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Hi all, new to this forum :) I have recently started an Ultramarines army that I want to make to 1500 points for now anyway. I want to make it an all comers list but am unsure if this is viable or not. any advice and guidance would be appreciated.

HQ (215pts)


  • Chapter Master (215pts) Artificer Armor, Bike, Storm Shield, Thunder Hammer
Elites (225pts)


  • Terminator Assault Squad (225pts) 5 X TH/SS
Troops (560pts)


  • Bike Squad (125pts)
    5 X Space Marine Bikers with 2 X Meltaguns, Biker Sergeant with Chainsword

  • Tactical Squad (220pts) Meltagun, 9x Space Marine
    • Drop Pod: Storm Bolter
    • Space Marine Sergeant: Combi-Melta, Power Fist
  • Tactical Squad (215pts) Plasma Gun, 9x Space Marine
    • Drop Pod: Storm Bolter
    • Space Marine Sergeant: Combi-Plasma, Power Weapon
Heavy Support (500pts)


  • Centurion Devastator Squad (250pts) 3x Grav-cannon and grav-amp

  • Land Raider Crusader (250pts)
I suspect the drop pods won't work well with the bikes, and would suggest rhinos instead. Or I would equip both squads the same way - with melta. It's not that plasma is a bad choice. Plasma is a good choice. But I see plasma better for shooting from the hatch than for dropping right into the enemy lines. Melta is probably nastier for that. I would also see if I could find points for an MM on the Crusader as it is a bargain.

Did you consider any characters?
 

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You can keep them in no problem, I just feel like Rhinos would serve your list better. If you want to build a list around Drop Pods you're gunna need a few more Drop Pods, always in odd numbers. That way you capitalize on the whole Turn 1 Deep Strike thing with them. Most Pod lists deal with smaller size units, Dreadnoughts, and 5+ Pods, depending on points limit.
I agree with ntaw here. 5 pods could be about right. Maybe instead of suggesting specifics, I can suggest some principles that could influence your choices.

1. What is your concept for winning? What will your force do to take the game?
2. Does your concept fit well with the army you've chosen? Marines are no good at artillery range. They can be decent in assault. They are best at putting down a lot of medium and medium-long fire.
3. Are you offering your opponent easy targets? Or are you forcing him to choose between equal threats?
4. What range(s) are you choosing to operate at? Are your units weapons coordinated or diluted at that range? If you split your units into lots of different jobs they end up covering each range weakly and can't support one another because the range that one unit wants to work at is totally different from the range another wants to work at. That in turn can make them vulnerable to assaults because they are separated across the field. Your plan often will need you to cover more than one range of course, but be careful of stranding lone units. Remember that a lot of the movement on the table is about getting your force into ideal range, while your opponent's is not. The more divided your units ranges are, the harder it is to do that and the less the weight of fire you drop onto opponent once you gain the range you want.
5. Can you deal with horde? Can you deal with armour? Can you deal with MEQ? e.g. flamers cover horde. TH/SS or melta will deal with most armour. Plasma is great for MEQ. For this reason often a combi-flamer is a good pick for a sgt, for a force that wants to stay at range, or an actual flamer for one that wants to get close.

Your initial force looks like it wants to win by striking into your opponent's lines. It feels very strike-y to me. But I can see also that it is split. Your Centurion Devastators probably wouldn't support striking as well as another drop pod and squad of tax would, or more bikes! Your squad armed with plasma wants to work at a different range from everything else in your list. So it is stranded on the field. All your sgts will want power weapons I should think, if planning to engage. Your Crusader is a good rock and could work well with your list, but would want an MM if planning to end up close to stuff.

Your picks are all reasonable and good units in their own way. I just feel they might not work as cohesively as you would like. Cohesive forces tend to be a real pleasure to play. While ones split over many jobs tend to feel a bit jumbled and unable to work how you want.
 

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Wow, I just realized that was a Crusader and not a Redeemer with Multi Melta. You should try out both tanks, I basically only use the Redeemer at this point. Those flamers are just way more useful.
Don't heed the words of a minion of Chaos. The Crusader is the superior tank... ;)

Well, really that depends on your army concept. I see VSM as a hard-to-budge mid-range shooting army than assault (they can assault, but are better shooting). So for me the Crusader best fits. And that is true even if it is carrying TH/SS termies. But if your plan is to get in close then the Redeemer is not wholly without merit.
 

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Thanks for all the input guys :) So i've had a look and came up with this, got 150 points spare and am unsure what to use it for. I was thinking of putting a termi captain with ass terminators but don't know where to get those points from.


  • Terminator Captain, Terminator Armour, Storm Shield, Thunder Hammer

  • Dreadnought, Assault Cannon, Drop Pod

  • Dreadnought, Assault Cannon, Drop Pod

  • Tactical Squad, 10 Space Marines, Meltagun , Combi-Melta, Power Weapon, Drop Pod

  • Tactical Squad, 10 Space Marines, Meltagun , Combi-Melta, Power Weapon, Drop Pod

  • Tactical Squad, 10 Space Marines, Meltagun , Combi-Melta, Power Weapon, Drop Pod

  • Land Raider Crusader, Multi-Melta
I quite like your list. You want the Crusader to deliver the terminators I guess, but why not instead double the number of termies and deep strike them in? Seeing as you are buying your captain termie armour.
 

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:laugh: as someone who plays Deathwing and uses a lot of terrain, I wish you luck deep striking a ten man terminator squad without a mishap. Two 5-man squads will be a lot easier to deal with (not to mention more chances of at least 5 making it on table), but even still I don't play that game without allying in an Inquisitor for some Servo Skulls to reduce scatter by D6". Have you given any thought to using a Captain with Artificer armour and an Command Squad combined with a Sternguard squad both in Drop Pods? A Command Squad with 5x Storm Shields and 5x Power Weapons/Lightning Claws and a 5x man Sternguard squad with 5x Combi-Weapons is only 15 points more than the 10 man Hammernator squad. I would be tempted in a Drop Pod list to run something more like:

Captain - Artificer Armour, Power Fist, Lightning Claw

Command Squad - 5x Storm Shields, 3x Lightning Claws, 2x Power Axes, Drop Pod

5x Sternguard - 5x Combi-Meltas, Drop Pod

Dreadnought - Multi-Melta, Fist/Stormbolter, Drop Pod

Dreadnought - Multi-Melta, Fist/Stormbolter, Drop Pod

10x man Tactical squad - Flamer, Combi-Flamer, Power Sword, Drop Pod

10x man Tactical squad - Flamer, Combi-Flamer, Power Sword, Drop Pod

10x man Tactical squad - Flamer, Combi-Flamer, Power Sword, Drop Pod

Comes out at 1500 points bang on, plus your Captain can Sweeping Advance. Personally I would drop the Combi-Weapons and Power Swords from the Tactical squads for a 5x man Scout squad with Sniper Rifles and Camo. It pays to have a unit on the other side of the board from your attack holding an objective. You either keep that objective or your opponent turns away from what's actually going to kill him to deal with a 70 point unit far away from the rest of your force.
I agree about splitting the termies into 2x 5-man squads. That's how I'd field them.

I don't agree with the flamers unless you know you aren't fighting armour. I would suggest keeping the combi-flamers but taking meltas not flamers. Sternguard are good of course. But then I don't agree with the command squad. They're doing about the same job as the hammernators, but more expensively and without thunderhammers!

The scout squad could work, but I'd focus on making the strike plan work first!
 

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Don't get me wrong, I like Land Raiders and use them for hammernators frequently. I just don't like a lone Land Raider in a Drop Pod list, every time I've put just one big thing on the table like that something's gone terribly wrong. It all comes down to terrain and what you're facing, I guess I just face a lot of stuff that can blow up/glance down AV14 T1 given no other targets (and not enough scenery that can totally hide a tank that size).
Exactly! This is why I don't like the Landraider. If you go with only striking units then all their stuff that would like to be shooting at targets chugging across the midfield... is redundant. If you add just one Landraider then all that stuff has one high value target to shoot at. Same issue applies to the scouts. They might matter, but we are working with only 1500 pts here. The command squad is just going to cost more to have the same CC power as hammernators. That's the thing with hammernators, their so darn points efficient. I do like the FNP. But SS/TH is generally huge. Especially at 1500 points where that points efficiency really pays off.

Thinking it through, however... the Command squad can take a drop pod... I wouldn't write them off. It more feels to me like the single Landraider is the problem.
 
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