Warhammer 40k Forum and Wargaming Forums banner

1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
STRIKE FORCE NOT-ULTRA
Captain Lysand*whack* Grand Master Belial - 230pts
Deathwing Squad with 5 Additional Terminators and 2 Cyclone Missile Launchers - 400pts
Deathwing Squad with Cyclone Missile Launcher - 190pts
Deathwing Assault Squad - 165pts
Deathwing Assault Squad with 4 Thunder Hammers and Storm Shields - 220pts
Stormraven Gunship with Twin-Linked Multi-Melta and hastily-painted-over Ultramarines symbols - 200pts
Land Raider Crusader with Multi-Melta - 260pts
Venerable Dreadnought with Plasma Cannon in Drop Pod - 165pts

+1 shot with all ranged weapons on the turn they Deep Strike, +1 attack on the turn they disembark for the first time.

If you wanted to cut the points down and bring in an Allied Detachment of 5 Scouts and a Chapter Master in Terminator Armour, the wording is that all ranged weapons in the unit get an extra shot, so I guess you could fire your Orbital Bombardment twice to be dumb.

@Xabre @ntaw
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,848 Posts
Know what this reminds me?

How lousy Deathwing is right now.

and I don't know what Ultra is compared to DW, sadly. I wanted to say a few times Plasminators for the rule of cool, until I realized what you really had done.
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Know what this reminds me?

How lousy Deathwing is right now.

and I don't know what Ultra is compared to DW, sadly. I wanted to say a few times Plasminators for the rule of cool, until I realized what you really had done.
Strike Force Ultra - everything except the Land Raider and its' cargo start off the board. You can roll for reserves starting on turn 1, kinda like Deathwing, and on the turn that you Deep Strike or the first time you disembark from a transport, you get +1 shot with all your weapons if you're a shooty Terminator (and re-roll 1s to hit with Storm Bolters for being Imperial Fists), or +1 attack if you're an assault Terminator. Lysander gives a 12" bubble of re-rollable Leadership to kinda emulate Fearless.

But hopefully, this weekend, the real Deathwing will be a viable option.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,323 Posts
But hopefully, this weekend, the real Deathwing will be a viable option.
With all luck, though it's looking like taking a DW army and popping it wholly in reserve is out...but I have read GW state 'look for the Deathwing to be charging turn 2', so I'll have to just bite my tongue and wait for the book.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,848 Posts
Most of what I have seen involves being able to dictate 2, 3 or 4 as an entry turn for DW... and some other things suggesting that's because turn 1 the Ravenwing get in position to act as Teleport Homers. I feel like they're pushing RavenDeath more than any single aspect of the army list.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,323 Posts
Yeah, fuck Ravenwing. I'll use BA drop pods with teleport homers as allies before I take those black bike riding pussies.

This is me constantly and forever venting GW telling me how to play my armies through Formations. They're cool but it grates against me at times. I'll get over it...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
443 Posts
With all luck, though it's looking like taking a DW army and popping it wholly in reserve is out...but I have read GW state 'look for the Deathwing to be charging turn 2', so I'll have to just bite my tongue and wait for the book.
Where have you read that?
stop giving me hope, im already disappointed.

Yeah, fuck Ravenwing. I'll use BA drop pods with teleport homers as allies before I take those black bike riding pussies.

This is me constantly and forever venting GW telling me how to play my armies through Formations. They're cool but it grates against me at times. I'll get over it...
Aye! Formations are cool but should be an alternative to CAD not an outright better choice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,323 Posts
Where have you read that?
stop giving me hope, im already disappointed.
There is no hope. I have since seen the book, T1 DS is out, and the soonest you can assault with DW is T3 assuming you DS T2.

Aye! Formations are cool but should be an alternative to CAD not an outright better choice.
The nifty thing about the formations vs. the detachments in the DA book is that they're pretty much entirely interchangeable in terms of units. A little bit of squad restructuring and you have the same force with different rules for it, though there are some differences in play style.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,848 Posts
There is no hope. I have since seen the book, T1 DS is out, and the soonest you can assault with DW is T3 assuming you DS T2.



The nifty thing about the formations vs. the detachments in the DA book is that they're pretty much entirely interchangeable in terms of units. A little bit of squad restructuring and you have the same force with different rules for it, though there are some differences in play style.
yep and yep. DW isn't designed for a 1st turn Alpha Strike anymore. They're a Take-and-Hold army, letting the Ravenwing do their job as advance scouts instead. But the formations are pretty mutable; I just built a full Ravenwing list that can be run as two different sets of formations, depending on the bonuses I want for that list. I really love what they've done with Ravenwing with those options. Deathwing is a little bit more lack luster this time around, I think. Though I'm not sure what the Redemption Formation gets.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,323 Posts
Though I'm not sure what the Redemption Formation gets.
The whole formation chooses whether to show up T2,3,4 as opposed to the detachment's choose to pass or fail reserve rolls for each unit provided there's some RW stuff happening. Shooting and running the turn they arrive remains the same, as well as the Venerable restrictions involving drop pods. It's also a bit more restrictive on the number of units involved from each selection (eg. 2-5 DW, 0-1 DWK), but at least you don't need RW on the table to get a reserve buff.

Another key difference between this and the detachment is that the detachment HQs need only the Deathwing rule (which everyone has bar Sammael/Sableclaw), and the formation requires either a chapter master, interrogator chaplain, librarian, or belial. Any option must take TDA (aside from Belial, obvs). Another slap in the face to my collection, where I commonly took Azrael with a Guard blob and a couple DW squads to support...now if I do that I lose the reserve buff out of my lack of RW models.

So far it looks like I'm selling a TLLC Mortis and my converted Azrael/bearer :laugh:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
443 Posts
So land raiders are not part of the first company anymore it seems....
Can take them as dedicated transports but cant actually field them. Cant take any heavy support LRs either or FW variants.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,323 Posts
Can take them as dedicated transports but cant actually field them.
You're jumping the gun a little bit home slice. Deathwing squads of any type can take any type of in-codex land raider as dedicated transport (I'm not familiar with the wording of anything from FW aside from the Mortis dreads), just like any other squad of terminators, and dedicated transports are allowed within any formation unless otherwise stated. The only restrictions are the ones that I have stated; you just don't have the option of taking LRs as heavy support options.

Side note, the deathwing upgrade for LRs is gone.

Which makes sense, because it's part of the Lion's Blade, so can function without RW.
Lol. The formation makes sense to work by itself because it's meant to be part of a much larger detachment (most of whose auxiliary selections are RW based), but the detachment isn't supposed to work without RW support because...it...isn't a standalone detachment at all...and....

This all seems very backward :laugh:

EDIT: Does any of this even remotely relate to MS's list?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
443 Posts
You're jumping the gun a little bit home slice. Deathwing squads of any type can take any type of in-codex land raider as dedicated transport (I'm not familiar with the wording of anything from FW aside from the Mortis dreads), just like any other squad of terminators, and dedicated transports are allowed within any formation unless otherwise stated. The only restrictions are the ones that I have stated; you just don't have the option of taking LRs as heavy support options.

Side note, the deathwing upgrade for LRs is gone.
EDIT: Does any of this even remotely relate to MS's list?
I will just say here that, both formation and detachment state that everything must start in Deep Strike Reserve, so if you take LRs as dedicated transports they will HAVE to be in DS Reserve but cant get out of it since they dont have Deep Strike USR, and afaik it does not state anywhere that it confers it from Formation or Detatchment. Same reason why Dreadnoughts are forced into Drop Pods in both formation and Detachment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,323 Posts
Damn, I didn't realize that it said 'Deep Strike Reserve' specifically and not just 'Reserve'. I figured that if they were in a LR they would just drive on from their board edge the selected turn.

That's two pretty large oversights as far as I'm concerned. A caveat for venerables in drop pods but nothing about LRs arriving from DS as a dedicated transport for DW, and the RW detachment is allowed three HQs but there's only one choice (at a time anyway) with the RW rule available in the codex.
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
Top