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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 03:27 AM Thread Starter
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Default Re-Creating Aenarion

Hello all. I've been contemplating an interesting idea recently, although a completely absurd thought.

I was thinking of how best to represent Aenarion, the savior of the world and the mightiest of all mortal creatures, in terms of WHFB.

In the fluff, he completely shut out four (4!!) Greater Daemons with some minor wounds (broken arm, broken ribs), one of each variety, at once with the help of his mighty steed, Indraugnir (who took a nasty hit from the Bloodthirster), the greatest of all Dragon-kin. He wielded the most deadly of all weapons, the Sword of Khaine, capable of killing both mortal and God alike, which cleaved a Bloodthirster in two before it could raise its own axe. He wore the greatest armor to be forged within Vaul's Forge, which could repel the mightiest of attacks by a Daemon-kin.

Because of the Daemon Incursion early in the history of the elves, he was consequently driven into an insane rage and hatred of all Daemon-kin, so combined with his nasty armor, the Sword of Khaine, and Indraugnir, he certainly spells doom for an entire army of Daemons.

At this point, I'm pretty confident that the whole Aenarion package would probably round out at 1500+ points (maybe 2500pts, even...). He's basically an army in his own right!

Here's what I'm thinking (remember, it's meant to be ridiculous):

Aenarion:

M:5
WS: 10
BS: 6 (doesn't matter, really)
S: 4
T: 3 (He is still an Elf)
W: 8
I: 10
A: 5
Ld: 10

Special Rules:
- Speed of Asuryan
- Valour of Ages (minus the Dark Elf, thing, of course)
- The Greatest Defender of Ulthuan (always the General, grants Ld in 18")
- Causes Fear in Daemons
- Frenzy and Hatred toward Daemons, and can never lose it. Lasts every round. Also can re-roll failed To Wound rolls, but a roll of a 1 must stand (he's good, but not that good).
- Automatically passes any characteristic test, including Leadership.
- Cannot be wounded on better than a 3+
- Immune to Psychology.
- Unbreakable.
- Stubborn.
()

Sword of Khaine
Always doused in blood, this blade is capable of slaying both mortals and Gods alike. It is said that to wield this blade is to damn your soul and your lineage for all eternity.
This Blade grants:
- +5 Strength
- +5 Attacks, plus an additional +1 attack per enemy unit in base-to-base.
- Killing Blow, regardless of Unit Strength
- Flaming and Magical Attacks
- No Armor or Ward Saves are allowed against wounds from this blade
- Unsaved woulds multiply to D3 wounds

Finest Armor of Vaul's Anvil
This armor is the most finely crafted armor to have ever existed. It is said it can ward away the most grievous of blows with ease.
This Armor grants:
- 2+ Armor Save, modified to a 1+ with the shield.
- 2+ Ward versus all Magical and Daemon attacks.
- 3+ Ward versus all other attacks.
- Regeneration
- Ignores Killing blow and Poisoned Attacks. These must roll to Hit/Wound as normal.
- Ignores multiplying wounds.
- Dragon Armor - completely ignores any and all flaming attacks.



Indraugnir

M: 8
WS: 8
BS: 5
S: 10
T: 8
W: 10
I: 7
A: 10
Ld: 10

Special Rules:
- Terror.
- Fly.
- Killing Blow against Large Targets only.
- Fiery Breath attack: S5, no Armor Saves. Any unit that takes any HITS must check for panic, regardless of Immune to Panic (or similar) rule.
- Frenzy, Hatred toward Daemons. Lasts for all rounds of combat, and cannot be taken away by any means.
- 1+ Armor Save
- 4+ Ward Save


I'll probably have more to say on the stats, but I think this is enough to kick-start some discussion.

Now, as is, I'd probably list this at around 2000pts in itself. Absurd, I know, and he should probably cost more. I think this is fairly true to the fluff (seriously, he should cost more than 4 Greater Daemons), despite the absolutely unnecessary stats and cost.

Thoughts?

"In the eyes of the Elves of Ulthuan there exists no fear, only grim determination.

Until one has witnessed them in combat, one cannot comprehend the power that they possess."
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 05:22 AM
 
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Wow, just wow. Talk about overpowered. It's a good idea but he needs to be toned down a bit.
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 06:06 AM Thread Starter
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"... he needs to be toned down a bit."

lol. Hardcore understatement!

As I said, this is more for the fluff than anything else. I would hope nobody would take him as he is straight from the fluff, which is what these stats are meant to reflect. In practical game terms, he would most certainly need to be toned down, if there was ever a hope of him being reasonably fielded.

I would most certainly hope nobody tries to field this as-is in anything less than a 10,000pts game (hopefully never)!!

"In the eyes of the Elves of Ulthuan there exists no fear, only grim determination.

Until one has witnessed them in combat, one cannot comprehend the power that they possess."
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 02:12 PM
 
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Even in fluff terms I think he's overpowered. I know he's the biggest badass of all High Elf badasses, but god damn.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 03:45 PM
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I've moved this to Houserules and Homebrew for you.

I like the concept, I have to say he is immensely powerful. Against 1 model you have 11 KB, flaming and magical attacks at S9 with no saves and D3 wounds but here is the killer, all this with ASF I10. Then if anything survives all that you have another 10 S10 attacks at I7. There is no way anything in the game could stand up to that in combat. Against Daemons it is even better!

I think that in reality regardless of fluff he would need toning down to be playable at any level, unless you make a series of these god characters and play herohammer with them I suppose. As it happens I would say that Aenarion being almost a god compared to most Elves should be more than S4 T3, it just doesn't seem right to me. His armour was good but not that good, he would have had to have been pretty damn tough to go toe to toe with 4 GDs and only get a few little broken bones.

I think you can go two ways with it, either stick to fluff and make an almighty character that could never be fielded or tone it down and make a monster that is playable, but not really quite up to the legend. Good idea though, don't get me wrong I like the thought behind it so far!
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 08:06 PM Thread Starter
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Hm, with Squeek's idea, and Grik's bewilderment, I think I'll try to craft a version of Aenarion that is actually Playable.

As is, in retrospect, Aenarion would need to be toned down. His Armor and the Sword did contribute heartily to his abilities, but he wasn't so... untouchable. Indraugnir, well, that's still up for debate!

So, I'm thinking of this:

Aenarion
-Prince Stat Line
-Star Dragon Mount
-A couple Anti-Daemon Special rules (Eternal Hatred and Frenzy?)
-Sword of Khaine (+2 Strength, Killing Blow)
-Armor of Aenarion (3+ AS, 4+ Ward, No Killing Blow or Poison)
-Indraugnir (+1 Strength, Hatred)

"In the eyes of the Elves of Ulthuan there exists no fear, only grim determination.

Until one has witnessed them in combat, one cannot comprehend the power that they possess."
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 09:09 PM
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There is nothing to say you can't make him very, very hard, but your original build was probably a little OTT! I reckon you are in danger of making him a little soft with this second iteration (pffft, he's never happy is he? ).

I think Frenzy would be a mistake since he is mounted on a dragon, you'd spend the game ping ponging around the board like a lunatic! I think you should think about making him comparable to the super characters from other books, i.e. Archaon - Armour Ignoring attacks with 10 Strength 5 Attacks, a 1+ Armour Save and a 3+ Ward Save. He also has reasonable MR, can cast spells, -1 to hit against him, causes Terror and acts like a BSB to all within 12.

Obviously he shouldn't be identical, but it might give you an idea of the sort of stats to look at for the HE equivalent, as I reckon Aenarion would have given Archaon a run for his money if ever they met. Just to mix it up a little take a look at the Lore of Light, what about giving him access to it to represent the devastating impact he had on Daemon armies? Indraugnir needs a ward save or he is not worth taking for such an expensive character as everyone will just snipe him from under your uber Elf. I would buff up the statlines for Aenarion and Indraugnir as both were more than just a prince and a dragon, but just try not to make them godlike! I think you should give him MR as well since he was a powerful character and isn't just going to go bang to a lowly gobbo shaman.

I think perhaps:

-Sword of Khaine (+3 Strength, Killing Blow, D2 unsaved wounds)
-Armour of Aenarion (1+ AS, 3+ Ward, Immune to Killing Blow, Poison and wound multiplying attacks)

These are just ideas of course, feel free to discard them!
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-06-09, 10:15 PM Thread Starter
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I like your ideas for the Sword and Armour thus far, Squeek.

As for his stats...

Aenarion
M: 5
WS: 10
BS: 5
S: 4
T: 3
W: 4
I:10
A: 5
Ld: 10

Special Rules:
- ASF
- Hates Daemons
- Immune to Fear, Terror, and Panic
- +1 Attack, +1 Strength against Greater Daemons

S4 and T3, because I still see Aenarion as being an elf. Maybe T4, though, but I like how he would still be another elf were it not for his psychotic hatred of Daemons.


Indraugnir:

M: 8
WS: 8
BS: 5
S: 8
T: 7
W: 7
I:5
A: 7
Ld: 10

Special Rules:
- 1+ Scaly Skin save
- 4+ Ward Save
- If Aenarion dies, Indraugnir passes his Leadership Test.
- Fly
- Terror
- S5 Fiery Breath

He's a tank, that's for sure.

For Points, I'm lost. I could see somewhere around 750 to 850pts.

Now this Aenarion isn't as powerful as he was in the fluff, but he is at least a little more playable...!

"In the eyes of the Elves of Ulthuan there exists no fear, only grim determination.

Until one has witnessed them in combat, one cannot comprehend the power that they possess."
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-07-09, 04:19 PM
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I have some rules made for Aenarion while I was writing (well, I still am, but the High Elves are all but finished, bar the new ideas every so often) the Muster Rolls for Legendary Battles.

Aenarion and Indraugnir
[table]Name| M | WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld
Aenarion | 5 | 10 | 8 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 10 | 5 | 10
Indraugnir | 6 | 8 | 0 | 7 | 7 | 7 | 2 | 7 | 10[/table]

Weapons and Equipment: Aenarion wields the Sword of Khaine, and the Hunting Spear Elthrai. He wears the Armour of the Gods, and rides Indraugnir.

Special Rules: Aenarion has Speed of the Asur, Immune to Psychology. Indraugnir has Fly, Terror, Scaly Skin (2+), Large Target, Dragon Fire (Str 5), Unbreakable.

Pure of Heart: Aenarion must always the Army General for a High Elven army. If allied with another force, the Aenarion is also the Army General, unless they also have the Special Rules 'Grand Commander'. In the case that two such characters are allied (Editors Note - For example; Boris Ursus, and Aenarion), you may choose which.

Grand Commander: Aenarion is the greatest Elf to have ever lived. All of the Sons of Asur respect him and love him. Whoever they may be, they will always carry out his bidding. Any other character with the Commander Rule (Editors Note - this is all lined out in the booklet, but for now, the Commander Rule grants the "Must always be the Army General" effect) loses it. His Command Range is extended to 24".

The Lyric of Unbinding: When going into battle against innately magic creatures, Aenarion utters these words. When they lock eyes with him, the magic gatheric around them unravels. Each turn in the Shooting Phase (instead of using his Spear), choose a Daemon, Forest Spirit or Undead unit that both Aenarion and the target can draw Line of Sight to one another. That unit must take a Leadership test on 3 Dice, discarding the Lowest. Should the test be failed, they take a number of wounds (allocated as if from Shooting) equal to the number they failed their test by, with no Armour Saves, Ward Saves, or Regeneration allowed. It may not used on units in combat, neither may Aenarion use it while he himself is in combat.

Avatar of Asur: If Aenarion ever dies, roll a Toughness Test on 2D6 at the start of the next turn, just before declaring charges, discarding the lowest result. Should the test be passed, Aenarion is instantly restored to full wounds, and any permanent modification of stats other than those from Aenarions equipment is removed. Aenarion also has Regeneration, and an Immunity to Killing Blow and Poisoned Attacks.

Avatar of the World Dragon: Indraugnir knows no fear. Enemies themselves lose heart at just the sight of him, Crimson and Golden scales catching the few rays that break through the overcast skies which herald the advance of their foe. The High Elven host seeing such glory renews it's vigour, and vows to fight back the enemy with even greater strength and will. Indraugnir is Unit Strength 10, and enemies in base to base contact never recieve any Combat Resolution Bonus for Outnumbering, or making a Flank/Rear charge. One friendly or allied High Elf Unit participating in the same combat as Indraugnir with a Banner rolls +D3 for Combat Resolution, instead of +1 for the Banner.

Nova Dragon - Indraugnir counts as a Level 2 Spellcaster, and knows all spells from the Lore of Fire.

Unbreakable Bond - Should either the Rider or Steed be slain, the one left alive is subject to Frenzy and Eternal Hatred for the rest of the game. Frenzy may never be lost, even if beaten in combat. Indraugnir never needs to roll on the Monster Reaction chart.

Sword of Khaine - It is said that this weapon has appeared many times in the past, each in a different form. Indeed, many warriors who saw Aenarion wield it have seen it as a Lance, a Glaive, a Sword, a Bow, even a Flaming Staff. Whatever it's form, it cleaves flesh from bone as easily as a Scalpel, and cuts through armour as if it were paper. Aenarion recieves +D3 attack and strength (roll seperately in each combat phase). On a Roll of 6 to Hit, the enemy is wounded automatically. On a roll of 6 to wound, the enemy recieves no armour save. Daemons and Undead count as taking double wounds for the purposes of Combat Resolution.

Elthrai: Counts as a Javelin, with a range of 24" and a Strength of 6 which penetrates ranks exactly like a Bolt Thrower (although it doesn't do D3 wounds or Ignore Armour Saves). Against Large Targets, Monsters (including Monstrous Mounts, but not the riders), or Chariots (but not the Riders), it does D3 wounds, instead of just one.

Armour of the Gods: Aenarion has a 1+ Armour Save, a 4+ Ward Save. He is immune to Flaming Attacks.

He's pretty tough, and instead of making him unable to wound on 3+, I thought it better to make him tougher than a usual elf, to show how he is above pain, rather than attacks bouncing off him, as in the Armour of Morkar.

Working out the points

Chaos Lord Stats base - 210. +2 WS = 40, +5 BS = 100, +2 W = +100, +3 I = 30pts, +1 LD = 50 pts, ASF = 40pts, Equipment - Sword = 150pts, Throwing Spear 100pts, Armour, 120pts, Special Rules - 160pts = 1100
Dragon - 360, boosted stats = +90, Level 2 Mage = 120, All Spells = 30, Special Rules = 60 = 660pt = 1770pts.

Sounds like a lot, but that's the intention of having such God Characters - e.g. Sigmar, Gotrek, Felix, and the rest of them, Morkar, Malekith (Uber Duber Malekith) etc.



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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-07-09, 10:07 PM Thread Starter
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Wow, great work Vaz. Impressive stuff indeed!

What's the idea with the Spear of Elthrai? Is it from old fluff? I don't recall reading it in 7th edition HE AB.

Making Indraugnir a lvl2 Fire mage is a solid idea, too. Kinda wish I'd figured that out sooner!

"In the eyes of the Elves of Ulthuan there exists no fear, only grim determination.

Until one has witnessed them in combat, one cannot comprehend the power that they possess."
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