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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
So I want to try out some of those new formations seen in Rising Leviathan II. I'm not sure how much of the rules I can post here of the Skyblight swarm, but its good. the skyblight swarm doesnt count towards the FOC. Here's what I've thought of:

Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 235
Harpy 135
Harpy 135
Hive Crone 155
18 poison gargoyles 144
17 poison gargoyles 136
17 poison gargoyles 136

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 235
3 venomthropes 135
20 hormagaunts 100
20 hormagaunts 100
3x Warrior, barged strangler 100

Total: 1750

gargoyles in the formation have a chance to come back when the unit is killed, and the gargoyles are scoring, and control objectives even if enemies are within 3". Thoughts?
 

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My only concern is your lack of synapse. 3 synapse nodes at 1750 is pretty shoddy. Especially as you're sure to lose at least one flyrant (I always run 2 at 1750 and almost always lose them both). Granted, you're running more FMCs then I do which I'm sure adds some protection. Also, your flyrants are 5 points over I believe. Which total leaves you with 14 more points :).

I would personally drop a venomthrope for a zoanthrope. It gives an extra point of synapse, the possibility of catalyst, and some decent shooting. Plus they are hard to kill. 2 venomthropes should be plenty to give cover to your hormagaunts and warriors. In fact, it may be worth trying 2 zoans and a venomthrope. Since catalyst on your FMCs is pretty damn useful, the gargoyles can come back so they don't need shrouded that badly, and one venomthrope could provide enough buff for at least one hormagaunt squad.

Just something to think about. I have enjoyed using venomthropes this edition but have recently been trying for zoans since I found venomthropes were limiting my mobility.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
Oh yeah... thats a good point. I had warriors backfield cause originally i was going to have Endless swarm, so I had the venoms there to give em a 3+ cover. I'll swap them both out for zoans, seems smarter.

Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 230
Harpy 135
Harpy 135
Hive Crone 155
19 poison gargoyles 152
19 poison gargoyles 152
20 poison gargoyles 160

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 230
2x Zoans 100
2x Zoans 100
20 hormagaunts 100
20 hormagaunts 100

This is 1749. Thoughts?
 

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Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 230 - good
Harpy 135 - take HVC for anti vehicle
Harpy 135 - as above
Hive Crone 155- good
19 poison gargoyles 152
19 poison gargoyles 152
20 poison gargoyles 160
- gargoyles are bad in cc, giving them poison doesn't fix that, and while the ability to return on 4+ is good its unreliable, I would recommend using them mainly for tarpitting and objective grabbing taking smaller units with no upgrades and use the points on better units.

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 230- good
2x Zoans 100
2x Zoans 100 - 2 units of 1 will be just as fine, if opponent really wants them dead they are easy to kill even in a group of 2 as they are equal in staying power to 2 marines per zoan.
20 hormagaunts 100
20 hormagaunts 100 - I can understand what you are trying to do with more fast attacking troops however naked hormagaunts are rather ineffective and will be unlikely to defeat most opponents taking into account losses getting into combat - with poison they would be better.

This is 1749. Thoughts?
If you are looking for a fun list go for it. :)
However if you are looking for a competitive list you need to change some things as right now you have trouble dealing with heavy infantry, MC and vehicles.
The main problem is that your synapse units doubles as you main threat against the things I mentioned meaning they will get killed simply because they have to expose themselves for you to win - if you lose synapse you will need a lot of luck or the rest of the army will disintegrate through failed ib and morale tests.
As an example I would properly go with something like this:

Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 230
Harpy w HVC 140
Harpy w HVC 140
Hive Crone 155
10 gargoyles 60
10 gargoyles 60
10 gargoyles 60

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 230
1x Zoan 50
1x Venomthrope 45
1x Venomthrope 45

30 Termagants w 20 devourers 200
1 Tervigon 195

1 Mawloc 140

- in this set up gargoyles and mawloc starts in reserve - fliers and termagants puts pressure on opponent while under cover from venomthropes - gargoyles go for objectives when they enter play mawloc help clear objectives.
Zoan and tervigon provides mainly buffs and back field synapse.
Taking into account ywmw this list is meant as an idea for you to build on/tweak as you see fit but its what I would bring.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the reply Jernmajoren, I'll just run through what you said as I see it on the page.

Harpies HVC: Yeah, I agree with you. I'll find the points for the HVCs by dropping one gargoyle, that'll give me 8+1 points and since this list is not going to any tournaments no one will care that I'm 1 point over.

Gargoyles: I've got to disagree with you on these guys. The whole purpose of taking the skyblight swarm is to have a lot of FA elements moving towards the enemy. The bonuses the gargoyles get from the dataslate are ridiculous, so it seems counter-intuitive to not capitalize on the bonuses by bringing as many gargoyles as I can. 60 of them will also help with threat overload. I'm not saying gargoyles are good in CC, but the poison will definitely help them. Its cheaper on the gargoyles than on the hormagaunts, and the reason I brought poison is mainly to threaten things like wraithknights or riptides. Your proposed 30 gargoyles will die too fast and too easily to do much in the objective department, to be honest.

Zoanthropes: I'm a little hesitant running single model squads of zoans... they feel way too much like first blood bait. First blood has cost me a ton of games, so in the current set up they're staying at 2.

Hormagaunts: You're right on this one, sadly. I don't have the points for poison on these guys as well though. I could do your suggestion of 30 gaunts / tervigon, and then hide some venomthropes behind them and camp it at mid-field. I do lose 1 shot at catalyst, but eh. Removing the 4 zoans and 40 hormagaunts, I'd still need 40 points for 30 gaunts w 20 devs, tervi, 1 venom. Easiest thing seems to be from the gargoyles but I like those big squads... Thoughts?


Thanks for the input, definitely helped. Here's the list in its current form (41 points over).

Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 230
Harpy, HVC 140
Harpy, HVC 140
Hive Crone 155
19 poison gargoyles 152
19 poison gargoyles 152
19 poison gargoyles 152

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 230
Tervigon 195
30 gaunts, 20 devs 200
Venomthrope 45

Thanks
-Arcticor
 

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Oh yeah... thats a good point. I had warriors backfield cause originally i was going to have Endless swarm, so I had the venoms there to give em a 3+ cover. I'll swap them both out for zoans, seems smarter.

Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 230
Harpy 135
Harpy 135
Hive Crone 155
19 poison gargoyles 152
19 poison gargoyles 152
20 poison gargoyles 160

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 230
2x Zoans 100
2x Zoans 100
20 hormagaunts 100
20 hormagaunts 100

This is 1749. Thoughts?
I like this list much more then the third one you have posted. I may be stuck in the days of the past and a scoring tervigon is still pretty fucking great and so are 30 shrouded termagaunts. But that's not the list and it certainly is not the list with skyblight swarm. The whole point is to be fast and overwhelm them with targets.

I know hormagaunts should have toxin sacs but they are not needed, as long as you tie up stuff. I tied my last game (sure a win would have been better) by tying up all my opponents obliterators with hormagaunts. I run them bare because they are going to die and I would rather have more hormagaunts. Sure they are wounding marines on 5's, but who needs to win combat with hormagaunts? No one. They are a fast unit and I use mine to die up deadly shooting elements while things like carnfiexes get closer to actually deliver the killing blows.

Of course, at the end of the day it is your list and your playstyle. But I like the second list more and I believe stays more true to the fast moving swarm. Plus, zoanthropes are not equal to two space marines. 2 3++ wounds is much better. Sure, someone smart is pouring S8+ into them, but that is less S8+ into your tyrants and other FMCs. Besides, it really pisses people off when they pour a ton of shots into zoanthropes. Plus the extra chance for catalyst (and the other powers are growing on me too) makes the zoans a pretty good purchase. They are a synapse source that is hard to kill and is not a huge threat so not a huge target. Tervigons being scoring always makes them a big target, plus they can kill termaguants that way too.

Just my long thoughts on the issue.
 

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@ lockeF - Some good points there, though as for zoans in my experience (local meta) most armies rely on torrent fire with str 5-7 or poison and high ap (4-6) but huge rate of fire and thus 3++ or 3+ is basicly the same, but that could well be different where you play, making both our statements true from a certain point of view.

Having giving the list some more thought the main problems I see is lack of synapse and the ability to disengage scoring units stuck in combat.
The main problem with using the fliers for the job is that apart from the tyrants they arent very good in cc and using the tyrants will likely get them killed.
The toxin on the gargoyles can imo be dropped and instead you could get some more synapse?

I had something like this in mind based on the input given.

Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 230
HVC Harpy 140
HVC Harpy 140
Hive Crone 155
18 gargoyles 108
18 gargoyles 108
18 gargoyles 108

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 230
2x Zoans 100
2x Venomthrope 90
18x hormagaunts 90
18x hormagaunts 90
4x Warriors w/rending, talons, glands 160

the warriors could be changed to shrikes oc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
Skyblight:
Flyrant, devs 230
Harpy, HVC 140
Harpy, HVC 140
Hive Crone 155
19 poison gargoyles 152
19 poison gargoyles 152
19 poison gargoyles 152

Primary Detachment:
Flyrant, devs 230
2x Zoans 100
2x Zoans 100
20 hormagaunts 100
20 hormagaunts 100
So I ran the above list a few days ago against an eldar player. We played the scouring, and end total was 15 to 4, me. So this list definitely works. One thing I noticed though is that all the little gribblies died. Like, all of them save five or six. The only reason I won was because he only had a wraithknight left and I sat my now scoring FMCs on the objectives. The hormagaunts were more tarpits than anything killy. I'm thinking of modifying this a bit to make the gargs and hormagaunts more survivable... I'm thinking venomthropes? I'm just not sure how to squeeze them in with this style of list.. thoughts? I like the list above this post, but the gargoyles dont have poison in that... i just need more points..grumble
-Arcticor
 
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