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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
HQ

Belakor
Typhus

Troops
10x Plague marines 2x melta.

20xcult
10xcult
10xcult


Fast

2xBaledrakes


Heavy
2xOblids MON
2xOblids Mon
2x Oblids Mon

1852 i think.





Would love to hear some suggestions and opinions about this list since i am new with Warhammer 40k

Got smthing like 10 games or so.




Thank you for your time
 

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Army list review

HQ

Belakor
A powerful daemon prince - but also a super expensive daemon prince! As good as he is I think 350 points for this guy is a point sink

Typhus
Again a solid but expensive HQ; this guy shines in close combat so you'll only get your points worth if you can get him into assault ASAP

Troops
10x Plague marines 2x melta.
Solid unit; give them a transport and reduce their unit size to 7

20xcult
10xcult
10xcult
You do not need this many cultists; get more shooty troops!

Fast

2xBaledrakes
Always a good choice; consider using one with a Hades autocannon and one with a baleflamer


Heavy
2xOblids MON
2xOblids Mon
2x Oblids Mon
I think you mean Oblits? These are a solid unit; consider dropping one of these squads for a Vindicator so you have some S10 AP2 Large blast capability

1852 i think.
Unless I've missed something this list will cost 1,826




Would love to hear some suggestions and opinions about this list since i am new with Warhammer 40k

Got smthing like 10 games or so.




Thank you for your time
Okay so some tips in regards to building an army:

1. Don't spend all of your points on HQ choices, yes they are powerful but people can kill them easily in a turn leaving you with a very small army. You have spent 31.4% of your army points on HQs; this is too much!!!!

2. More specifically either take Typhus OR Belakor; if you want a second HQ choice this should be the last thing you do and thus should be a cheap HQ (i.e less than 200 points).

*Edit: Don't take Belakor, just take an Ally Daemon prince for ~100 points less!*

3. Troops, you need more of them! I don't mean spamming cultists, they have their uses but they will die easily. You need proper space marine troops that are worth their points and will stick around.
 

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Warsmith
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Would love to hear some suggestions and opinions about this list since i am new with Warhammer 40k
This is my advice.

1- Look again at your HQ. (Hugh1992 sums it up quite well)
2- Troops.

Split the Plague marines into two squads, (If you can find 4 more marines to add to these squads that rocks). Squads of 7 with 2 special weapons are normally quite the most optimal set-up. The cultists, pull them into two large squads of 20. If your running Typhus the zombie advantage is nice.

On a random note: fortifications are a great way to make Cultists more epic. (An imperial strongpoint - (Bastion and defence line), does cost a bit but when used right makes the Cultists into a great castle).

That should give you 4 troop choices. The Cultists will dispear when targeted so it may be worth finding the points for a few more marines but the two squads of Plague Marines should be a good start.

3- Heavy support.

Oblitorators are fun, I would look at bringing in some other units. Vindicators are good fun, but a unit of havocs with lascannons or autocannons work!.
 

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Hug1992 gives solid advice. I second him.
Also, Uveron says right when he advice you to get 2 plague marines units.
About oblits: three units are just overkill, imo. You could take 3 oblits and 2 vindi, to f*ck things close and personal.
 

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Oblits are a great utility knife to fill holes in your force but don't bring much punch for their points. Spamming them exacerbates this into a real problem.

I think Belakor is great! But you'll need to take some of the heat off of him with another fast assault unit. I'd suggest:

Lord: nurgle, bike, daemonheart, p.fist, l.claw, sigil, blight grenades
5 bikes: nurgle, 2 melta guns, melta bombs

This can easily fit by dropping typhus and a squad of obliterators. You've still got your nurgle troops as well and a hard-as-nails beast in close combat.

You're also guaranteed invisibility to cast on them with Belakor :).
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Thank you for the advice guys.



Nathan got a nice idea.

Tbh i dont know why you guys like vindicators. I know they are cheap. i know thy got a nice blast. Still They are so fragile . Also they have small range. A good player could dodge them until he destroys them with his drop pods etc.. Also i dont know how good the blast is When an average model would get a nice and easy cover save. I was thinkin of havocs my self also. But they are just marine with big guns. Ok. They have to be stationary somewhere propably will get a small focus or smthing wih ignores cover as most of players include in their army and they ll die easy. i like oblids cause of weapon choises they have. Their Mobility cause of deepstrike etc. I think they are our best heavy choice. They are also durable specially with MON


Still thank you foryour time i am trying to improve my list and my self everyday
 

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Their Mobility cause of deepstrike
i've succesfully used oblit deepstrike twice in twelve games. If you want deepstrikers go for suicide terminators. oblits wants to be deplyed from the beginning, they need to shoot every turn to justify their cost.
Also, the vindicator thing is because, imo, you have a very "midtable" aermy and vindicators can support very well your footsloggers, creating an area of death from half the board.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
i ll be honest with you. 10+ games Oblids never failed their deepstrike.they did their job succesfully almost everytime. i have also used termies. they are nice indeed. I ve made many expeiments with my lists. so i have tried few things. since i am at work atm . How much costs the bikers with the lord u mention ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
What you think about a 2k point list.

HQ-Typhus


Troops

20x cult
10x cult

7xPlague melta melta
7x plague plasma plama

7x CSM MON plasma
7x CSM mon Plasma

Fast

2xBale drakes

Elites

3x termies 3 combi melta

Heavy

4 x Oblids MON

Aegis defence line
With Radar for rerroll on Reserves

i think is 1901 points.


I think it has enough Shooting power. A respectable melle. And the ability to strike specific targets. if need to.


Still got room for 99 points :)
 

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10+ games Oblids never failed their deepstrike
i hate you :biggrin: do you play on a tightly terrain packed board or pretty low terrain? Maybe that's why our experience differs so much.

About the lord: @NathanJD 's build is from Crimson Slaughter codex, i don't know if you use it. btw the lord he's proposing would cost about 180 pts, while the unit should come near 170.

About the list: pretty much on the spot. My only critique is: do you really need 6 troop at 2k pts?? moreover 2 of your troops are nurgle marked marines (non fearless, then) those 202 pts could be better spent elsewhere, namely giving your army a fast threat in the form of 5 nurgle spawns, or 5 nurgle bikers. with spre points you could buy a rhino for meltaplague or more zombies...
 

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What you think about a 2k point list.

HQ-Typhus
I would only take Typhus if i was taking plague zombies


Troops

20x cult
10x cult
Good, these guys are awesome for capturing objectives

7xPlague melta melta
7x plague plasma plama

7x CSM MON plasma
7x CSM mon Plasma
Because of get 'gets hot' rules swap the Plague's meltas with the CSMs plasmas; simply due to survivability

Fast
2xBale drakes
Consider a single hades autocannon for anti-air/anti-(light) armour

Elites

3x termies 3 combi melta
Consider MoN for T5

Heavy
4 x Oblids MON
OBLIT, not "oblid"; Good unit split them in 2 teams of two

Aegis defence line
With Radar for rerroll on Reserves
Quad-gun is probably more effective tbh
Okay; Don't get me wrong, Typhus is awesome! However 230 points is rather expensive and when you can buy a pimped-out Chaos Lord for ~145 points you really need to justify the 85 point difference.

It would probably be more competitive to have spent the same points on a Biker Chaos Lord, and 3-4 bikers with MoN. (you can pimp these out further with meltas/PF for a task). On a point for point basis, for less points you have a Chaos Lord with effectively 6 T6 wounds and ~15 attacks compared to Typhus' 4 T5 wounds and 4 attacks.

IF you still want Typhus then awesome, but make sure one or more of your Cultists units are plague zombies to get the most out of him!
 

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I suppose I assume every CSM list is Crimson Slaughter unless it has the burning brand or axe of fury. Free fear!
 

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Tbh i dont know why you guys like vindicators. I know they are cheap. i know thy got a nice blast. Still They are so fragile . Also they have small range. A good player could dodge them until he destroys them with his drop pods etc.. Also i dont know how good the blast is When an average model would get a nice and easy cover save.

I was thinkin of havocs my self also. But they are just marine with big guns.

I like oblids cause of weapon choises they have. Their Mobility cause of deepstrike etc. I think they are our best heavy choice. They are also durable specially with MON

I agree that Havocs are a poor-man's Obliterators and that they can just be killed pretty easily, so the question is which is better, obliterators or Vindicators.

So lets compare them on survivability and ability to kill. for the purpose of this we are comparing 2 MoN obliterators to 1 vindicator as this is around even in points.

Ability to kill:

Vindicator: can fire a single large blast maker 24" which has S10 AP2. Instant killing anything T5 or lower and ignoring all armour saves. (You can fit ~31 models under a large blast marker)

2x Obliterators: Have an array of weapons to pick from, non of which are S10. They are a long range option but for some reason have no risk-free blast capability. Combined they can kill approx 8 models/turn (depending on weapon used).

Essentially, Obliterators have longer range but Vindicators can potentially kill more per turn.

Survivability:
Well lets compare the probability of a various strength hits wounding/killing the Vindicator and the Obliterator.

Vindicator:
S3: Front:0% Side:0% Rear:0%
S4: Front:0% Side:0% Rear:16.67%
S5: Front:0% Side:16.67% Rear:33.33%
S6: Front:0% Side:33.33% Rear:50.00%
S8: Front:33.33% Side:50.00% Rear:66.67%
S10:Front:66.67% Side:100% Rear:100%

Obliterators
S3: 16.67%
S4: 33.33%
S5: 50.00%
S6: 66.66%
S8: 83.33% (Instant death if w/o MoN!)
S10: 83.33% (Instant death too!)

Note this is represents the percentage chance of wounding per hit.

As you can see the vindicator has a much better chance of surviving small arms fire and if it keeps its front facing the enemy it will have a better chance against even S10 weaponry!


So to answer the question regarding why do we all "like Vindicators", Although Obliterators have their place as multi-wound, multi-weapon snipers;
Vindicators are more survivable, more manoeuvrable and are able to massacre up to 31 models a turn with S10 AP2 large blast plates (nobody is safe!).
 

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Entropy Fetishist
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Minor caveat: I feel like it's disengenuous to say "can possibly hit and kill 31 models" because absolutely no player out there is going to cram their models in like that--the nearest you might get is a squad of 20 Plaguebearers DSing in and being unable to run and spread out that turn, but that's an exceedingly rare occurrence: more likely if your opponent isn't careful you'll be able to hit 5-7 models at most with a direct hit or good scatter, and about 4-5 hits if they are careful.

Additionally, "chance to wound" does not include the results of the Pen table--half of which prevents the Vindi from firing the next turn, part of which will destroy its weapon (or coin-flip to do so if you bought a combi-bolter), part of which will lock it in place so it can't get new units in its sights and limited range while also making it unable to turn its good front armor to face a new enemy--oh yeah, and part of which outright kills it, regardless of how many "wounds" it has left. If a Vindi gets penned, it is not happy.

Downsides of Oblits that haven't been addressed: they can't fire the same weapon twice in a row, and they're not fearless so squads of them can run off the board in fear after taking casualties.
 
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