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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
1 10 man Tactical Squad and 1 5 man Tactical

Scout squad all with sniper rifles and camo cloaks

2 Assault squads

1 Dreadnought w/ assault cannon and power fist and heavy flamer

1 Devastator squad with 2 heavy bolters, missle launcher, and plasma cannon

Space Marine Captain w/ boltgun and power fist

2 Rhinos each with storm bolters

Predator w/ twin las cannons, heavy bolter sponsons and xtra armor

Terminator sqaud w/ 1 assault cannon and 1 heavy flamer
 

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how large are the assault and scout squads? do you have any special weapons on the tac squads? also, are you going for a more fluff list or a fluff/competitive list?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
im going fluff/competitve.

The ten man tactical squad has a missile launcher and a flamer and the other tactical squad has a sargeant with a power fist and melta bombs.
scout squad is 5 man as well as both assault squads (both sargeants have plasma pistols)
 

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ok cool, i like to keep my lists a bit fluffy as well, more fun for me that way. major thing that i see is you dont have that many scoring troops, if you combat squad the ten man you only have four small five man units. also slighly lacking on anti-armor so you might have some trouble with the mech-spam thats popular at the moment. but that also depends on your local gamers playing style.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the input! :) luckily the players i know arent mech freaks. they mostly have close combat squads, so im hoping to keep them at arms length.
 

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you should think about working in lysander if you're not opposed to special characters, his bolter drill could help with that
 

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My feeling with devastators is all the same weapon, and a cheap one at that. For example 5-man squad with 4xHB or 4xML. The latter will be helpful anti-armour, and can still fire effectively on infantry. Might give them a razorback too, even just with HB.
 

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You just don't have enough ranged threat in this list. The ML from your dev squad and your tac squad aren't really that reliable. And your Pred could be set up more effectively. So at best you'll have 3 threats on the table per turn... so vs a good shooty list you should be quickly outshot.

You might consider giving your captain a relic blade... You're paying for his high I... why not use it... the PF is wasted on him IMO.

As a competative list, I think you can build a lot more threat into what you're doing. I would suggest that you should have at least 7 things that can shoot effectively at 1500 points.... else you'll get outshot...

For example, here's my stock coded 1500 list...
  • Libby
  • 2 full tac squads in Razorbacks w/ TL Las
  • 2 Autocannon dreads (Rifleman)
  • 3 Speeders w/ Typhoon/MM
  • 3 AutoLas predators
Now granted, I tend to go really shooty in my Marine lists... but the intent here is to show that you can get a lot more into your list than you currently have.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
If i get the chance to make a 2000pt army im deffinetly including lysander, he has great stats, and ill include a land raider too. im glad you guys are pointing these things out for me, since this is the first list i have made.
 

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1 10 man Tactical Squad
Whats in this squad, all we know is that you have ten tactical marines and thats it. No clue if you are making use of any special or heavy weapons and if the sergeant has anything.

For this unit I would suggest a powerfist on the sergeant, a meltagun and missile launcher for the squad.

1 5 man Tactical
Again no idea whats in the squad; I's suggest a power weapon and meltabombs, maybe a combi-flamer, and give them a stock razorback.

Scout squad all with sniper rifles and camo cloaks
Alright, at least this unit has some stuff included in it. I would advise a heavy weapon in addition to this squad, not much more expensive and can give you the added weight of fire or threat of the given heavy weapon.

2 Assault squads
How many and what upgrades, for all we know these are two stock five man squads, in which case you'd be better off dropping one, bulking up the other to about eight strong, and giving that sergeant a powerfist.

1 Dreadnought w/ assault cannon and power fist and heavy flamer
I'd suggest the plasmacannon over the assault cannon, and would say leave the flamer at home. The plasmacannon might not have the shot count of the assault cannon, but it does have better range, higher strength, and lower AP meaning it can be hitting sooner, and be more of a threat to heavy infantry and medium armour.

1 Devastator squad with 2 heavy bolters, missle launcher, and plasma cannon
No idea on squad size, but I'm willing to bet this is five guys. I see this quite often and say the following just as often: when dealing with heavy weapon squads a good rule of thumb is two guys to every heavy weapon, a rule of two if you will.

As this squad is setup, the moment the sergeant falls you have to start risking the heavy weapons and drop the overall effectiveness of the unit.


Then there are the weapons themselves, your unit is mostly lacking in focus. The heavy bolters are better at infantry and the lightest armour, the plasmacannon and missile launcher good all arounders that can tackle medium armour and heavy infantry (with the plasmacannon being a little more risky.) I would suggest going all of one heavy weapon, preferably the missile launcher, and bulking the squad up to six strong (three heavy weapons) or eight strong (four heavy weapons.)

Space Marine Captain w/ boltgun and power fist
As has been mentioned before, you pay for the high initiative, no reason for you to go and pay more to dumb it down. I would say drop the fist, let the squads with upgrade characters carry them, not the guy who can be singled out and does not want to be going last in combat.

2 Rhinos each with storm bolters
Who's getting these? Put them with the unit they are transporting, they are an upgrade to that unit after all.

Predator w/ twin las cannons, heavy bolter sponsons and xtra armor
Very unfocused unit; I would suggest swapping position of the weapons. Autocannon turret and lascannon sponsons, extra armour optional.

You lose out on the number of heavy bolter shots, but double up on number of possible lascannon shots, and the autocannon can harm most medium armour and both weapons can be used against heavy infantry and big monsters.

Terminator sqaud w/ 1 assault cannon and 1 heavy flamer
Right, so off the top of my head, in this codex the only way for you to get two special weapons in a terminator squad is to make them ten strong (no more five strong two assault cannons for us.) So thats in the area of 450 points for this unit.

Yeah I would suggest dropping down to five, or at least splitting into two squads. If you plan on walking them, then I would suggest cyclone missile launchers; long range, more than one high strength shot, overall decent choice.
 

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ML can't fire though... as you cout as moving the turn you come down... so you've gotta sit still for two turns to get that heavy weapon off...
Just to clarify, I was not arguing it would be strong, but rather if you wanted Devastators there might be a better way to equip them. Mismatched weapons leaves them with mismatched roles.

Add to that the special Devastator discount (so special, it costs more) means LCs and such are cheaper bought with your Tacs.

4xML or 4xHB doesn't spend too much on them, and gives them a role. I'd prolly prefer the ML. If you field them that way it makes no sense to buy extra bodies - why pay 16pts to save a 15pt weapon? Take the minimum, bunker them somewhere, and try to ensure your opponent either can't reach them or has other targets.
 

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If you field them that way it makes no sense to buy extra bodies - why pay 16pts to save a 15pt weapon? Take the minimum, bunker them somewhere, and try to ensure your opponent either can't reach them or has other targets.
Four missile launchers, four heavy bolters, four plasmacannons, multi-melta's, lascannons, in the end it does not matter what weapons you have chosen the fact that you have a lot of them in one place makes them a high value target. A high value target that cannot take to much fire; doesn't take to juch effort to recognize the threat they can possess and to aim something their way. It takes but one turn of fire, two failed saves, before the effectiveness of the five man-four heavy weapon squad decreases. If I have a six strong-three heavy weapon squad for about the same price it takes at least four shots before those heavy weapons need to be risked.

Yeah you can try to go with great placement, but then you limit yourself in regards to fire lanes and range.
 

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Darkreever, you make a very good point. i dont think that i have ever really considered the 6:3 or 8:4 heavy weapon ratio for devastators befor. always just maxed out on weapons and hid them
 

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Four missile launchers, four heavy bolters, four plasmacannons, multi-melta's, lascannons, in the end it does not matter what weapons you have chosen the fact that you have a lot of them in one place makes them a high value target. A high value target that cannot take to much fire; doesn't take to juch effort to recognize the threat they can possess and to aim something their way. It takes but one turn of fire, two failed saves, before the effectiveness of the five man-four heavy weapon squad decreases. If I have a six strong-three heavy weapon squad for about the same price it takes at least four shots before those heavy weapons need to be risked.

Yeah you can try to go with great placement, but then you limit yourself in regards to fire lanes and range.
You proffer a reasonable argument. If one is most concerned for resilience vs. cost, I feel like 6:3 is worth trying, e.g. MLx3 and 6 bodies.

If on the other hand you are most concerned to pay a reasonable cost vs. other options, I feel you are more fenced in. At 167pts you have to think of trades like two dakka preds or typhoons, or one sternguard with rhino and a melta etc. At the lower 150pts you can look at the fire output and feel like it is not wholly outmatched by other options. Two typhoons would carry the same weight of fire, and cost more.

So perhaps our divergent views are a product of choices of priority. Resiliance on the field, or comparative weight of fire brought to the field. These are fair arguments to make.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
i appreciate all the advice. Would it be better if i replace the Dev squad with another Tactical?
 
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