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There’s a common sentiment that GW needs to "move the fluff forward." Usually, you’ll see a wishlist like, "The Emperor dies," or, "Abaddon actually succeeds at something." In the wake of the Nagash End Times, this is a particularly big discussion right now.

This idea irks me. I look at 40K as a backdrop, not a fiction series. GW has created this universe to provide a setting for us to play our own games and write our own stories.

With that in mind, I view the idea of GW taking fluffy-control as a threat. I want them to uphold the mood, not make colossal changes that affect my universe. (As a side note, this is one of many reasons I don’t like Privateer Press’s games. The emphasis on named characters makes it feel less like it’s my game, and more like I’m just playing out someone else’s story).

Fortunately, 40K’s galactic scale provides more of a safeguard than WHFB’s did. In Fantasy, Nagash can do things like virtually-destroy the entire Bretonnian nation. In 40K, you might see something like a Craftworld or Chapter dying out, but not the death of all eldar or all space marines. (Unless you’re the Squats.)(Likewise, I recognize that as an independent adult I can choose to ignore any changes GW makes, play in a different part of 40K’s timeline, etc.)

That was a bit of a ramble, but y question to you guys: is it important for GW to advance the 40K storyline?
 

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I want them to uphold the mood, not make colossal changes that affect my universe.
Whatever they did, the grimdark mood would remain the same, or maybe become even more grimdark.

People aren't looking for any huge changes, just something to move things on a bit. The 6th Ed book did this in very small and subtle ways, like saying the Golden Throne was failing and no one knew how to fix it, the astronomicon was flickering, leading to whole fleets getting lost in the warp, tomb worlds wakening, hive fleets closing on Terra.

At the time these things all raised debate and got people to re-engage with the universe, even if none of these things were properly explored in any other publication. So if they had just dropped in a few more easter eggs like these in the 7th Ed book, or expanded on the 6th Ed ones, people would be happy.

I'm not looking for anything like the massive upheaval that Nagash seems to have done to WFB(though I wouldn't mind if they did), just an idea that the whole thing is not stagnating. Some things are just going on way too long though, like Ghazkhull's Whaaag(more than 20 years), or the 13th Black Crusade(coming up on 20 years), and need to be wrapped up one way or the other.

Personally I think GW is too hung up in the whole 40,000 thing. So what if it moves on to 40,001? It reminds me of the whole Y2K fear. People stressed over it for ages in the build, and then it passed without a hitch. The same would happen if they did advance it a bit.

I have never played WFB in any serious sense, but there are a lot of guys I know who play at a very high level, representing Ireland at the ETC for years now, and they are all very excited at what Nagash has done for the system. It seems to have reinvigorated tired players, and brought old players back to the game. If something similar could do the same for 40k, I think it would be a welcome addition.
 

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While I think a lot of the changes people have suggested (myself included) have been huge to the backdrop of the 40k universe, as long as factions aren't wiped out they wouldn't necessarily change anything from a gaming and hobby POV. A first founding loyalist chapter could have their planet destroyed/taken over by (insert enemy race) and they'd still be a playable faction. Cadia could fall and there'd be plenty of reasons for Cadians to still exist in the universe- but it would mean the fluff can jump forward to a point where Chaos are fighting their way to Terra one system at a time.

I'd just like to buy a new codex/rulebook and have an actual reason to read the fluff sections.
 

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I'd like it to move forward so that Tyranids, Chaos and maybe Orks have all managed to carve a path to Terra and all assault the planet at same time. That would be an all out mayhem Rulebook and Codexes.

There is always a new hive fleet, a new Chaos attemp and a new Ork Warboss. So fluffwise you can let the Imperium prevail, but just leave it for one edition so Terra can be fought for. ;)

You can never purge all Orks or Nids, so Terra will get some action even after the invasions are defeated.
 

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Or Abbadon dies. Chaos actually take a blow. It doesn't have to be the Imperium that takes a blow. Maybe subtle changes on all sides. This doesn't really need to happen though as stated, because of how massive the galaxy is. And to be Honest if we are gonna throw Chaos a bone, might as well throw the Imperium one, maybe get a Primarch back.


I honestly don't care if they advance it or not, I am more on the side of fixing current fluff(Get away from my Crons Ward), getting rid of Retcons that shouldn't have occured and minor tweaks for fixing contradictions. I like 40k as it is. A big stalemate.
 

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Or Abbadon dies. Chaos actually take a blow. It doesn't have to be the Imperium that takes a blow. Maybe subtle changes on all sides. This doesn't really need to happen though as stated, because of how massive the galaxy is. And to be Honest if we are gonna throw Chaos a bone, might as well throw the Imperium one, maybe get a Primarch back.


I honestly don't care if they advance it or not, I am more on the side of fixing current fluff(Get away from my Crons Ward), getting rid of Retcons that shouldn't have occured and minor tweaks for fixing contradictions. I like 40k as it is. A big stalemate.
Stalemates only are fun for so long though.
 

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All this "40k is a setting" argument holds no weight. You could make ridiculous changes to the overall plot of 40k without altering the playability of each faction.

Hell you could mirror the WHF End Times almost point for point and have it play out much the same. Have Szarekh of the necrons trigger some ancient necron doom device that puts even the Chaos gods on edge. Have a massive convergence of necrons on the galactic east, coming to meet the advance of an new Hive superfleet and dragging every sentient race into battle right with them both.

So many things are already set to happen, we could almost write the story for them. The Dragon shard is about to crack out of Mars, the Hive Fleets are engaged in a battle that if they win will basically hand them the strength to take the rest of the galaxy.

I used to be on the fence over this but now I say roll it forward.
 

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^ Pretty much how I see it. There's not a whole lot that can happen that would actually affect the game itself, and what could change in the fluff that would genuinely damage the lore to the point where new people aren't keen to get involved and experienced players feel like leaving the hobby?

I think killing off special characters is a step further because you leave people with models that no longer exist in the lore. That would be the point where the fluff does impact on the game. OTOH there could be a piece in the rulebook about the 13th black crusade where Abaddon loses a fight, gets his arm hacked off and his daemon sword destroyed and when the new CSM codex comes out a new model can be released where he has a bionic arm and new weapon. It doesn't sound like a very good idea but it's an example of how you can further the story a bit

Armageddon... let the orks have it. The humans retreat, the steel legion still exists- who would really be bothered by that? To new hobbyists it's just a piece of the lore like any other, to us it closes that chapter and maybe opens up the possibility of a new campaign where the orks find themselves defending the planet
 

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I kind of like the stalemate, it allows a few of my friends and I to make a long running campaign based on different aspects, and if we destroy an entire system (tyrannid player had like a run of 8 wins against all of us, none of us could stop him) it doesn't really effect anyone else or anything major they release in any new editions of armies codex.

We're all D&D players as well so when it comes to RP'ing in 40k we just kind of run away with a thread. I think my current Ork Warlord has been "found" near death after a battle, more times than I can count!

So all in all I'm in definite agreement with you morfangdakka. Subtle changes are good, but I like the idea that I can run my own games with their own narrative without effecting anything else in the game.
 

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I think killing off special characters is a step further because you leave people with models that no longer exist in the lore. That would be the point where the fluff does impact on the game.
We already have this. Captain Tycho of the Blood Angels is dead as far as the fluff is concerned, but he is still available to play, as is Eldrad Ulthran.

If a character is alive or dead in fluff terms has no bearing on the game itself. It's all about fielding heroes of legend. They could kill off Grimnar, Yarrick, Abbadon, Farsight or Calgar and it make make no difference to the minis on the table.
 

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I think GW could look a bit wider than the current picture. I don't think it was necesary to recon the Eye of Terror campign and with it the whole 13th black crusade. The Galaxy is vast and they could have expanded untold stories than happens simultanesly. The War of Octavius. Third Phase expansion, the battles around the Hades Anomily. There are tons of fluff that could be turned into global campaigns without breaking into the 42nd millennium.
 
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