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Hi guys,

when someone is playing against CSM, what does he expect?
Mostly a mechanized heavy army. Here I tried to take advantage of this expectation.
Not a single tank and no big use. So all the nice anti-tank, anti-MC weapons should be rather useless.


So here we go:

*************** 1 HQ ***************
Abbaddon the Despoiler 275 Points
*************** 1 Elite ***************

5 Chaos Terminators 1
- Tzeentch
- 1 x Power fist
- 4 x pair of lightning claws
- 1 x Reaper autocannon 2
- - - > 260 Points


*************** 3 Troops ***************

9 Thousand Sons
- Doombolt
- - - > 254 Points

9 Thousand Sons
- Doombolt
- - - > 254 Points

10 Chaos Space Marines
- Aspiring Champion
- Power fist
- Chaos Glory
- Meltagun
- Missile launcher
- - - > 220 Points


*************** 1 Fast ***************

3 Chaos Bikers
- 2 x Meltagun
- - - > 119 Points


*************** 3 Heavy ***************

8 Chaos Havocs
- 4 x Missile launcher
- - - > 200 Points

8 Chaos Havocs
- 4 x Autocannon
- - - > 200 Points

3 Obliberators

---> 2007 pts.

The idea is that most of the force will stay back and drop heavy fire on the advancing enemy 3 LC, 5ML, 1Reaper and 4 Autocannons should create enough anti-tank/MC and anti-transport against advancing MCs, transports and tanks. Everything which comes closer have to face the firing of 2 1ksons units. If anything comes too close to my shooty units, the termis or abbadon or both will charge.
The bikes should go for stationary tanks or units which are out of the range of my LCs.

After the 2-3 rounds of heavy fire, the 1ksons, Abbadon and the termis will advance to control or contest objectives.

I expect problems against highly mobile armies and dedicated shooty armies. But apart from that, I think this list might do well (of course not in a competitive/tournament environment).

What do you think? Any suggestions (please take the idea of the army into account)?

thx

b.anthracis
 

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i'll skip a lot of the things i'd say to new players; you've posted, seen, and commented and skip out obvious remarks...

i'd drop the bikers IMO, that's your weakest unit because you have three of them. if anything, i would take the points for them and use them to bulk up your termie squad. for the same points you could take 3 more termies with combi's.

i just don't think small bike units are that effective. depending on luck and terrain you play on, they could kill themselves rather easily on dangerious terrain tests, for one.

good hunting.
 

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I expect problems against highly mobile armies and dedicated shooty armies. But apart from that, I think this list might do well (of course not in a competitive/tournament environment).

Unfortunately this will encompass the majority of competitive armies you will face in 5th edition. There is a reason opponents will expect mechanization. Instead of using their high strength weapons on tanks, they will use them (and their low AP) on your slow Termies. So while you are denying opponents any armor to shoot at, you are also denying yourself any armor to (a) hide inside and (b) give you mobility. You say that after 2 to 3 rounds of firing your Tsons and Termies will advance to objectives, but I would say you will need to advance from turn 1 to have a chance of getting to them in time.

There are good reasons for Mechanization to be the trend in 5th, and by bucking that trend, you are rendering yourself un-competitive, or certainly less competitive. Not all tanks are point sinks. Take a bunch of 50 point rhinos. Your list will be the better for it.

Now, it looks like you aren't necessarily going for competitive, so most of this may be moot. That said, I wouldn't consider this list all that much fun to play either. Slow and inflexible leads to boring games.
 

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one thing i would add is that this squad

10 Chaos Space Marines
- Aspiring Champion
- Power fist
- Chaos Glory
- Meltagun
- Missile launcher
- - - > 220 Points

sort of seems confused to me you've got a power fist for cc a melta for close range and a missle launcher for waaay far away, i might get rid of the melta and replace it with plasma that way you have two more ranged guns or just get two melta and be a tank hunting squad, the problem with a tank hunting squad however is that youd dont have a transport so all tanks will jsut avoid you, so with the foot setup maybe the ml and plasma is they way to go, or maybe youve got it right, ive never played all foot so just mess around with it

you might even want to try rely more heavily on fast attack *gasp* but i think that might actually help this force get to the opponent and divide their fire, and then you could also put an icon in the squad and then have some lesser daemons rip out of nowhere and be right on top of them. I have no idea if that would work but i feel like that would be a really fun army to play using alot of csm fast attack to drop alot of lesser daemons on them while they are getting hit from a foot base from range. this is just me being crazy though but hey crazy is always an option for csm!
 

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Great Unclean One
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posting from work

I had a crack at this one, and came up with this:


HQ
• Abaddon the Despoiler

275 points

ELITES
• 5 Terminators
- Icon of Chaos Glory; Reaper autocannon and chainfist; 4 combi-meltas
220 points

TROOPS
• 9 Thousand Sons
- Aspiring Sorceror with Bolt of Change
269 points
• 9 Thousand Sons - Aspiring Sorceror with Bolt of Change
269 points
• 10 Chaos Marines - Aspiring Champion with powerfist and Icon of Chaos Glory; 2 meltaguns; Rhino
255 points
• 9 Lesser Daemons of Tzeentch
117 points

HEAVY SUPPORT
• 3 Obliterators

225 points
• 3 Obliterators
225 points
• Vindicator - Daemonic Possession
145 points

TOTAL:
2,000 points


hth
 

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i don't think OP will approve at the Vindicator, but i think it sits nicely in there, Nice list Svart.
 

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Even though the vindicator breaks all infantry as always Svart makes an amazing chaos list,
 

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Great Unclean One
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Doh...I completely missed the 'not a single tank' bit in the OP; and I happen to agree about Abaddon, I think he's pretty much for 2,500-point games or above at his points cost and power level. So, given that I also think Obliterators are the Tzeentchiest Heavy Support choice there is, try this:


HQ
• Daemon Prince
- Mark of Tzeentch; Wings; Warptime, Bolt of Change
200 points

ELITES
• 5 Terminators
- Icon of Chaos Glory; Reaper autocannon and powerfist; 4 combi-meltas
215 points

TROOPS
• 9 Thousand Sons
- Aspiring Sorceror with Bolt of Change
269 points
• 9 Thousand Sons - Aspiring Sorceror with Bolt of Change
269 points
• 10 Chaos Marines - Aspiring Champion with powerfist and Icon of Chaos Glory; 2 meltaguns; Rhino
255 points
• 9 Lesser Daemons of Tzeentch
117 points

HEAVY SUPPORT
• 3 Obliterators

225 points
• 3 Obliterators
225 points
• 3 Obliterators
225 points

TOTAL:
2,000 points



:)
 

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actually i think svart has pretty much made the best chaos list you can do with tzeentch and no tanks, the olbits are great at range which mean your enemies will have to close in on your ap 3 bolters.

o_O how do you do it svart i don't think i have seen a bad list from you ever
 

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I would use a winged sorcerer instead of a prince for survivability - that prince will be dead on turn 1 as the only MC in a no tank 2k list. The sorcerer can at least have some ablative wounds!
 
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