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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok. I have played Templars since their new codex came out 4 years ago, however I defected to other armies, then to fantasy, then to Guard and have now come full circle to Templars. The lore, iconography and the badassery of Black Templars is ultimately what makes them the best, especially since they are a rarity. I resurrected my old list a couple of months ago: altered it for new rules, played a some games and have been constantly altering it so we here have version VI. Any criticism would be greatly appreciated as I want this list to be as competitive as possible!


HQ:
Emperor's Champion - 140
Accept Any Challenge, No Matter The Odds


Troops:
Crusader Squad - 106
5xInitiates
Plasma Cannon
Plasma Gun


Crusader Squad - 205
7xInitiates
1xNeophyte
Power Fist
Melta Gun
Dedicated transport - Rhino
Extra Armour
Smoke Launchers


Crusader Squad - 205
7xInitiates
1x Neophyte
Power Fist
Melta Gun
Dedicated transport - Rhino
Extra Armour
Smoke Launchers



Fast Attack:
5xAssault Marines - 140
Power Weapon
2xPlasma Pistols
Melta Bombs


Land Speeder - 75
Multi Melta
Heavy Flamer



Heavy Support
Preditor Destructor - 128
Las Cannons
Smoke Launcher



GRAND TOTAL - 999pts

Ok the Plan:
Emperor's Champion - Character Killer with 4x WS6 S6 I5 PW attacks and a 2+/4++ save! Go in Crusader Squad 3 and targets enemy combat HQ. The idea being at 90pts he can get his hits in. He will inevitably get targetted, but should consume all the opponent's attacks, after which the powerfist-armed guy next to him insta-deaths the enemy HQ.

Crusader Squad 1 - Fire support. Hold a table quarter at the back and shoot light vehicles and MEQ

Crusader Squad 2 - Mount in Rhino: move 12", pop smoke, then move 12" again. This unit is all about getting into the enemy lines asap. Get melta shots off at any passing vehicles, (especially combat walkers)

Crusader Squad 3 - Mount in Rhino: move 12", pop smoke, then move 12" again. Preferably use this squad to deal with enemy heros, getting into enemy lines simultaneously with Crusader Squad to so as to over-whelm the enemies defences. Get melta shots off at any passing vehicles, (especially combat walkers)

Assault Marines - This unit will not deep strike. The plan is for these beauties to fly out of LoS of any enemy firepower (some nice intersecting cover) and then provide 1 of 2 jobs: (1) wait for the footsloggers to make it to enemy lines before blasting over to provide support or (2) Charge a valuable high-firepower unit then harass enemy lines so as the crusader squads suffer less withering fire.

Land Speeder - Deep stikes down, targetting high-value enemy vehicles. If none are left, attack entrenched enemy units and hassle the enemy.

Preditor Destuctor - Anti Tank with Lascannons and auto cannon for more effective light tank popping/MC killing.


Ok, any thoughts? All comments and criticisms will be gratefully recieved.
 

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It looks pretty solid. I love assault marines but they just are not as competitive as they should be. Maybe fraud them for a dreadnought? But what you have looks pretty good. You'll have to let me know how it works.

Good warring.
 

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I'm not sure I'm a fan of non-av14 mechlar. Our transports just cost too much and we get too little out of them.
I like the plascanplas squad, neat idea, I always go lasplas but I think you might have some merit there.

The emperor's champ will be in a rhino? Ugh. The problem with mobile templar in this fashion is you're rolling ld8 everytime you get shot, so slightly less than 50% of the time you lose a unit as it run backward.
I'd might suggest ditching both rhino bound squads and instead taking a large squad, with a chaplain if you can afford the points(grants you ability to never fall back, rage an extra 3" and rage at the enemy you WANT TO rage at!) all this for about the same price.

I'd probably drop the heavy flamer on the landspeeder, just too pricey. The LS is built to pop tanks you've already got infantry killing in the form of dudes.
 

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I am a big fan of the Pred Destructor with lascannons sponsons.
I also think your two main crusader squads are correctly set up although I personally add more neophytes (6+3 usually)
As much as I'd like Assault marines to be efficient, they just ain't.
You might have a better plan than me but I have never found them really useful. Get shot from afar when I deploy them and thanks to the god dices, never ever miss an opportunity to deviate as far as possible from the originally planned deep strike position
This said, I am not sure if a Dread would suit your list...
You might want to consider a cheap reclusiarch to go with one crusader squad (with neophytes :grin: ) to increase your combat power
 

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As cool as assault marines are, they just dont work...:(, as the other guys have said, dreddies are always good, but one thing i never go to war without (besides my lrc...but sometimes i do....and i die a little inside :'(...haha) is a vindicator. It scares everyone silly and provides anti-everything fire and can deny the enemy whole areas of he battlefield. Just my thoughts.

Oh and I love the double plas support squads, use em all the time! They are awesome, you sit them on an objective, any troops or scary termies that happen to wander in are just toasted!. They can also deal with enemy armour as well,surprisingly good vs imperial guard Valkyries :D. AND....if you are really sneaky, and your opponent doesn't know templars well, they sometimes assume they are devastators and cannot capture! But if they do ask, you must tell...

Another idea is....say you dropped the assault marines, you could pick up another rhino squad oOR take a 6 man razorback squad (Bolters, plasma gun and heavy bolter...i like taking this for fast moving fire upport and enemy objective take and holders...) with lascannon turret, this gives you the long range anti tank as well as more troops, which are essential in 5th ed, and also, because it is dedicated, it can hold the marines inside and still capture!! fun! lol

All in all a pretty solid list, id very much enjoy playing it/against it, nice and fast and manoeuvrable, you can keep it as and it would still be a competitive build! Congrats!

Happy Hunting
Mendark
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
It looks pretty solid. I love assault marines but they just are not as competitive as they should be. Maybe fraud them for a dreadnought? But what you have looks pretty good. You'll have to let me know how it works.
As much as I'd like Assault marines to be efficient, they just ain't.
You might have a better plan than me but I have never found them really useful. Get shot from afar when I deploy them and thanks to the god dices, never ever miss an opportunity to deviate as far as possible from the originally planned deep strike position
This said, I am not sure if a Dread would suit your list...
You might want to consider a cheap reclusiarch to go with one crusader squad (with neophytes :grin: ) to increase your combat power
Lots of hate for Assault Marines :p , but I've only had one game where they didn't make their points back (and that was my idiocy more than anything). I've found that if you advance them behind the rhino so the enemy can't get LoS to them, as opposed to deep striking them, they make it into enemy lines. I use them for one purpose main purpose - AV14 popping. The 5 melta-bombs of hilarity has got me 3 vindicators, 2 Land Raiders, 2 Leman Russ and a preditor. Even better, the squad then hides behind the wreckage of the vehicle, limiting casulaties. That being said, I could swap this unit for a venerable dreadnought or Marshal. Of the two, I would be more inclined towards the dreadnought as the rush of rhinos and dready could work, however I wonder if the dreadnought will be too slow and fall prey to enemy AT fire once the Rhinos have disembarked their troops (which is normally in turn 2, at which point the dreadnought will still be lumbering up the field)


I'm not sure I'm a fan of non-av14 mechlar. Our transports just cost too much and we get too little out of them.
I like the plascanplas squad, neat idea, I always go lasplas but I think you might have some merit there.
I don't think they're that expensive. Basically it stops them getting shot for the 2-3 turns it takes to cross the board, in which time you'd lose more than 6 neophytes, hence making a saving. I also use the rhinos to provide cover from fire, and if there's one things templars love, it's cover. I did have footsloggers, but found that at 1000pts this worked better :)



The emperor's champ will be in a rhino? Ugh. The problem with mobile templar in this fashion is you're rolling ld8 everytime you get shot, so slightly less than 50% of the time you lose a unit as it run backward.
I'd might suggest ditching both rhino bound squads and instead taking a large squad, with a chaplain if you can afford the points(grants you ability to never fall back, rage an extra 3" and rage at the enemy you WANT TO rage at!) all this for about the same price.
I don't know anything about an extra 3" range, though his crusader seals allow you to reroll the righteous zeal move. probability of passing a Ld8 save is 72%, and with the Emperor's champion in 1 squad, it's only 1 squad with that chance. Equally, with rhinos, there is less need for leadership as you should be in the rhino until in combat, during which templars are fearless. Only in the subsequent shooting phase after killing a unit does it become important.

I'd probably drop the heavy flamer on the landspeeder, just too pricey. The LS is built to pop tanks you've already got infantry killing in the form of dudes.
I did this to start with, then played a game vs tyranids and dark-eldar. Added the heavy flamer and it's given the Speeder new life, wiping out tons of eldar (gotta love path-finders and bunched up dire avengers with their 4+ save). If it came to cost cutting though, i would drop this, however as it stands I see little need.

I also think your two main crusader squads are correctly set up although I personally add more neophytes (6+3 usually)
Neophytes don't gain the bonus from Accept and Challenge, and so I normally role 7+2 or 7+3 when rhino-ing, however I had to cut points from the last version to fit the Landspeeder.



I'd like to thank you all for your comments and criticisms. I will experiment with adding a dreadnought, dropping the smokelaunchers on the preditor and using this build:

Dreadnought - 144
Venerable
Multi Melta
Extra Armour
Smoke Launchers

Search Lights

I use this build as in such small battles, I am unlikely to be out of range with the multi-melta as I will be advancing constantly, and this allows me to keep some of the anti AV14 that the Assault Squad generated. I have taken Venerable because for 20 points it is amazing, extra armour to keep it advancing, smoke because this will draw more fire than the preditor as well as being more vulnerable. Searchlight because I had 1 point left, and in the unlikely event of nightfighting, he can mark targets for longer-range weaponry.
 
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