have kept everything in place and demanded no changes as of yet, I don't think they have a problem with it.
maybe that will change when they read this thread

And unfortunately when members act that way, others choose to try and take matters into their own hands rather than report the problem and trust in the staff far more often than not. Hard for things to get better when everyone is trying to remove the things that they don't like.

now as someone who is familiar with the report button, i feel confident in saying that people might take things into there own hands a little more readily on this site than others, as quite often there is no visible evidence that a Mod has done anything about the reported incident, i myself reported a rule violation very recently and have had no reply or word about the report and the offending post is still visible for all to see, and this is a direct result of our "say what you want we are all adults here" founding principle, I would also say in past it feel like the mods are slow to act even when its clear that someone is doing there damn best wind up members and start a fight or is just actually breaking the rules, again the relaxed approach to what people can say i think is part of that.
But every time people take matters into there own hands we get the same mantra, "ignore it report it", but maybe instead the mantra should be "report it we will deal with it" and then a mod must actively feedback to the member who placed the report about what if anything is gonna get done,that way the report button might start getting used if the members feel it has an effect or that they are not being ignored (not saying they are , im saying thats how it feels)

the opening thread was about a friendlier Heresy, to be honest i cant see how that can ever be a bad thing or to be resisted?, if your happy with it already thats cool, but clearly some people feel its not as happy as it could be and if im honest that should be a concern? then again its all got very serious around here so im gonna end by saying "tits ass boobs"


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well, if i offended you i am sorry. for the records it was "bulldust", and yes, i still think that :) you know, tomorrow GW will release an emperor titan plastic kit. source is me. Anyhow...sorry again and back on topic.
scscofield has it right i think, there is no new content about 6th ed, let alone 7th ed. Maybe i am a bit obtuse and maybe i'm a bad person, but i think that "abusive" and "offensive" have stayed the same since 2012 (year i joined) or even reduced due to banning of certain people: what has changed is that users seems to be more edgy (not everyone, but...)
I say: you don't like it? ignore it, report it, don't feed the shitstorm. Also, don't be an asshole yourself. That's it. Stop bitching. Report to the mods. Also, there is an arcane device called Private Message, where you can state to the offender your peculiar state of mind without causing a thread to derail. Use it. Or maybe not.
i wasnt offend old bean, if i had been i would have sent you a poo in the post :wink:, i was however using your post as an example of how easily it could offend, now granted i dont know that you would have posted differently if say someone with less than say 20 posts had posted the rumour, but i hope you can see that potentially your post could have put someone off posting a rumour in the future?

you could be right about the content, but again we come around to why people who are active in 40k are not posting content, what is it about the site that stops them posting Batreps/lists/rules/new models etc etc ?
could it be threads like this?
http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=153577
well not the thread but more the content of the first three pages, ironically this was one of our forums most active threads in the 40k section of the site, food for thought maybe.



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you could be right about the content, but again we come around to why people who are active in 40k are not posting content, what is it about the site that stops them posting Batreps/lists/rules/new models etc etc ?
mmh, i guess it's all a matter of scarce time. The average user here is not the 15-18 years old guy who has lots of free time. From what i read, 50% + of the users work or have trouble finding a job...which means that many of us have not so much time to think a coherent strategy article or something along the line. About me i say i'm too lazy to write a report or an article in english language. plain good old lazyness.
 

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