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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Astra Militarum 1500 points

HQ
Pask in vanquisher w/hull lascannon = 205
vanquisher w/hull lascannon = 145

TROOPS
Vets w/3 plasma in taurox w/TL autocannon = 155
Vets w/3 plasma in taurox w/TL autocannon = 155
Vets w/3 plasma in taurox w/TL autocannon = 155

FAST
Vendetta w/3x TL lascannon = 170
Vendetta w/3x TL lascannon = 170

HEAVY
Manticore w/hull heavy bolter = 170
Deathstrike w/hull heavy bolter and camo nets = 175

Vanquishers and vendettas wipe all armor off the table no questions asked. Pask rerolls to hit and to armor pen in his vanquisher. Almost everything is AP2. Manticore and Deathstrike provide big pie plates to hopefully wipe out some hordes. Volume of fire will hopefully help me in that regard from the vets and autocannons? What do you think? Too light on troops? Too light on troop killing power? I'd like to have taken chimeras, but points do not allow. Still, that's 9 vehicles at 1500 points which I think is pretty respectable.

Also, anyone remember votewar or whatever it was called? Making lists and then pitting them against other lists and voting on who would win? I miss that. Does anyone still do that? These forums? Dakka?
 

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I don't know. That death strike missile sound pretty crazy to me. In my opinion elsewhere than apocalypse it doesn't really pay off. Chances are, that before it even takes its single shot, your opponent wipes it out of the table. There are tons of ways doing that.
I'd personally drop it and take another Leman Russ instead. I propose to go for the punisher as it can compensate for your lack of anti personal weapons.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Have you seen the updates to the deathstrike? It used to fire on 5+ on turn 2. Now it fires on 3+. That's a HUGE buff.
 

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Have you seen the updates to the deathstrike? It used to fire on 5+ on turn 2. Now it fires on 3+. That's a HUGE buff.
Well i'll be damned! That is pretty cool. I say take it, because everyone else is too chickenshit to take it...Just whack that baby in a ruin with that camo netting and maybe keep a squad around to bubble wrap it. Then hope for the best!
 

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I would absolutely love to face this list with my BA. I wouldn't be placing any bets, but it would be a really fun game!

Good list man. Awesome display of armour at 1500 points.
 

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Death strike has a min range of 12 right? Not the worse but still a weakness. If so it's very easy to counter. As you generally put min range pieces in a corner of a board to maximise scope and if you only have 1 the enemy can get within its min range fairly easily by turn 2 by just favoriting the side (left or right) of the board it's on. So unless you have larger than the standard 6x4 boards deploying from turn 1 can neuter its usefulness.

However, you could voluntarily put it in reserves. It will still take the 2 turns to fire and it may fail its reserve roll but at least it will be on an easier roll when it is able to fire.

Just a thought. I use to have similiar issues with Basilisk spam. Who knows, your opponent may not think of that.
 

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Death strike has a min range of 12 right? Not the worse but still a weakness. If so it's very easy to counter. As you generally put min range pieces in a corner of a board to maximise scope and if you only have 1 the enemy can get within its min range fairly easily by turn 2 by just favoriting the side (left or right) of the board it's on. So unless you have larger than the standard 6x4 boards deploying from turn 1 can neuter its usefulness.

However, you could voluntarily put it in reserves. It will still take the 2 turns to fire and it may fail its reserve roll but at least it will be on an easier roll when it is able to fire.

Just a thought. I use to have similiar issues with Basilisk spam. Who knows, your opponent may not think of that.
I partly disagree. I think with the firepower he has got it wont be nearly as easy to get close by turn 2 as you claim, unless you are running a bike heavy list or you are Eldar...And even if you do manage to pop it, you still have the Manticore and Leman Russ's to worry about.
Drop pod lists are of course a different story, as they could just pod down and melta it. But hey, every list has weaknesses, and again once you have dealt with the deathstrike you have a lot of other things to worry about.
I also think having a manticore and deathstrike can force your opponent to spread out his tanks and forces during deployment, as all those str10 ordnance templates are more than capable of wiping out av14 vehicles without even needing LOS. Don't underestimate the power of psyching out your opponent with seemingly big scary units, as it's not always about killing power. 'Multiple Threat Overload' is something Guard do very well with the right lists, confusing target prioritisation.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Death strike has a min range of 12 right? Not the worse but still a weakness. If so it's very easy to counter. As you generally put min range pieces in a corner of a board to maximise scope and if you only have 1 the enemy can get within its min range fairly easily by turn 2 by just favoriting the side (left or right) of the board it's on. So unless you have larger than the standard 6x4 boards deploying from turn 1 can neuter its usefulness.
Why would I leave it alone in a corner and leave a huge gaping flank for the enemy to just go straight at it. I'd probably deploy in something similar to this.

 

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Why would I leave it alone in a corner and leave a huge gaping flank for the enemy to just go straight at it. I'd probably deploy in something similar to this.

LOL! I love the illustration. Made me chuckle out loud.

I agree with you though, you have too much between the deathstrike and any potential outflankers. I think the Deathstrike is a viable unit now, and a lot of fun when you manage to get it off and it nukes a bunch of shit. I think I will be making one with a bottle of washing up liquid!
 

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I remember the first time i used my deathstrike last edition. First game i used it and it scattered of 12inchs. Been siting on my window sill ever since. Might be time to try it again.
 

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First game i used it and it scattered of 12inchs.
:laugh: every time I field a newly painted model/unit they seem to find an abrupt and disappointing oblivion to nestle into as soon as the dice start rolling.

Gotta keep trying!
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I assume when it doesn't scatter and wipes out a squad of terminators and a landraider or something it's gonna look pretty good.

But I'm pretty excited about building a deathstrike. Such opportunity for customization and conversion!

Question. I haven't worked with the deathstrike kit before, but I assume it's got a missile that's like.. raised on this little platform WW2 V2 launcher style? If that's the case, wouldn't it be wisest to model it laying flush horizontally against the chassis to make the profile of the vehicle lower? If I model it with the missile pointing straight up, it's gonna be awfully easy to target, no?
 

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I would absolutely love to face this list with my BA. I wouldn't be placing any bets, but it would be a really fun game!

Good list man. Awesome display of armour at 1500 points.
In this corner we have ntaw, the menstration marines that hate green. In the other corner we have theporcupine, the flashlight bearing..... The flashlight bearing..... Ah fuck it I'm out of funnies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Heh. Not actually a big fan of lasguns, or most guard infantry for that matter. I like my infantry to be accurate and hard hitting, which is why I mass vets with plasma/melta.
 

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Not actually a big fan of lasguns...I like my infantry to be accurate and hard hitting...
haha my thoughts whilst reading this: "Wow, he seems to have picked the wrong army to play." :grin:
I couldn't imagine the guard without all its crappy troops. I embrace the cardboard box/flashlight armaments. I personally love the idea of ordinary people armed with flashlights going up against Gods, demi-gods and hordes of terrifying aliens who want to eat you! But I guess that is the beauty of the guard: Such a flexible faction, you can do the Vets thing, the Air Calvary thing, the armoured fist thing etc. depending on your tastes and they are all viable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
What I don't like about guard infantry is that you're never getting the most out of it. Ever. It's 10 dudes, one with a special weapon, 2 with a heavy weapon, 1 with a little sword, and the rest with lasguns. If you dare fire your heavy weapon, you can't move, and can't get any of your lasguns/specials close enough to use. If you move, then your heavy is a waste of points. If you're in combat, all ranged weapons are null.

If I'm going to take infantry (and I have to, given the FOC), I'm gonna give em all similar-ranging weapons. And if they get into combat, well they're goners. They were never built for that. They're dead to me.

This recent codex introduced some interesting stuff with cheap conscript blobs that can be buffed with cheap priests and comissars and psykers into actual formidable damage sponges. They don't rely on any weapons, just buffs to keep them alive through the whole game. It doesn't try to do too many things at once, which I like.
 

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What I don't like about guard infantry is that you're never getting the most out of it. Ever. It's 10 dudes, one with a special weapon, 2 with a heavy weapon, 1 with a little sword, and the rest with lasguns.

As Ntaw said, that is why we form blobs :D

If you dare fire your heavy weapon, you can't move,

Dafaq!? If you need to move, simply twin-link your autocannon with orders or prescience, then snap fire it, 2 shots means 1 will probably be hitting. Also, you can actually move most your blob forward and keep your heavy weapon stationary on the first turn, as long as you start with your heavy weapon in the middle. This is called 'daisy chaining' and means you fire it at full BS, since you wouldn't have moved your heavy weapon, only your lasgun models...


and can't get any of your lasguns/specials close enough to use.

Really? Never had any trouble with that in the 5 years I have been playing Guard. Blobs have no trouble with this whatsoever.

If you move, then your heavy is a waste of points.

No. See above!

If you're in combat, all ranged weapons are null.

And this applies to every single unit in 40k, since if you are in combat you cannot shoot. Null point IMO.

If I'm going to take infantry (and I have to, given the FOC), I'm gonna give em all similar-ranging weapons. And if they get into combat, well they're goners. They were never built for that. They're dead to me.

All well and good if you are using veterans, which you are...

This recent codex introduced some interesting stuff with cheap conscript blobs that can be buffed with cheap priests and comissars and psykers into actual formidable damage sponges. They don't rely on any weapons, just buffs to keep them alive through the whole game. It doesn't try to do too many things at once, which I like.

Actually all blobs were buffed, not just Conscripts.
I totally disagree with your assumption that they try doing too many things at once: Sure, if you take lascannons or MLs and plan to be a mobile blob, then yes that would be a waste as it's only got a single snap firing Prescience shot. But autocannons are definitely viable for the x2 shots snap firing, much more chance they will hit.
And static or gunline blobs on home objectives work just fine with heavy weapons, popping away at stuff until a target is in lasgun range. And flamers are universally useful for overwatch protection. That is not trying to do everything at once: That is doing everything at once. Well, pretty much lol...And it's reasonably cheap.

Consider now what Priests and Inquisitors can do for a good sized blob of 30-guardsmen: Re-rolling to hit whilst shooting from Prescience, re-rolling to hit AND to wound in close combat with 'War Hymns', Zealot and (if necessary) Prescience. That actually makes them more than able to eat a Thundernator squad for breakfast before they have even had a chance to strike back. Now consider that whole package costs about the same as a Thundernator squad, but it can also pump out enough lasgun shots with First Rank Fire+Prescience to kill or severely cripple that same squad from range. And that's all before even considering overwatch, special or heavy weapons.
I'm not saying they are invincible (far from it actually - blobs have their weaknesses) or better than veterans, but I don't think it's accurate at all to say that they you don't get the most out of them or that they aren't a flexible unit. Probably used and equipped they most certainly are.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
"Also, you can actually move most your blob forward and keep your heavy weapon stationary on the first turn, as long as you start with your heavy weapon in the middle. This is called 'daisy chaining' and means you fire it at full BS, since you wouldn't have moved your heavy weapon, only your lasgun models..."

Huh. Legitimately did not know you could do that. For some reason I thought if you moved any part of your unit the whole unit counts as "moved." I stand corrected.
 
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