[DrinCalhar]

I run Plague Marines with 2 DP's and a bunch of PM's in Rhinos with a few Oblits backing them up. I just recently went up against a SM army with Vulkan and a lot of Multimeltas and Lascannons. Pretty much his whole army is twin-linked and I am losing all my mech by turn 3 or 4 if he is rolling bad or I am rolling cover well. I pop smoke and use cover but it isn't helping much. And when my PM are on the ground I am losing them fast since his whole army is AP 1 and 2. He runs 1 LR, 2 Rhinos and 2 Dreads. Now, the one chance I have had is getting all my Rhinos, 2 PM with meltaguns inside, as close to his Mech as I can and get the 2D6 for melta. Other then that I have no idea how I can kill his mech faster. Any ideas?

 

[KingOfCheese]

Pop vehicles, and assault.
Your Daemon Princes would be loving it.
Lots of wounds, inv save, EW, and best of all 2D6 Pen.
He will soak up a LOT of melta before he goes down.
Go with Warptime and you will crush his vehicles.

Use Oblits against his Rhino's or Dreads, and your Melta against his LR.

Is he running Termies?

Personally i have never had much of an issue against Sallies.
Their low model count, low fire output, weakness in CC, and severe lack of troops makes them relatively easy to counter if you go about it in the right way.

 

[Flame80010]

Run close combat

Berserkers work well, just run the rhinos full speed till they die and charge with the Zerkers ASAP (ive seen your army list so i know you run two lash princes which will help with getting in range quickly) as long as you havea powerfist on the champs they should also be able to deal with armor

 

[KingOfCheese]

Run close combat

Berserkers work well, just run the rhinos full speed till they die and charge with the Zerkers ASAP (ive seen your army list so i know you run two lash princes which will help with getting in range quickly) as long as you havea powerfist on the champs they should also be able to deal with armor

While Berzerkers are good, you should be VERY careful how you use them against Sallies.
They will break open the Berzerkers transport, and Melta can do some serious damage to them.
If the opponent is running a LRR, it can be even worse. The FC's will slaughter the Berzerkers, and while they only have an 8" range they can still move 12" and fire thanks to PotMS.

Its just a matter of trying to play the game out in your head. Work out what units of yours will counter the opponents, while trying not to give yourself any weaknesses.
Once you have a strategy and list worked out, then put yourself in your opponents shoes and try to think what they would do to counter your list and tactics.

 

[Flame80010]

adding to what i said before...

Plague marines are about the worst Chaos army you could run against that, mainly due to the fact that your losing ALL their advantages against Melta weapons (they still wound you on 2's and melta negates FnP) so you would actualy be better off running TS's if you really wanna be able to Dakka him, or KB's if your smart enough to avoid getting shot to crap, and NM's if your wanting to keep him on the run (they also have an advantage in combat)

but seirously :3 you picked about the worst cult for fighting a Melta spam army

 

[DrinCalhar]

It wasn't a choice of picking. I run tournament style when I play. I don't change my army to go against the person I am playing and I don't use special characters. I build it for anyone. While this was probably the worst opponent to face for my army I know that a lot of people will be running anti-mech, my question is what can I do to counter the anti-mech?

 

[Aramoro]

Take less mech?

Aramoro

 

[OddJob]

Priceless. Are they lash princes too?

 

[Flame80010]

It wasn't a choice of picking. I run tournament style when I play. I don't change my army to go against the person I am playing and I don't use special characters. I build it for anyone. While this was probably the worst opponent to face for my army I know that a lot of people will be running anti-mech, my question is what can I do to counter the anti-mech?

if theres going to be alot of anti-mech then rebuild your army from the ground up mate

as i said in my last post...

TS's will make Great anti-anti-mech and they will go through anything that isnt a Termi save when shooting plus you get alot of phsycic powers

 

[loeldrad]

Hmm how many oblits do you run? With enough Oblits you can sit back and pop shots in cover and make him come to you as most of a Vulcan lists anti tank is short ranged. Once he sends some rhinos over pop them open in mid field and either blow the troops to pieces or just lash them away from you to keep those melta guns out of range until you are ready to deal with them. If the dreads get close your DP's will strike first and have a great chance of destroying them in assault. What did he have in the LR?

 

[Stockholm]

i think it was just that list against that list, like Flame said: all my melta and LC just cut down the mech and negated the PM. plus, you know i hunt all you guy's obliterators down first thing turn 1, i let you bring the LRs on for a turn or two. the math is against me there.

i think the 2 x DP, now that they have wings, will make a massive difference. they will be hitting the mech you want much faster. back to Warptime? i think you can succeed more than 50% of the time against the other players at the shop, except maybe Adam's DKK IG who are as mech as my forgelord list.

side note: i totally just realized you're the only other player from our club on here and wanted to jump on this post. i do think the wings will make a difference.

 

[Cyklown]

Well, now you've found a paper to your rock.

I still wouldn't, say, field TS, but you now realize that there's a hole in your list. Use cover, be more flexible, try to bubblewrap your stuff when you can. Tying him up and "blocking" with some units so that you can get a clear path to a flank sounds like it might be your best bet.

 

[Flame80010]

Well, now you've found a paper to your rock.

I still wouldn't, say, field TS, but you now realize that there's a hole in your list. Use cover, be more flexible, try to bubblewrap your stuff when you can. Tying him up and "blocking" with some units so that you can get a clear path to a flank sounds like it might be your best bet.

what i was trying to get at, is hes basicly better off running Undivided marines then spending the extra 8 points per model for Plague marines if their bounes is completely wasted

 

[Warlock in Training]

It wasn't a choice of picking. I run tournament style when I play. I don't change my army to go against the person I am playing and I don't use special characters. I build it for anyone. While this was probably the worst opponent to face for my army I know that a lot of people will be running anti-mech, my question is what can I do to counter the anti-mech?

Well, now you've found a paper to your rock.

I understand you run what you think is the "best" all around build but the fact is you ran into its better. If you wont change your list, then dont be upset if you get a hard press battle everytime. The fact is CSM "like DE" have very few options, however their is more than one solide army build. WT Princes with MoT, and a single squad of TS could help alot.

Change with the times or die.

 

[Supersonic Banana]

Take a massive unit of lesser daemons and some icons and hopefully they will come in in time to act as a massive meat shield for your other units. Invuls! And there's never that many melta shots to go around. They're not push overs in combat either...

 

[Cyklown]

Well, don't try to "build a better build", but sit down and work on it. A fully mech'd list can still be developed to not fall on it's face when in front of anti-mech.

A well-rounded all comers list is still the theoretical ideal, in my mind. This isn't magic, after all, the game isn't designed to feed off of a well-planned metagame. There isn't enough planning on GWs part to even start on that.

There will be times when certain advantages of your units are eliminated. There are still other times when t5fnp would be usefull in that match, and although stubborn guys, or guys with a reroll of moral tests or something might be more usefull than fearless, PMs can still sneak three spec weapons into a squad, so there are still points where that ultimate unbroken (or rather, not yet broken. heh) sword and do the damage that you need them to.

You WILL need to be making full use of smoke, cover, forcing painfull target priority choices on the other guy and all that too, but that's not my area of expertise. There are some good blogs with Vassal-driven diagrams (since clearly the primary purpose of Vassal is to draw really pretty diagrams to explain theory to people. clearly!) our here that can explain stuff. Poke around through some of the blog/hnn/andsoforth contributors personal blogs and you can glean some good stuff