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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
OK heres another go.

2000pt s and I know the enemy will be either Eldar or Ork. Not really competitive but obviously would like to win :p

If eldar then I may swap the Captain for a Libby, I lose the biokes as scoring units then though.

Captain 175pts
Artificer, Combi Melta, PW, Bike

Chaplain
Terminator Armour 115pts

Tactical Squad 1 215 pts
10 men, HB, Plasma Gun, Rhino


Tactical Squad 2 205pts
10 men, ML, Flamer, Rhino

Bike Squad 290 pts
8 bikes, Atk Bike, Combi melta, 2xMelta 1x MM (Too much melta?)

Dreadnought 125pts
Plasma Cannon, ML

Dreadnought 115pts
MM, ML

Terminator Assault Squad 450pts
3x LC, 2 x TH/SS
LR Crusader


Assault Squad 125 pts
5 men, Power weapon, Flamer

Whirlwind 85pts

Thunderfire Cannon 100pts
 

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Ok ditch the combi weap on your Captain because you're losing the extra attack because you've got got 2 c.c weapons, take a pistol, or better yet leave the combi take hellfire rounds a relic blade and storm shield - that's a captain which shoots and wounds on 2+ and wounds most things on a 2+ in combat and has a 3+ invulnerabe :)

Missile launchers are better on the Tacticals. Also a meltagun on a single squad with combis on the sgts would be great.

Considering a Captain makes Bikers troops I thought you would have taken more of them.

At 2k you sould take double Raiders for target saturation and unit support and ditch the Assault Squad as 5 won't do a lot.
 

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2000pt s and I know the enemy will be either Eldar or Ork. Not really competitive but obviously would like to win.
First, I think it's flat out WRONG to purpose build an army... and if you and a budddy agree to play that way, then you should think about getting something more concrete from him than Eldar or Orks (cause they're just a little different) The best way to handle all threats is to build a balanced list.. which also means a competative list...

Also, why not just build a competative list? If you want to win, then play to win. If you're trying to "balance" the game between the two of you, then you have point limits to do so, and you should bring the best list you can... and your opponent should bring the best list they can... Now if you're trying to play a narrative game, then that's cool too... and your choices should be based arround that narrative and not a "I'm not serious but want to win" comment... I think you should commit to one or the other...

Looking at your list though, I think that with Bikes, Termies, and a Thunderfire cannon, you're list is just too all over the place to be effective. In order to run those things effectively you need to base the rest of your force around supporting them... Trying to run all three means that you can't effectively support any of them.
 

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I agree with the previous comments: your list is a bit all over the place.

What are your model restrictions? I personally don’t care that you customize your list to your opponent’s, but does seem a bit all over and typically lists that look like this one are comprised of whatever models someone owns.

It’s not criticism or a negative: not many people own all the models necessary to make ANY list possible in a codex.

TBH, with Marines, my recommendation would be to spam ML: some players may see it as wishy washy, but you get one automatically in your tact squads, and can be used effectively against Green Tide or Mech Eldar lists.

They’ll also help against Mech Ork and the very rare but seeing a bit of a resurgence Footdar list.

Keep the Capt. no matter what: drop the combi, like mentioned earlier, take a relic blade.

DON’T take a Libby. If he’s an overly typical Eldar player, he’ll take a Farseer or Eldrad (a super Farseer) and they have wargear that can cause any psyker to you take to fry himself (Runes of Wardiing).

Chappy in termie armor is OK.

Tact squads need ML, PFs, and melta guns.

Bike squad looks OK, drop the combi-melta for PF, change out melta guns for flamers.

Combat squad them so the PF and the MM run together and go tank/MC hunting.

The Dreads are a bit all over the place: if your looking for fire support, make them both Rifleman pattern and give them x2 TL AC. You’ll be able to kill light armor, hordes, and potentially instant kill any multi-wound Eldar model your opponent may take.

I’d drop the Assault Squad, Whirlie and Thunderfire Cannon: take another bike squad.

Lastly: you seem bent on taking a LRC, but I don’t know why. You’re looking at 4th of your army tied up in 6 models + a tank. For the same points, you could take more bikers and another tact squad (6, potentially 12 scoring units if combat squadding).

And if you’re not going to use the full capacity of the LRC, why not the standard LR? The LC’s on it could prove useful.

good hunting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Ok ditch the combi weap on your Captain because you're losing the extra attack because you've got got 2 c.c weapons, take a pistol, or better yet leave the combi take hellfire rounds a relic blade and storm shield - that's a captain which shoots and wounds on 2+ and wounds most things on a 2+ in combat and has a 3+ invulnerabe :)
That sounds like a plan :)

Missile launchers are better on the Tacticals. Also a meltagun on a single squad with combis on the sgts would be great.
Ive been having a lot more luck with my HB than my ML (I have 1 squad with each)

Considering a Captain makes Bikers troops I thought you would have taken more of them.
Only have 1 squad of bikes atm but I'm planning on getting another and will rework my army then.

At 2k you sould take double Raiders for target saturation and unit support and ditch the Assault Squad as 5 won't do a lot.
Struggling to see that the unit is viable in 2k points wise as is, let alone if I add another LR as that would make it 750pts out of 2k. Guess I drop them which is a shame coz I love the models.

CLT40k said:
First, I think it's flat out WRONG to purpose build an army... and if you and a budddy agree to play that way, then you should think about getting something more concrete from him than Eldar or Orks (cause they're just a little different)
Well he's got Orks and Eldar so I KNOW thats what I'll be facing. I could probalby tell yuo exactly what hes got if I wrack my brains a bit. UI dont really gear my list against that because I don;t really know enough about them

CLT40k said:
The best way to handle all threats is to build a balanced list.. which also means a competative list...
Also, why not just build a competative list? If you want to win, then play to win.
Yeah absoloutley I was just pointing out that I'm not playing competitively as in for a tournament or anything. But also I like trying out fdifferent combos and tactics, and I like to field stuff for fun too occasionally.

CLT40k said:
If you're trying to "balance" the game between the two of you, then you have point limits to do so, and you should bring the best list you can... and your opponent should bring the best list they can... Now if you're trying to play a narrative game, then that's cool too... and your choices should be based arround that narrative and not a "I'm not serious but want to win" comment... I think you should commit to one or the other...
Again think you've misunderstood my meaning saying non-competitive

CLT40k said:
Looking at your list though, I think that with Bikes, Termies, and a Thunderfire cannon, you're list is just too all over the place to be effective. In order to run those things effectively you need to base the rest of your force around supporting them... Trying to run all three means that you can't effectively support any of them.
Sorry don't understand that comment. I went for "variety" thinking it would allow me to be versatile, from the comments I'm guessing thats not the case?


Inquisitor Malaclypse said:
I agree with the previous comments: your list is a bit all over the place.

What are your model restrictions? I personally don’t care that you customize your list to your opponent’s, but does seem a bit all over and typically lists that look like this one are comprised of whatever models someone owns.

It’s not criticism or a negative: not many people own all the models necessary to make ANY list possible in a codex.
Yeah its based on what I've got, would I maybe be better posting what I've got modelwise and then see what yuo guys make out of it. I'm getting the feeling I've picked totally wrong stuff. Not a suprise as I tend to pick what I like the looks of and what sounds good.

In addition to whats listed I've got

Sicarius
Telion
Azrael - (would be DA codex list then though)
Chronus

5 extra assault marines
10 scouts with botlers/HB
Another tac squad
Razorback
Landspeeder
Devastator Squad
Command Squad
Legion of the damned squad sgt, 3xbolter, flamer, Hvy Flamer (boxed set + heavy flamer)


Inquisitor Malaclypse said:
TBH, with Marines, my recommendation would be to spam ML: some players may see it as wishy washy, but you get one automatically in your tact squads, and can be used effectively against Green Tide or Mech Eldar lists.

They’ll also help against Mech Ork and the very rare but seeing a bit of a resurgence Footdar list.

Keep the Capt. no matter what: drop the combi, like mentioned earlier, take a relic blade.
Inquisitor Malaclypse said:
DON’T take a Libby. If he’s an overly typical Eldar player, he’ll take a Farseer or Eldrad (a super Farseer) and they have wargear that can cause any psyker to you take to fry himself (Runes of Wardiing).
Am I better off just letting him get on with the psycic stuff then? last game I took a libby and had some limited success using the hood to nullify.

Inquisitor Malaclypse said:
Tact squads need ML, PFs, and melta guns.
Why PFs? seems a lot of points for something you dont use? Everytime my tacs have got into CC they've been pretty much anhilated anyway.

Inquisitor Malaclypse said:
Bike squad looks OK, drop the combi-melta for PF, change out melta guns for flamers.

Combat squad them so the PF and the MM run together and go tank/MC hunting.
Inquisitor Malaclypse said:
The Dreads are a bit all over the place: if your looking for fire support, make them both Rifleman pattern and give them x2 TL AC. You’ll be able to kill light armor, hordes, and potentially instant kill any multi-wound Eldar model your opponent may take.
Sorry what is "rifleman" pattern? and whare do I get TL AC models from?


I’d drop the Assault Squad, Whirlie and Thunderfire Cannon: take another bike squad.

Inquisitor Malaclypse said:
Lastly: you seem bent on taking a LRC, but I don’t know why. You’re looking at 4th of your army tied up in 6 models + a tank. For the same points, you could take more bikers and another tact squad (6, potentially 12 scoring units if combat squadding).
Not at all, I liked the models so bought them, but as I said above I'm struggling to see them as viable.


As a side note, some reasoning behind your comments would be good, atm a lot of it is just use "x its better than y" and when othe rpeople are saying "use y its better than x" it gets confusing with so much contradicting advice.
While I appreciate the time people have taken to provide generally constructive feedback If you provide some reasoning it would allow me to learn from your experience and hopefully improve my list building (which is obviously poor atm confirmed by my inability to win hehe)

I'll rework my list given the above and try again shortly.

Think I'll look at getting another bike squad too

Cheers
Gareth
 

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Am I better off just letting him get on with the psycic stuff then? last game I took a libby and had some limited success using the hood to nullify.
I would say you've almost got to take a libby... The ability to nullify his psy is worth not being able to cast Null Zone or Avenger.

The basic flaw in your list is that you've got 1/2 of your points sunk into 2 units. The end result is that you have sooo much in those two units, that you don't have the points to do anything else. Your opponent on the other hand, will be able to put more force against your army without having to do much in terms of target priority. In this list, once you cripple the LR, you're home free. The bikes will die to things that kill them via AP... the termies to volume of fire. So in order to completely trash your battle plan, I've just gotta deal with 3 units... once they're gone, your list has no teeth. And I think most good lists can do that with ease.

Get what you're saying about the competative bit... sorry if I came off like a tool...
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I would say you've almost got to take a libby... The ability to nullify his psy is worth not being able to cast Null Zone or Avenger.

The basic flaw in your list is that you've got 1/2 of your points sunk into 2 units. The end result is that you have sooo much in those two units, that you don't have the points to do anything else.
Yeah but they're so "cool" :p .
I'm already thinking along those lines but then at what points value is it viable to play a unit like that? I'm guessing they're going back on the shelf which is a shame.

So I drop the termis and save 450 pts
Swap the Chaplain for a Librarian?

What do I invest in, given the list of stuff I have (can't afford to spend anymore atm)

Extra Tac squad + ?

Get what you're saying about the competative bit... sorry if I came off like a tool...
Nah no worries, I only sdaid it really coz of what it says in the stickied post. At the end of the day its a competitive game whichever way you look at it. I just enjoy the collecting, painting, playing and winning in that order. Rather than the other weay round :p
 
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