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Discussion Starter #1
I like to believe that I am well tuned to the Eldar machine and how it works but I wondered whether this list below is much cop for dealing with other opponents.

The campaign is special and runs over 3 weeks. The rules are that the 500 point army must have 2 troops, NO HQ and either one fast attack, one elites or one heavy support choice. A squad leader is also advised since the rules allow them to grow more powerful after each game with either stat increases or special abilities. Also no vehicles except dedicated transports or walkers may be taken.

List is as such

Dire avengers-10 present including an exarch (who is in overall command) armed with a power weapon and a shimmershield with the bladestorm power-162 points

In a dedicated transport Wave Serpent armed with a twin linked bright lance, a shuriken cannon and spirit stones-155 points

7 pathfinders-168 points

total is 485 points

General tactics is that the dire avengers kill infantry (of the most basic kind), the pathfinders kill more heavily armoured stuff like terminators and the wave serpent can kill tanks and walkers that may pop up.

Comments would be most welcome.
 

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Thats alot of points gone into your WS, in such a small game i dont think you will need the BL. Change these for TLSL, you get more shots and they are re-rollable =win against most transports. Next lose the rangers and get some more DA with exarch and Blade storm. The sheer volume of fire power you will put out should be enough to hold up anything the enemy throws at you.

Based on the campainge rules here is what I would take:

10x DA w/Exarch, dual shuriken catapult, Blade storm -152
WS w/TLSC, Spirit stones -110
10x Guardians w/SL heavy platform -95
3x War walkers w/x2 SL -135

Total -492

The Guardians will be the objective holders while the DA advance and take out the enemy transports, the War walkers will be able to swing around and hit the enemy in the flank. If you dont want to use the WW you could drop them and get a Wraith lord with x2 EML which would come in at 140pts. This will give you another TL weapon to throw at the enemy, also giving you a choice of shot. Krak to pop transports followed by Plasma to kill the juicyness inside.

Hope that was of some help to you good luck in the coming campaigne.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I like some of the ideas presented but with SL I am not sure I will stand up well against some competition. For example I know a BA player who on previous occasions has used a librarian dread in his games. If that came up then I would be hosed. Another player has already been testing his thousand sons based force and uses an obliterator as his heavy support and lower AP seems more necessary than rate of fire. The Bright lance might seem excessive but it does mean the chance for victory of blowing up enemy vehicle first would be increased.

I am not a fan of guardians since they die faar too quickly for my liking although a wraithlord instead of a wave serpent could be a good investment since he is legal and can scare off any armour. Although I prefer the wraithblade and bright lance combo for him since it keeps his combat effectiveness up whilst giving him a little shooting power.
 

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I also think that there is a lot of points in the wave serpent, i also run a 500 combat patrol list which has slightly different rules to yourself but similar in some respects. Outflanking war walkers with scatter lasers can make a real mess of almost any vehicle as with outflank you stand a reasonable chance of hitting the rear armour. However 3, all with scatter lasers comes to 180pts.

If you drop the BL down to a ML, then drop the pathfinders it would be possible to crowbar those in. However if you don't fancy the glass hammers of the walkers, a wraithlord would work a treat (usually I wouldn't advise it as unfair but a libby dread is just as bad lol).

If you don't fancy running any of the walkers which I sense may be the case *yoda sense is tingling*, then try a small switch of giving the exarch the doublecats as a wep, as this will maximize bladestorm potential. Possibly try free some points up by cutting 2 rangers, maybe some upgrades and get a small naked 5 man dragon squad, this would give that libby dread and any other vehicle something to think about, leaving your bladestorming avengers to hose some infantry. However it may leave your units a touch small.

Either way, let us know how you get on and all the best fellow pointy ear :)

Panzer
 

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Discussion Starter #5
No offence but I think that fire dragons at 500 points is an overkill. I like the idea of the wraithlord but to fit it in I would sacrifice the mobility of the serpent. I suppose that if the avengers were kept in cover (there is bound to be some) then they should be safe.

I chose the power weapon and shimmershield option because one thing I may not have mentioned is that one seargant can receive upgrades provided that I win after each game. In the improvements table there are more skills and stat increases that benefit those with hand to hand ability.
 

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TBH you will not need a BL in a 500pt game, the enemy will not put anything with a high enough armour fon the field for you to need one. This new list i have devised, is going to require you to use as much cover as possable. Also take advantage of the speed your units are capable of.

The list as follows:

x9 DA w/exarch, shimmer shield, power weapon, blade storm -150
x1 Wave Serpent w/TLSL -115
x5 Jetbikers w/SC -120
x1 Wraith lord w/EM -115

Total = 500 spot on

This list is a bit more punch than the previous one i posted and the WL should rip through any armour your opponants can bring. I've also swappped out the rangers for some Jetbikers as this will give you a more manuverable force. The EM on the Wraith lord is more than capable of taking out a libby dread or any other heavy armour you may come up against.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I could actually use this list as it looks really good. However I do not use jetbikes so they would not be suitable. The only guardian related things I use is falcons and wave serpents. I do not even use fire prisms since I normally use all 3 heavy slots (falcon for fire dragon transport, wraithlord to scare people and dark reapers with the I rape marines weapon (tempest launcher with crack shot))

The main argument is thus Could I use another unit instead of jetbikes as I simply never use them?
 

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Replace the jetbikes with x5 Pathfinder, this is 120pts exactly. Stick them in cover and bobs your uncle. You've now got a unmovable unit which can pin enemy troops in the process, just watch out for flamers and other template weapons.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Will do.

In recent developments I went to the store yesterday and found out that each person got a free advancement roll in advance to the start on Saturday. I rolled an ability that allows my exarch to have a free psychic power. The question is I do not know which one. My first idea was for the veil of tears power that shadowseers have but then I realised that in later games (when the points we are allowed to field increases) they will probably ride in a serpent. So what power should I have?
 

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Oh man. When you say, 'a psychic power', do you mean ANY Eldar psychic power?
If you only mean the 'minor' ones, then veil of tears is great* now and decent at all levels.
*possibly game-breaking.
Other good choices might be Conceal or possibly Embolden (so any Farseer who ends up attached to the DA can reroll his psychic tests).

If you do mean any psychic power, Doom. It works amazingly with your squad because your Exarch setup doesn't involve your Exarch shooting at all, so you don't lose anything by using it. As a result, you gain hugely in wounds caused and your squad might actually do okay in assault.
Fortune or Mind War are other good choices, of course; I'd lean towards Veil of Tears over Fortune.

But yeah. No matter what you get, it's great. I'd go Doom if Farseer powers are allowed, or maybe Mind War. If they aren't allowed, Veil of Tears will be amazing all the way. If you're only allowed Warlock powers, Conceal may be too situational. Embolden as mentioned above, or Destructor. Destructor would be better in this squad than many others because you've got that cc build, and so presumably will be close enough to squads to flame them.
 

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I would say using Guide would be the best as it will make for the lack of firepower on the Exarch, also when used in conjunction with Bladestorm, the unit will be crack shots and hit everytime. More shots hit = more armour saves for the opponant to fail.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
To clarify it just states any power from their respective codex. This sucks for daemon players but rocks for me.

I could see the usefulness of doom since it affects shooting and assault.

The idea behind veil of tears is that it stops the unit from being shot to pieces from long range.
 

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If the unit is going to be transported in the Wave serpent, then what is the point of having Veil of tears, it will only help the Dire avengers not the vehical they are in. Doom or Uide are your best bet, but if in the future you decide to change things due to the campaing then take Veil of tears. I just think the way the list is a the moment the other powers would be more beneficial.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Yeah I have decided on doom so I will report how the army fares on Saturday assuming that this thread is still on the first page.
 

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I would also say Doom is a very good choice followed by either fortune or guide. Let us know how it goes :)
 

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I would say using Guide would be the best as it will make for the lack of firepower on the Exarch, also when used in conjunction with Bladestorm, the unit will be crack shots and hit everytime. More shots hit = more armour saves for the opponant to fail.
Doom's better, though. Guide takes a 2/3 to hit and makes it an 8/9. Your deadliness has gone up by 1/3.
Against T3 enemies, Doom is exactly as good as Guide; against T4 or higher, Doom is moderately and then considerably better (deadliness increases by a half vs T4, by two-thirds vs T5, and by around 80% vs T6 or T7) . Furthermore, this is all assuming you've only got one squad. Once you have 2+ squads of Avengers, Doom blows Guide out of the water. Basically, don't make your strong point better, make your weak point better. And of course all this is in the effort to just pile up the saves on whatever you're shooting.

The logic behind taking veil of tears is this: once you have enough Dire Avengers in serpents, you can sometimes or even often obliterate every unit in an 18" radius from where you drop them off (supposing you choose the dropoff point intelligently enough). If you do this normally, you're at risk of your avengers suffering from AP4 templates or firepower at much longer range. If you do this and one squad has Veil of Tears, you can start to pull tricks with positioning. Situational, possibly amazing, possibly useless.

Bottom line: I love Stephen's choice of Doom, it's solid everywhere.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Woohoo! The list works much better than expected.

I played a space marine player who thought he was clever by having his termies with TH/SS option.

A few shots from the pathfinders killed them off whilst the avengers, wraithlord and serpent went after the infantry!

However after the match the only new advancements I made (I got 2 since I won and also the character survived) gave me an extra wound (YAY!) and +1 BS (Which is pointless since I have no gun-Ah well not everything goes my way it seems)
 

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YAY! excellent. Glad we were all of some help congrates on the win. Unlucky you got +1 BS but it might come in use in the furture.

Just one question: How the hell did 5 pathfinders take out the TH/SS Termies? Sounds like they were pure awsomeness.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Well. In honesty I was far too lucky for first turn shooting at them when 2 died to AP1 shots and then they failed their pinning check!

Second turn I killed none with them but the wraithlord happened to just be in assault range so he killed the rest over 2 turns.
 
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