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Executive Nitpicker
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Discussion Starter #1
Well, with rumors circulating about the combat squads rule that may or may not be in the DA codex, I figured, why not talk about it a bit in speciffic.

For a start, just what the heck is the combat squad rule supposed to mean?

Well, the one thing everyone seems to agree on is that squads of 10 will be able to split inot 2 5-man combat squads.

What else?
Anyone have any ideas/rumors/opinion on what this should mean?

Will we gtet to double up on special/heavy weapons? Will we be limited to only special or heavy in 5 man squads?

Will we be stuck with 5 or 10 man squads only, or will we still get to make regular squads?

I heard that they;ll be limited to 1 special in 5 man and only get a heavy option oin 10 man squads. If that happens to be true, it'll really mess with the popular las/plas mini-squad. A lot of people would have to adjust their tactics
 

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Premium Member
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well it all stem's from 2nd edition when you could split a 10 man squad into two combat squads. The heavy weapon could then cover the guys moving forward to get there meltagun/flamer into range. It seems like the DA books going to be how marines should have been. with rhino's supposedly cheaper and drop pods more expensive.
 

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I big problem with the combat squad ability is the rumor says they must stay in a 10-man squad to gain heavy weapons, which annihilates the use for doing it. They would really only be good to split for fodder or hold assault away from the other half.

Khaine
 

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Executive Nitpicker
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Discussion Starter #4
Would both halves be consideres scoring units, or would they all have to be together to score? That's an important consideration too.

And yeah, if you have to go to 10 men to get the heavy weapon, that would most certainly suck.
 

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From every source I've seen so far, it seems to work thus:

You need to purchase x marines to get a special.

You need to purchase 10 marines to get a Heavy Weapon.

Once you have purchased these, they may be split into groups of five.

You need ten marines to get the Heavy, but they don't have to stay as ten marines thereafter.

Of course, the atual rule probably looks nothing like what anyone thinks.
 

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Porn King!!!
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Everything I have heard points to that as well. And I already know a few players around town that are bitching like nobody's business about it. Course, the rest of us don't mind at all lol.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I;m guessing 6 man las/plas will be replaced with either 5 man plas gun (or maybe melta), or 10 man las/plas/fist, putting the PF sarge in charge of the olter boys.
 

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This will cause issues with mech marine armies but I like it for my marine list. I hate the 6 man las/plas setup, it's been done to death and I personally think its less effective than people would like to think (yes, i'm crazy for even suggesting it I know). Unfortunatly, I agree that this will probably just lead to 5 man las + 5 man plas or melta and pf sarge. Replace one cookie cutter list with another.
 

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Well, that's just stupid...

for only 30pts more you can get two 6-man Tac squads with one heavy weapon/one assault weapon each. Be buggered if I'm gonna split a 10-man squad (which is basically a waste anyway) in half.

Nope. 6-man squads it is...
 

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Welll, that's just stupid...

for only 30pts more you can get two 6-man Tac squads with one heavy weapon/one assault weapon each. Be buggered if I'm gonna split a 10-man squad (which is basically a waste anyway) in half.
True the six man Las/Plas Is still cheaper and more efficient, especially for us BA's players with Vet Sgts!
Apparently with the DA codex the split squads still need to be taken under 5 models COMBINED to become non-scoring so this method potentially enbables you to bulk out your troop section to the tune of 12! scoring units
Could have that cheap rhino with the five man Fist/Melta while the Las squad sits back and blasts away.
 

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Executive Nitpicker
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Discussion Starter #11
If both halves count as scoring units, it might not be such a bad thing...but it;s still going to fuck with a lot of lists

It'll also end up cutting into Blood Angels death companies since instead of, say, one unit of assault scouts and two small shooty tac squads, we'll have one unit of scouts and a 10 man tact squad. One less DC roll.

I suppose we'll have to make black rage rolls seperately for each half. That'll probably balance out either way.

From the sound of the DA rules, ICs won't be shackled to their retinues anymore...that might be a side-effect of the combat squad rule. I wonder how that'll impact tactics?

Won't do much for BA since our retinues are overpriced and almost never used, and takign the chaplain out of the DC is silly, but I could see, say giving a librarian an infiltrating retinue and then infiltrate them into different positions sot he heavy weapons in the command squad can line up on the tank and the librarian can get in on that pesky daemon prince with his jump pack...

<sniffles> BA don;t get special skills
 

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blahblahblahblah
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I love this rule, its realistic to real military tactics, splitting the squad in half and leapfrogging to advance, one moves one covers etc.

Personally the 6man lascannon+Plasma gun thing sucks, I like 10 man squads with 1 or 2 Plasma guns or Meltaguns, heavy weapons be damned, you have enough on Dreads and Tanks and Devvie squads, especially now I can finally use the Mortis class dreadnoughts yay.

all in all rule sounds great to me.

and BA don't get special rules because they suck ok LOL
 

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Executive Nitpicker
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Discussion Starter #13
We don;t get special skills because every model gets Furious charge for free. I;ve had enemies shit their pants at the sight of eight charging scouts ripping tanks apart with bare hands and a powerist ;-)

I;d rather have tw special weapons in a squad sometimes too, but you can only ever do that if you take the right traits. So I go wiht one heavy and one special because I don;t like wasting slots.
 

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Well i heard from my regional manager of games workshop that space marines might be getting a new rule book and i heard also that assault cannons are going to get 1 less shot and maybe strength 5 instead of 4 strength 6 shots but enough of that i also heard that in the new book you will be able to choose with 2 heavy or 2 special weapons in the combat squads but thats what my gw regional manager told me so you never know he may just be trying to lead us off
 

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This rule is only for the Dark Angels as far as we know.

There have been no creditable rumours about the marine re-vamp and I dont think there is any real ground swell of opinion wanting one.

IMO the marine codex is fine as it is, the AC may be slightly over powered but if you think that will make GW roll over and re-write a two year old book to please power gamers who are being out powergamed I believe you are mistaken.

The rule in the Dark Angel codex will just make the chapter nice and charachterfull not nerf all the other chapters not mentioned.
 

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Why shouldn't we think they'll roll over? They rolled over and changed an FAQ to please the Tyranid players, directly contrdicting the Tyranid codex. All it would take is an FAQ statement saying that the Combat squad rules in the DA codex now apply to all Marine armies across the board.
 

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There are enough jackasses out there who rely on the five-strong squad with a plasma rifle and a heavy weapon in their Space Marine army to outwhine the whining about combat squads, since Combat Squads can't have both things in them.

On a more practical note though... the Combat Squads aren't as tactically flexible as the standard Space Marine Tactical Squad, since you have either five or ten models, and can't really make good use of a more middle-ground squad with six or eight like some Space Marine armies do.
 

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don_mondo said:
Why shouldn't we think they'll roll over? They rolled over and changed an FAQ to please the Tyranid players, directly contrdicting the Tyranid codex. All it would take is an FAQ statement saying that the Combat squad rules in the DA codex now apply to all Marine armies across the board.
In my opinion, it will happen when my arse heals. :lol:
 

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the cabbage said:
don_mondo said:
Why shouldn't we think they'll roll over? They rolled over and changed an FAQ to please the Tyranid players, directly contrdicting the Tyranid codex. All it would take is an FAQ statement saying that the Combat squad rules in the DA codex now apply to all Marine armies across the board.
In my opinion, it will happen when my arse heals. :lol:
Where should we send the band-aids?? And what size should we send??
 
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