Anti...anything 1850 Eldar

1387 Views 20 Replies 6 Participants Last post by moc065, Feb 20, 2008

Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · Feb 18, 2008

Ok after playing my first game against the nids, I have decided to try something a little more "all comers" style.

HQ
88-Farseer (Runes of Wit, Guide, Singing Spear)
88-Farseer (Runes of Wit, Guide, Singing Spear)

Troops
192-8 Pathfinders
192-8 Pathfinders
192-8 Pathfinders
120-5 Pathfinders

92-10 Storm Guardians (2 Fusion guns)
170-Wave Serpent (Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon, Star Engines, Spirit Stones)

92-10 Storm Guardians (2 Fusion guns)
170-Wave Serpent (Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon, Star Engines, Spirit Stones)

Heavy Support
150-3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers, Spirit Stones)
150-3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers, Spirit Stones)
150-3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers, Spirit Stones)

I would keep the Farseer behind the Walkers and give them guide, thats 24 S6 shots with re-roles for 2 squads and another 24 shots from the last squad. These would kill guants/infantry. The pathfinders would take out the big stuff like Carnifax or other such things. The wave serpent and storm guardian will serve as my anti-tank units, although the war walkers can easily shoot down low armour vehicles.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #3 · Feb 18, 2008 (Edited)

War Walkers arent open topped anymore :biggrin: Plus, the walkers will only be set in a LOS area for troops. Any troop squad they shoot at will die, almost no question. Thus my Pathfinders can attack the tougher troops and the guardians go after the tanks that threaten my Walkers. All I need is an opening to dump another 24 shots into an autocannon. Its pretty easy to roll a couple glancing 6's with 24 S6 shots (and thats just from one squad) all I need to do is keep them from shooting and my walkers would have a fairly free rain. I think as long as I can stay away from major shots (like an autocannon) untill they are neutralized would be pretty effective. After melting a tank or two, the guardians will become a threat that any troops left would have to deal with, one way or another. Now you have the choice to either attack the pathfinders, and get shot up by warwalkers and guardians, or go after the walkers and hope to kill a few ( I WOULD HAVE NINE ON THE BOARD!!!) Lastly you could give into the damage that the guardians jsut made to the tanks and go after them, which I doubt any veteran player would do.

I recognize the weakness of the walkers, but can stay back and relax shooting at troops untill a few tanks are destroyed. All I have to do is star engine my wave serpents right next to your tanks, then even if they are destroyed, which can happen but not likely, the guardians will pop out and melta the hell out of the tanks (not as good as fire dragons, but cheaper) Now that my Guardians are there, they will have a much harder decision to make.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #6 · Feb 18, 2008

I think the biggest problem my list faces is against an assualting unit that is tucked away into a transport. At that point, my guardians would have to get those units to come out. If I dump my BL and Fusion guns into them, they should come out with ease. Then, if I dont enter into a slaughter house round of assualt, I can empty a mass load of walker or pathfinder fire into them. The biggest problem then is the heavy supports out there to kill my walkers. At that point I would need to stick my walkers out to kill something... I really need to proxy this list against my friend's chaos and other armies before I even consider dumping the money into it.

Idk, you can call the warwalkers weak, but 24 S6 shots from 3 scout squads is fricken insane.

Btw, against nidzillas, The warwalkers would rape any speedy gaunts (essentially destroying 3 squads in the first round if I have LOS and being a scout squad they most likely will), and the pathfinders would kill an average of 1.5 carnifax per round (or 2 if I get lucky). The Guardians could manage killing another 1-2 by turn 2. After that, you would have to choose what to shoot at because the pathfinders and the walkers can cause a lot of wounds to any of the big guys.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #8 · Feb 18, 2008

Thanks for the advise, I can sure use it :biggrin:. My list right now has actually won every game ive played, except against chaos (because I decided to experiment with kanandras and scorpions...) The only thing I completely FAIL against is nids so far...

Anyway, Ill try a few versions with the walkers and see whats good.

Thanks for the help guys.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #10 · Feb 18, 2008

Hmm... that actully sounds pretty good. If you gave them spears and the farseer guide as well, you could do some nasty damage to vehicles as well. I wanted to try something similar except a large amount of warlocks on jetbikes. Its really just rediculously expensive and not worth the points.

But in your case, they are all in a wave serpent which radically reduces the cost.

Tell me how well it does when you get the chance.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #11 · Feb 18, 2008

I just did some "test roling" and out of 5 roles for all my pathfinders, it took 2 squads to kill one carnifax on average. Im thinking that I should drop the other squad of 8 and 6 for something better for assualting, like some harlies and a shadowseer.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #14 · Feb 18, 2008 (Edited)

moc065 said:
HQ
88-Farseer (Runes of Wit, Guide, Singing Spear)
88-Farseer (Runes of Wit, Guide, Singing Spear)
Two of these guys are just not required.... and RoWit are not that great considering they give you a better chance to succeed and a lot bebtter chance of taking a Perils of the Warp hit.

Guide is misplaced anyway, as you won't need it with that many shots, whereas something like Fortune on your Pathfinders would just be better. In the long run though, your best bet would be to simply drop both of these guys and replace them with Eldrad.
Troops
192-8 Pathfinders
192-8 Pathfinders
192-8 Pathfinders
120-5 Pathfinders
These guys are great, but 4 squads of 6 each is more than enough and would give you a few extra points to use on other things.
92-10 Storm Guardians (2 Fusion guns)
170-Wave Serpent (Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon, Star Engines, Spirit Stones)
If your using Star-Engines, and or the vehicle gets shaken, then the Weapons are pretty useless. Thus I really advocate for minimizing the weapons to something long ranged for the TL part (EML, BL, or Scatter) and just leave the Catipults alone. It saves you points in the long run and onve these guys gets close enough to drop the payload, then the guns are pretty welld one their job anyway.
92-10 Storm Guardians (2 Fusion guns)
170-Wave Serpent (Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon, Star Engines, Spirit Stones)
Same as above; but you should consider a little variety here.... as two squads that work well on some things, also means two squads that don't work so well on other things.
Heavy Support
150-3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers, Spirit Stones)
150-3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers, Spirit Stones)
150-3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers, Spirit Stones)
Have you ever considered EML's instead of Scatterlasers for at least one of the squads.... the added range can keep them out of harms way, the option of big template or high power shot is wicked for all comers lists, and the added AP value is just one more bonus for a very minimal points increase.

The army looks like it has potential; but at present I would say that it would be for fun games only as I don't see it competing well with any really fast armies, or really CC orientated armies, etc.

The farseer need to give guide to the walkers because they hit on 4s, thats half my shots going to waste.

Yeah, as I said earlier I will proble drop 2 squads for something else. Im toying with the idea of dropping the guardians, wave serpent, and one walker squad for a falcon, harlies, and fire dragons. Dont think I can get the points but ill try. Then the army would be better equiped for anti-tank and CC. It would also give my opponent more targets to wory about. Harlies will allow me to fend off the closest assualting unit while my pathfindes walkers and pathfinders can blow apart any other. The firedragons in the serpent can SE across to a good spot and wait to strike. Now the I just said that....where did that falcon go? Is it better for me to put the harlies into a Falcon or just fleet them? with a shadow seer they cant be targetted for more than 24 inches. I think I should drop the other serpent and put my dragons into the falcon. Hmmm or maybe drop the falcon and get 2 fire dragons squads in 2 wave serpents? what do you think?

My main Idea was to use my guardian/wave serpents for my anti-tank. If they are not destroyed by turn 2, the serpents can do some damage with BL. The other reason is that the guardians are MUCH cheaper then fire dragons. And with 4 melta weapons, I can still kill some tanks. Their main purpose is to die and die well.

The walkers can be outfitted with anything I really need. If Im facing a mech army, I can drop some points elsewhere and give them ELM or If im facing chaos, I can use Star cannons and get 12 S6 AP2 shots from 2 squads. I believe that would hurt a little more than a Dark Reaper squad for a lot less points.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #16 · Feb 19, 2008

Thanks again for the help. Do you mind telling me what upgrades you would put on the vypers/falcons and what the reasoning is?

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #18 · Feb 19, 2008

how do you think this would do? replacing one squad of FDs for Harlies and one falcon for a prism. It would give me a good assualting squad and a good anti-tank, ant-troop also.

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Desolatemm

Discussion Starter · #20 · Feb 20, 2008

HQ
210-The so called "Big E"

Troops
152-10 Dire Avengers (Exarch, DA SC, BladeStorm)
155-WaveSerpent (Scatter Laser, Shuriken Cannon, VE, SS)

144-6 Path Finders
144-6 Path Finders
144-6 Path Finders

Elites
118-6 Fire Dragons (Exarch, Dragon Breath, Crack Shot)
178-6 Harlequin (5 Harle. Kisses, Shadow Seer, Troupe Master)

Fast Attack
65-Vyper (ELM)
65-Vyper (ELM)
60-Vyper (Scatter Laser)

Heavy Support
210-Falcon (Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon, HF, VE, SE, SS)
205-Falcon (Scatter Laser, Shuriken Cannon, HF, VE, SS)

The Harlequin move up in Falcon number 2 and assualt in turn 2. Then they work their magic in CC, moving from target to target with HaR. The falcon then moves behind cover and attacks where needed. The DA wait for a promising infantry unit and wipe them out. The Pathfinders either pick off Harle. leaftovers or go after HQ and tough units. The Vypers stay back and shoot tanks/Infantry and wait to score in missions. Mean While, the Fire Dragons move across the board in the other Falcon with SE in turn one. Turn two, they move where needed to do same damage to tanks/tough squads. If I work it right, I could move my way with the Harles from squad to squad until im in the same general area of the DA, creating a good striking force to clean up whatever is left. Eldrad will either hang back and help the vypers and pathfinders, move up near the harlies, or go with the DA. Not sure exactly what good he is in this type of an army, maybe you can enlighten me?

Anyway, I think this is a solid list against most opponents. But, I still see trouble going against a nidzilla type army. Any Suggestions?

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