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My own theory is that the 4 main gods of chaos we know dont exist out of the milky way but the warp does.

I think the immaterium is just some sort of psychic echo of sentience so the reason we cant travel outside the milky way is because theirs no sentient beings for millions of light years outside it. But if you could get to another galaxy filled with sentients then warp travel would be possible again.

In terms of the chaos gods I think their would be different chaos gods in different galaxies that would echo the emotions of that galaxies inhabitants
 

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If you look in the chaos daemons codex it somtimes references that the chaos gods powers extend 'across the universes' (I think one reference states that nurgle spreads his plagues across different universes).

It would be kind of dumb to think that the most powerful of the warps inhabitants are restricted to a small part of existance, in all likelyhood they probably fight their 'great game' in other galaxies just like they do in the 40k one. In fact it wouldnt take a leap of logic to assume that the tyranids were somehow made by another extragalactic race to fight chaos seeing as it is so dangerous, of course if that was the case they obviously didnt take into account that they're creations would eat them afterwards.

So yeah, it would be consistant to assume they are all over the universe and beyond, as long as there are sentinent races feeling emotions then they wouldnt ever rly go hungary.
 

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I'm going to say that it really depends on the extent of power the other galaxies have in terms of race/empire growth. Because the old ones are the oldest besides for the C'tan, I tend to think that other galaxies don't have powerful of societies as most of the races like the eldar and surviving races made by the old ones are for the most part accounted for and really don't have that much power.

The birth of Slaanesh which is also is the key point in the galaxy where warp storms made the Imperium almost fall apart. The birth basically made chaos emerge into the galaxy. And that birth made so by the growth of the Eldar race.

Unless the old ones aren't really the oldest race in the galaxy their predecessors are basically the strongest powers and their galaxies are more/have been effected by chaos.

Yet, we will probably never truly know, we can only assume or guess certain things.
 

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If time has no meaning to them why should space. Of course they have sway outside the 40k universe. Slannesh probably blew up Cripton.
 

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Because they would need a warp rift to spread their influence through space.
So who is to say they don't exist in other galaxies? You seem to be of the opinion that the only powerful civilisations are the ones created by the Old Ones, but 1) they're merely one of the oldest corporeal races in this galaxy, who's to say they don't have contemporaries in other galaxies?, and 2) humanity is a powerful civilisation and beyond some minor tampering with our extremely distant ancestors we've had no contact with the Old Ones.

I consider it entirely likely that there are races in other galaxies that reached a similar advancement as that of the Eldar or Necrontyr.
 

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wasnt i mentioned in mechanicum? that the star gods were worshipped in other galaxies but other beings so potentially whats to say the chaos gods cant have the same sort of radius of power. i know they are made of different stuff but they still have alot of power and come from a plain that can bend time and space so it quite possible they could do it universe-wide.
 

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I`m not exactly sure how wide the c`tan`s influence was at their peak. They probably had the potential to move to other galaxies. Their technology allows them to navigate the stars incredibly fast without such risks of warp travel and relativity.

Then again, there is more than likely star gods still living in incorporeal form in galaxies across the universe. The same mistakes made by the necrontyr could have been made anywhere else by anone else in the right circumstances, but until we receive more info we will have to assume that the star gods we know of stayed within the Milky Way.

New codex may shed some more light on the c`tan story.

...So we`ll probably never know... :cray:
 

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im sure it wont be long before one of the fluff gods sets everyone straight about this.
 

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GFP has been closest to the mark, as far as i can tell. the warp is a reflection of the 'emotional state' of the real universe. it is a dull and inanimate place with exactly the same dimensions as the mortal realm without uncontrolled emotions. it is emotions that create the eddies and currents that distort the warp, making faster than light travel possible and creating daemons and 'gods'. the Chaos Gods as we understand them are mere reflections of our universe's emotional state, they do not exist in other universes because we do not exist in other universes. though, as others have pointed out it seems logical to assume that other galaxies have their own, local versions of Chaos Gods, but as we know nothing about these we cannot say anything for certain.

the simple truth is that 40k is far more parochial than many of us would like it to be. everything about the game takes place within the the milkyway (with the exception of the origin of the Tyranids). the distances between our galaxy and even our closest neighbour, make any exploration simply untenable, even with the in-game mechanics of faster-than-light travel.

although we refer to them as 'gods' the Chaos deities are no such thing. they are just beings that are very alien to us. they are 'mortal'; they do have life spans; the current four dominant gods have not always been and it seems unlikely that they will continue to do so indefinitely. and the 'star gods' are the least godly of all the alien creatures that claim to be. they don't even have a decent explanation of where they get their 'power' from or in what form it appears. considering that up until they got in contact with the Necrontyr they had no way of interacting with material things, they seem to know an awful lot about it.

and as a final aside, the Warhammer World and the 40kiverse are clearly connected. the Skulltaker that fights along side the World Eaters, is the same Skulltaker that marches against the Old World. you couldn't get much more of an explicit connections than characters appearing in both. whether you like the idea or not is irrelevant, the two are connected.
 

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GFP has been closest to the mark, as far as i can tell. the warp is a reflection of the 'emotional state' of the real universe. it is a dull and inanimate place with exactly the same dimensions as the mortal realm without uncontrolled emotions. it is emotions that create the eddies and currents that distort the warp, making faster than light travel possible and creating daemons and 'gods'. the Chaos Gods as we understand them are mere reflections of our universe's emotional state, they do not exist in other universes because we do not exist in other universes. though, as others have pointed out it seems logical to assume that other galaxies have their own, local versions of Chaos Gods, but as we know nothing about these we cannot say anything for certain.
Wait. When you say 'we' do you mean humanity? And did you mean to say the Chaos Gods are not present in other Galaxies or Universes?

If you meant it's because humanity is not present then I have to say- what a load of bollocks.
Humanity is not the only race that Chaos feeds off nor were we the ones who created the turbulence in the Warp leading to their existence.

and as a final aside, the Warhammer World and the 40kiverse are clearly connected. the Skulltaker that fights along side the World Eaters, is the same Skulltaker that marches against the Old World. you couldn't get much more of an explicit connections than characters appearing in both. whether you like the idea or not is irrelevant, the two are connected.
I also believe they're connected but as alternate realities, since GW have explicitly stated that Fantasy and 40K do not exist in the same universe (and the Warhammer Fantasy World is so obviously a variation of Earth).
 

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Given the power that the gods have accumulated in this galaxy, it is entirely possible that they could then exert some influence over a neighbouring galaxy, then beginning the process anew as knowledge of their existence spreads the belief in them. They could then feed on more emotion spawned from that/those galaxies as well, if they`re not already.

Assuming of course, that the tyranids left anything out there... :p
 

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although we refer to them as 'gods' the Chaos deities are no such thing.
That of course depends entirely on your definition of the term.

An extract from The First Heretic is interesting in this regard:


they are just beings that are very alien to us. they are 'mortal'; they do have life spans; the current four dominant gods have not always been and it seems unlikely that they will continue to do so indefinitely.
Yet at the same time they are immortal, they are eternal and the current four dominant gods have always been.
 

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Yet at the same time they are immortal, they are eternal and the current four dominant gods have always been.
I would argue against this. The chaos gods did not exist before the emergence of sentient life, and even then had no real power until long after the war in heaven.

Bear in mind that the eldar pantheon held sway for many millennia during the reign of the eldar empire, only when Slaanesh was born did the chaos gods become dominant.

Without a doubt, they were strong, but they were opposed. Really the only reason they`re so powerful now is because there`s no real competition anymore. (one prankster and a pair of big green yobbos is not a real threat)


Therefore, it is my belief that the gods are not immortal. They were born, they can die (at least in theory) and depend on sentient life to sustain themselves.


And before you say time is meaningless in the warp (yet again) answer me this:


If time does not flow in the warp, how can you apply a term like immortal or eternal to the gods? Both terms require a flow of time to be relevant. :read:
 

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I also believe they're connected but as alternate realities, since GW have explicitly stated that Fantasy and 40K do not exist in the same universe (and the Warhammer Fantasy World is so obviously a variation of Earth).
They're simply on different levels of the tower. :laugh:
 

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I would argue against this. The chaos gods did not exist before the emergence of sentient life, and even then had no real power until long after the war in heaven.
The entire point is that even though the Chaos Gods are the sum of sentient life's emotion, and thus must have came into existence at a time when enough sentient life (with a strong enough connection to the warp) were present in the galaxy (during the war in heaven likely), at the same time they have always existed within the warp (even before the rise of the Old Ones) and also at the same time don't exist and have never existed at all.

The whole point is the inconceivability of the warp and chaos in general. We are not suppossed to understand the Chaos Gods, hence why we are told things like they are the manfiestations of mortal emotions (and thus would obviously only have come into existence post-war in heaven), but also that they are eternal, and yet at the same time have never existed at all. In a similar way the warp was once calm and serine (during the reign of the Old Ones) but at the same time chaos and the warp are the same thing and indivisible, thus chaos existed and the warp was a raging torrent during the reign of the Old Ones as well as being calm and easily accessible.

That is what im trying to get at, the warp is utterly beyond our comprehension. It cannot be reasoned via our material bias, we are bound by time and space, chaos isn't.

And before you say time is meaningless in the warp (yet again) answer me this:

If time does not flow in the warp, how can you apply a term like immortal or eternal to the gods? Both terms require a flow of time to be relevant. :read:
When I applied those terms to the Chaos Gods, I was trying to convey their inconceivability (as described above).

Whilst I said they are eternal (which is correct, considering they are without beginning or end and are ceaseless), I also acknowledged dick's point that they are 'mortal' (because they do have life spans and came into being at a particular point in time), and I also recognise that they are neither because they don't exist and have never existed at all, and that they are a complete fabrication.

They are all three (eternal, mortal and a complete fabrication) at the same time.
 

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i know that Slannesh was created from the desires and hedonism of the Eldar and thus when he/she came into force it began the fall of the Eldar but what about the other three how did they actually come into existence or does no one know, just curious as it seems to me that thier power stretches far and wide
 

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*Taking into account CotE's point that time is a bit insane in the warp:

I believe (correct me if I'm wrong), Khorne was the first* of the gods to fully awaken. Can't remember where I read/heard that from though.

I'd guess Nurgle would have been next*, followed by Tzeentch. It seems to me that despair, depression, fear(?) and all those other lovely things Nurgle stands for would have been more prevalent in the past*, rather than the elaborate planning, scheming and hope that Tzeentch likes. But that's just my take on it.

Unlike Khorne I don't think it's ever stated whether Nurgle or Tzeentch awakened first*.
 

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hm would explain why Khorne and Slannesh dislike each other aside from the obvious the younger in my opinion seems to be on a par with the blood god power wise with murder closley linked to sex and drugs, violence the same and blood definatly the same just my opinion
 

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I am going to take the position that the Chaos 'Gods' do not exist outside of the Milky Way, and that they are not mortal, immortal, or anything in between. They are incorporeal manifestations of the Milky Way's denizen sentient's emotions. Each 'God' is a concentration of collected emotion that has been psychically expressed enough by civilizations with a psychic in the Warp.

For all we know, in the Andromeda galaxy, their could be a civilization that feels emotions entirely beyond our comprehension as human beings (fluff-wise, anyway), so those emotions would collect and manifest there to produce a 'God'. This was how Slaanesh was 'born' as the collective sum of the Eldar's hedonism destroyed their civilization. This also proves that a concentration of emotions like this has effects on the Warp, a la the Eye of Terror, not that a entity was actually created.

For all we know, a 'God' could be 'growing' on the basis of the Imperium's zeal and faith, and completely unrelated from the Emperor. If humanity exists when they reach their psychic zenith, perhaps the faith in the Emperor over the thousands of years will concentrate itself and produce some unknown effect on the Warp.
 
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