Warhammer 40k Forum and Wargaming Forums banner

1 - 20 of 64 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Do you guys think that his all abiding hatred for his father, and by extension his father's empire is why Angron is the only one of the four Daemon Prince Primarchs to return and rampage ?

Fulgrim is no longer Fulgrim, and his legion is in tatters because they preyed on everyone and were smited.

Peturabo also is bitter, but it seems directed more towards his brother Primarchs more than the Imperium itself.

Mortorion seems to be wallowing in self-pity while Thypus actually runs shit.

Magnus, is not really against the Imperium, also wallowing in self pity while his sons wage a war of vengeance against mostly the SW.

Lorgar is meditating and his children are playing games amongst themselves.

How much damage have the rest of them caused since ascention to Daemonhood ?


By damage I mean led, conquests/rampages.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,514 Posts
Honestly, other than Angron the rest of them have pretty much done jack shit themselves. They leave the imperium terrorizing to their legions and are probably more focussed on the great game the chaos gods play. The only thing I can think of of the top of my head is Magnus trying to manifest in real space to try and destroy the space wolves but all that got him was a poke in the eye.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Re-reading After Desh'ea, and instead of the usual fanfare and pomp, The corpse god basically dumped a traumatised Angron into the ranks of his Legion with nary a word and left them to themselves.

Saying "they must take this duty upon themselves".
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
10,976 Posts
Fluffwise, GW have pumped the primarchs up a bit too much to let them loose like that really. So they just set one on the Imperium, if only to show how kingshit they have become, before citing some crap about how their priorities have changed.

I think it`s pretty weak myself, this whole heresy thing nearly consumed their souls, the souls of their legions and brothers, and now they suddenly don`t care? They`ve (conveniently) just put it all behind them?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12 Posts
Well, Fulgrim mortally wounded Gulliman (sp?) So there must have been some activity after the Heresy.. perhaps during the Scouring? But by and large I think Serpion5 is right there seems to be a lack of interest on the Daemon Primarchs agenda.
 

·
Craw-Daddy
Joined
·
4,416 Posts
Well, Fulgrim mortally wounded Gulliman (sp?) So there must have been some activity after the Heresy.. perhaps during the Scouring? But by and large I think Serpion5 is right there seems to be a lack of interest on the Daemon Primarchs agenda.
I think that if there were more of the loyalist primarchs out there to fight, the traitor primarchs might be tempted enough to fight them. I think the example of Fulgrim and Guilliman is pretty good. Perturabo had already proved to himself better than Dorn in the "Iron Cage." Guilliman is down so now Alpharius doesn't have any motive to utterly destroy the Imperium. He simply just screws around with the Imperium.

In some way I think the loyalist primarchs kind of disapeared on purpose so that the daemon prince primarchs would no longer have the competition and motivation to utterly lead their legions to destroy the Imperium again. This is obviously just my conspiracy but if it really was the case, it has worked. Can you imagine the world of shit the Imperium would be if every chaos primarch and the support of every legion was at the Cadian gates?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
That is very true...

But I really think now that they have had 10,000 years to think, they realise they were being assholes, even though their father is the asshole king of horrible parenting.

Maybe they just feel sorry for themselves like Magnus does.

Angron didn't like the Emp from day one, so he is still pissy.
 

·
Craw-Daddy
Joined
·
4,416 Posts
I think in a way perhaps Magnus, Perturabo, and Mortarion might have some regret over what they did. I don't know much about Mortarion yet, but at least Magnus and Perturabo both payed the ultimate price in trying to be loyal and basically broke themselves. Magnus broke the rules and Perturabo broke himself. But at least in this way they can say they tried everything and nothing worked. So maybe in that sense they don't have regret.

Fulgrim is possessed and lost forever, so it doesn't really matter if his tortured soul has regret or not.

Alpharius is on his own program as I've always said.

Angron was a uncontrollable animal ever since his slave owner put that aggression implant in his brain. I think it was Corax in Raven's Flight who asked why Angron would do such a thing as betray his father and his brothers. The answer was "freedom." Ever since the Emperor found Angron all he felt was shackled by his father and kept at bay by his true potential; his murder frenzy. Ever since his betrayel all he feels is freedom, freedom to slaughter for all eternity. I don't think he'll ever feel regret.

In some cases though I can see some regret, but I think in many ways they remember what it was like to be under the shackles of the Imperium and their father who is now in a golden toilet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
I think in a way perhaps Magnus, Perturabo, and Mortarion might have some regret over what they did. I don't know much about Mortarion yet, but at least Magnus and Perturabo both payed the ultimate price in trying to be loyal and basically broke themselves. Magnus broke the rules and Perturabo broke himself. But at least in this way they can say they tried everything and nothing worked. So maybe in that sense they don't have regret.

Fulgrim is possessed and lost forever, so it doesn't really matter if his tortured soul has regret or not.

Alpharius is on his own program as I've always said.

Angron was a uncontrollable animal ever since his slave owner put that aggression implant in his brain. I think it was Corax in Raven's Flight who asked why Angron would do such a thing as betray his father and his brothers. The answer was "freedom." Ever since the Emperor found Angron all he felt was shackled by his father and kept at bay by his true potential; his murder frenzy. Ever since his betrayel all he feels is freedom, freedom to slaughter for all eternity. I don't think he'll ever feel regret.

In some cases though I can see some regret, but I think in many ways they remember what it was like to be under the shackles of the Imperium and their father who is now in a golden toilet.
I don't think he was an uncontrollable animal from then, he was created to be that way by the Emp.

In the Tales of Heresy novel, his Legion was censured for decimating thier OWN allies in combat before they had even met him. So the violence was in the gene-seed.

It also showed Angron was into combat for honour (he had his Triumph rope with no losses), and he hated fighting his own honourable brethren just to please the upper class "high-riders." He did however have no issue with total butchery of the enemy, especially when he considered them beneath him.

He actually classes the Emperor as a "high-rider" giving commands from up high while others fought and died for him.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,363 Posts
Maybe it's just the fact, that when their Patron God ascends them into Daemonhood, they gain access to a whole daemon-world worth of power...

Being the evil Bastards they are, they could just basically have gone

"F- This, you can do it abaddon, i'm pretty good where i am, maybe in a few thousand years."

Unless your a really angry like Angron, who did go on that rampage.

Do you see what i'm saying? Maybe they just don't need to do anything, they just enjoy watching everything around them die, in unholy fires, from the comfort of their own Realm.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
Other Daemon princes are far more active and particpate in destruction and slaughter. The Primarches were gene built to conquer and rule, kinda lazy for them to slack off, when humans/ regular space marines are doing something positive with their Daemonhood.
 

·
Craw-Daddy
Joined
·
4,416 Posts
Maybe it's just the fact, that when their Patron God ascends them into Daemonhood, they gain access to a whole daemon-world worth of power...

Being the evil Bastards they are, they could just basically have gone

"F- This, you can do it abaddon, i'm pretty good where i am, maybe in a few thousand years."

Unless your a really angry like Angron, who did go on that rampage.

Do you see what i'm saying? Maybe they just don't need to do anything, they just enjoy watching everything around them die, in unholy fires, from the comfort of their own Realm.
It comes down to how exciting being a king on the eye of terror can really be. So you play with the warp all day. I mean eventually you'd get bored. Personally, if I was a daemon prince I think it'd be fun picking on the Imperium. And going on campaigns, destroying worlds and fleets that were thought to be unbeatable, or impregnable. Making my name infamous throughout the galaxy. That'd be a lot more fun than just lieing around my home planet in the warp. Especially since being a primarch means you were created for such a thing; its in each primarchs nature. But hey... thats what I would do. I don't buy that idea that they think they are too good to fight the Imperium anymore, even if it was the case, what else would the primarchs be doing? Theres only one thing better than doing battle and thats getting drunk and then layed. I refuse to believe they have good females or whiskey down in the eye of terror
 

·
Bane of Empires
Joined
·
5,131 Posts

·
Craw-Daddy
Joined
·
4,416 Posts
Your applying human ethics and behavioural patterns to daemons, which is a mistake.
Not necessarly. Daemon Princes still hold ambition and traits that drove them to becoming what they are. They must still hold some ambition whether it is to further themselves in their eyes of their gods or just because they must do something to further entertain their gods.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Exactly, they are still human, just with Daemon "power armour" so to speak, even though they probably do have a bit of the Chaos god essence, so they should be doing what they were doing before, just on a grander scale.

But then, that would n't make sense, because Angron is the only one actually acting Khornish.


Magnus is not gaining knowledge, or plotting on a grand scale, just being a crybaby.

Mortorian never seemed to want to be hugged by Granpa Nurgle, so he probably despises himself.

Fulgrim is lost, not even enjoying his Daemonhood at all.

I would storm the Cadian gate like they were giving away money. Ban me for 100 years, no problem, the nanosecond that 100 yrs is up, it's me again, stirring up shit all over.

In 10,000 years, I would have made at least 100 attacks. The Imperium would KNOW that Chaos don't joke.
 

·
Bane of Empires
Joined
·
5,131 Posts
Not necessarly. Daemon Princes still hold ambition and traits that drove them to becoming what they are. They must still hold some ambition whether it is to further themselves in their eyes of their gods or just because they must do something to further entertain their gods.
Not necessarily. They have already achieved the ultimate reward for servitude to Chaos, there is no longer any need to further seek recognition or favour from the gods. Their mere existence as Daemon Princes is enough to empower their patrons.

They are now part of the Warp and therefore ever-lasting, they cannot be killed and are now eternally part of the ebb and flow of Chaos. It matters not if the Imperium falls in a year or in ten millennia, they will still be present when it inevitably does. In fact they have probably already experianced its collapse, as well as ceasing to exist all together - It has to be taken into account that they are now part of the warp, where events do not occur in a strict sequence of cause then effect and where time does not exist.

And as for their ambition, sacrificing your mortality and reality, becoming part of a completely different realm which bears no phyiscal rules or matter, no space or time, and being completely reforged in mind, body and soul as an daemonic entity can do a lot to change your perspective, purpose and ambitions.

Also:

Codex Chaos Space Marines 4th Ed said:
The Daemon Primarchs Angron, Magnus, Mortarion and Fulgrim are content to wage wars against their enemies within the Eye of Terror. It is almost unheard of for them to lead forth their warriors from their Daemon Worlds, preferring to leave such petty tasks to favour-seeking fanatical underlings.
Exactly, they are still human
No their not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Not literally human!!!! Sheesh.

Human in the sense that they remember their lives as humans (Primarches), they were not willed into existense by a Chaos god like a regular Daemon. It is not only lust for worshipping a chaos god that makes a non daemon want to go daemon prince, it is about lust for personal gain/power/revenge/anger, basically human emotions.

Which makes me wonder why Kharn and others who have probaly earned it 1000 times over are content to remain human?

But then Angron has lead his forces out. Twice.... So that is not really accurate.

Based on current BL books, Fulgrim isn't even Fulgrim anymore, he is some minor Slaneeshi Daemon who found an idiot and currupted him and won more power after that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
sorry to go off topic but......

FOR THE EMPORER


how did dorn die i never knew?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
sorry to go off topic but......

FOR THE EMPORER


how did dorn die i never knew?

a: Death to your corpse god
b: Start your own thread.

Rogal Dorn died fighting on board a Chaos ship, after attacking a Black Crusade fleet with a vastly outnumbered force. Seeing the importance of attacking the enemy fleet while they were still preparing he relied on hit-and-run attacks until his reinforcements could arrive. Dorn died on board the Despoiler Class Battleship Sword of Sacrilege after leading a desperate attack on its bridge. His remains were recovered and his engraved skeletal hand is kept in stasis by his chapter.2
--- http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Rogal_Dorn
 
1 - 20 of 64 Posts
Top