Warhammer 40k Forum and Wargaming Forums banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hq
Haemonculus 55
Venom blade

Troops
10 Kabalite 180
Splinter cannon, raider, splinter racks, nightsheilds

10 Wyches 220
2x hydra gauntlets, Hekatrix, agoniser, raider, flicker fields

9 Wyches
Hydra gauntlets, raider, flicker fields.

Fast attack
6 Reavers 202
2x blasters, 2x cluster caltrops

Elite
4 Trueborn 173
4 blasters, venom, splinter cannon

Total 1000

Cheers
Stotty
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,694 Posts
Why not.
i'd rather swap the 10 witches to another 10 kabalites, but that's just me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Why not ???

I may try that method aswell. I think my style of play suits close combat tho.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,694 Posts
Why not ???

I may try that method aswell. I think my style of play suits close combat tho.
I noticed that :wink:
Just remember the witches wont be usually able to win a fight against a similar sized squad of marines.
You should need some hard hitting elite unit (i'm watching you, Incubi) to break any enemy previously engaged by withces, or to gang up both units on the same target (to avoid snapshots too)
Anyhow, let us know how this list goes!
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
Hq
Haemonculus 55
Venom blade
Well he'll be in combat, so go for it.

Troops
10 Kabalite 180
Splinter cannon, raider, splinter racks, nightsheilds
Don't bother with Splinter Racks. If you stay in your Raider, you will die. You should disembark, because taking Str4 autohits and Pinning is really, really nasty. Nastier than many guns you'll be facing. I think a Blaster is important, but that's just for flexibility.

10 Wyches 220
2x hydra gauntlets, Hekatrix, agoniser, raider, flicker fields
Flickerfields are worthless except on the Flyers because you have Jink, and anything ignoring Jink probably doesn't care about Flickerfields either. Go Night Shields. Haywire Grenades are kind of useful, but not mandatory.

9 Wyches
Hydra gauntlets, raider, flicker fields.
Again, swap Flickerfields for Night Shields.

Fast attack
6 Reavers 202
2x blasters, 2x cluster caltrops
Are they Turbo-Boosting, or shooting? Because taking Clusters AND Blasters means you're always wasting at least 30pts of upgrades in any one turn. I'd just go with Cluster Caltrops and forget shooting altogether.

Elite
4 Trueborn 173
4 blasters, venom, splinter cannon
Nice, but an obvious target in an army full of Night Shields.

So take the Blasters off the Reavers for 30pts, Splinter Racks from the Raider for 40pts, giving you the points for Haywire Grenades on all the Wyches. Gives you a bit more anti-tank, but I still think you're very very light on Scoring.

Midnight
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
You make. Very good point about the reavers. Ill drop blasters and stay with caltrops
As for flicker fields surly this is better than night shield for a cc troop inside because they are going to be within the range of most weapons even with the -6" ???

And I don't really understand why if would disembark with my warriors. They practically have no armour save so surly staying inside with armour 10 (which Ino is low) is still better especially if I can stay back so I'm within my rifles range but out of there's with night shields. This troop has worked well for me so far.

I'm hoping the trueborns will take out the tanks in one turn then just be an annoyance haha.
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
You make. Very good point about the reavers. Ill drop blasters and stay with caltrops
As for flicker fields surly this is better than night shield for a cc troop inside because they are going to be within the range of most weapons even with the -6" ???

And I don't really understand why if would disembark with my warriors. They practically have no armour save so surly staying inside with armour 10 (which Ino is low) is still better especially if I can stay back so I'm within my rifles range but out of there's with night shields. This troop has worked well for me so far.

I'm hoping the trueborns will take out the tanks in one turn then just be an annoyance haha.
The Night Shields reduce the Rapid Fire range of weapons, so they do get quite a bit of protection even up close.

Yes, AV10 Open Topped is tougher than T3/5+, but it's very, very fragile. Sure, you get a lot tougher against Lasguns, but when someone shoots a Plasma Gun at your Raider, it's likely to explode and deal a Str4 auto-hit to the occupants, killing five or six of them. Therefore, disembarking makes you more resilient as the enemy cannot kill your whole squad plus transport with just one gun (well, outside of Riptides and such). You can sit back at 24" and you're out of enemy Rapid Fire, but since the enemy can move 6" and be back within 24" or just shoot the Raider with his anti-tank, this strategy pretty much died the death when 6th edition changed Rapid Fire.

Midnight
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
So is there really much point having kabalite in a raider ??
When I have used this method before it's worked pretty well.
Also what did you mean in the other post about being very light on scoring ?
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
So is there really much point having kabalite in a raider ??
You get an additional 6" move at the start of the game which often gets you into Rapid Fire range (12" deployment, extra few inches from pivoting, 6" move, 6" disembark; gets you 24"-26" on to the board), and a Raider. Having a Fast Dark Lance or three zooming around keeps enemy armour honest. Dark Eldar Transports are half gun, half transport, and usually the gun half is much more valuable in a battle. No other army has as heavy an armament as a Dark Lance or dual Splinter Cannon, and especially not one that moves 12" and can still fire.

Also what did you mean in the other post about being very light on scoring ?
In, say, the Scouring, you can only take three objectives, and with 19 out of your 29 Scoring bodies being T3/6+ with no ranged weapons and the other 10 being T3/5+, it would be very very easy for an opponent to take out your Scoring since, in general, you're throwing all of the Wyches into your opponent's face. If you have two or three objectives in your board half, you're only going to be able to capture one of them. Generally, at 1000pts, this isn't so much of a problem (ideally, I'd swap one unit of Wyches with Kabalites as they're better at Scoring objectives), but as you scale up I think it'd be worth adding some Wracks in Venoms.

Midnight
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,694 Posts
I do not completely agree with Midnightsun, but i can see his point. I guess it all depends on the role you want those warriors to fulfill. I you are looking just for a supporting fire unit then go for 20 warriors with 2 splinter cannons and Sybarite, footslogging.
if you want them to be midfield objective grabber then a raider is the way to go. This means however, that in 3rd or 4th turn they will want to disembark ang stick to cover.
OR you could let them float in rearguard and make a 5th turn zooming advance towards the objective. In any case disembarking them is very depending on the army you face, but let us be clear: if they are targete properly, be it in raider or not, they die. So, stick to your plan and think that if he shoots your warriors he's not shooting your witches or bikes!

EDIT: also, about objective placement Midnight has a good point. Have a read at this for some thoughts.
http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=129612
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
So change one wych squad for kabalite. Drop blasters from reavers and use clusters.
Only problem is of I have 2 10 mans squads of kabalite if have to drop th trueborn as I don't hav enough models. I could swap this with a razor wing?? Or a talos with a WWP?

I was also thinking of puttin archon with wyches instead of haemonculus he would be better in combat and hopfully I should be CC by second turn so FNP wouldn't be that useful???
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
To be honest, as the lone threat in an assault list, or even if you have target saturation, Wyches are fucking awful, FnP or no. If you can afford an Archon, you can soak up some hits on the Shadowfield, but at that point you might as well take Incubi because they're better in just about every way imaginable. I'd advise a Haemonculus, because then you don't lose as many points when they all die horribly.

Razorwings are nice though. I run two with a Farseer ally for Twin-Linking, and they have a fairly decent output if you get the re-rolls. They're much, much better anti-air than anything else you have though, so you kind of need them, middling though they are.

Midnight
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Do you not rate or run wyches yourself then ?
Wyches have worked well for me when I get them into CC like u say the the problem is getting there over watch can be a bitch for wyches.

Incubi seem a tad expensive for 1000 points???
 

·
Rattlehead
Joined
·
6,741 Posts
No. I find Wyches to be less than useless, but that is likely coloured by the fact that the only armies I fight are either Ignores Cover-heavy, combat competent Chaos Space Marines or Tesla-loaded Necrons, who will simply scour anything within 24" from the board. Both do very heavy Overwatch damage to Wyches (Noise Marines shoot you with 24 Ignores Cover Bolters and 6 Ignores Cover Heavy Bolters, Necrons hit you with a couple of Str5 shots that multiply into a lot of Str5 autohits, or simply 40 Gauss Flayer shots) unless you charge a small unit of Warriors or a squad of Cultists (in which case you'll overkill them and be gunned down next turn).

Incubi are cheaper than Wyches if you want bang-for-buck - you need two or three Wyches to equal the damage output of a single Incubus (WS5, Str4, AP2 and 3+ armour is well worth 12pts - a Power Sword costs 15pts for most armies, and despite losing Combat Drugs, Plasma Grenades and Dodge, +1WS, Strength and Power Armour is a decent tradeoff).

Archon with Shadowfield, Agoniser and Phantasm Grenade Launcher
4 Incubi in Venom with Night Shields and additional Splinter Cannon
10 Kabalite Warriors with Splinter Cannon and Blaster in Raider with Night Shields
10 Kabalite Warriors with Splinter Cannon and Blaster in Raider with Night Shields
Razorwing Jetfighter with Flickerfields and Splinter Cannon
Razorwing Jetfighter with Flickerfields and Splinter Cannon

There's a 1000pt list that, while struggling with the alpha-strike and being a little low on anti-tank, is pretty good as a generalist force.

Midnight
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,694 Posts
Archon with Shadowfield, Agoniser and Phantasm Grenade Launcher
4 Incubi in Venom with Night Shields and additional Splinter Cannon
10 Kabalite Warriors with Splinter Cannon and Blaster in Raider with Night Shields
10 Kabalite Warriors with Splinter Cannon and Blaster in Raider with Night Shields
Razorwing Jetfighter with Flickerfields and Splinter Cannon
Razorwing Jetfighter with Flickerfields and Splinter Cannon

There's a 1000pt list that, while struggling with the alpha-strike and being a little low on anti-tank, is pretty good as a generalist force.

Midnight
That's an hell of a list!!! :victory:
With the lower count of mech i've encounterd, this list has the capability to deal lots of pain.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
That list looks good might give it a try
Guna add reavers in the mix as I only have one razor wing
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,694 Posts
Reavers are always a good idea :) since you trade the flyer with its 2 darklancesa for reaver you might want to give them blasters for tankbusting
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Archon, shadowfield, agoniser, phantasm grenade launcher -135

10 Kabalite, splinter cannon, blaster, raider, nightsheilds -185
10 Kabalite, splinter cannon, blaster, raider, nightsheilds -185

4 incubi, venom, splinter cannon, nightsheilds -163

6 Reavers, 2x heatlances - 156

Razorwing, splinter cannon, flicker fields, nightsheilds - 175

Total 999

Abit of a twist on the above list simply coz I don't have another razor wings plus I really want to try Reavers in a bigger group. Cheers
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,694 Posts
Loos good to me! let us know how the battle goes!
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top