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post #1 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-16-11, 09:48 AM Thread Starter
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Default Versus... Slaan

Hi everybody

So we've all played lizardmen, and have all been spanked by magic from those fat toads who just sit there smirking as your army burns... so in this latest instance of the Versus... series we have the Slaan, the great magical toad of the Lizardmen army as suggested by blackspine.

So, floating abover a stubborn unit of nails temple guard or out on his own and immune to anything but magical based attacks these frogs can pump out a huge amount of magic, with a possible 7 free power dice a turn there might be as many as 19 power dice smashing through your 6 dispel dice defence (ignoring channelling), and to make matters worse their first miscast may well be dumped on the head of your most powerful mage.
Then it can get even worse with this thing being the army general and BSB all in one, meaning that any lizards close by are just never going to break (especially when you add in cold blooded)... SLaan really are the heart of a lizardman army.

How is it that everyone deals with the slaan, do you ignore it and just take the damage, do you pepper it with artillery/magic or just try to tie up its unit early while you move up your big guns... share your knowledge and tactics with our other members here on heresy.

... or if you are a lizardman player, what scares you, what have people done to shut down your Slaan..?

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post #2 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-16-11, 10:27 AM
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They're hardly overly-cheap, are they? And they can't cast magic in combat (unless they're truly disgusting, I haven't had the chance to get close to one yet) so my friend thought up an idea I've been toying with.

Sadly it's only really going to work for armies that can field huge numbers of very cheap infantry. It's also quite a cheap tactic, but certainly funny. For VC, though, it's known as the zombie conga-line.

Yes, a unit of maybe 40 zombies fielded one-rank wide, with that one zombie dead on the slann, or if he's hiding, in front of where he is (so he is giving supporting attacks and therefore in combat). Other armies should field more, as VC can use IoN (even though it is now severely weakened) to bring back more, but as I said, it is weakened.

Essentially a tarpit that you can't get full frontage against. By bogging up his big points-sink, you can be free to deal with the other monsters (with yet more conga-lines!) and such.

It's not perfect, but it's something.

EDIT: It also becomes an utter nuisance for moving your army around, especially if their Slann is dead-centre.

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Last edited by Farseer Darvaleth; 04-16-11 at 10:29 AM.
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post #3 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-16-11, 10:43 AM
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He's I1- attack that. Lore of death/shadow. Unfortunately, that means you have to get through the magic defenses he'll inevitably take. If the tourney allows power scrolls/you're not in a tourney, then use that, otherwise, just keep chucking dice at it. If you're not into magic, that means you've pretty much gotta kill the Temple Guard. I have only ever had my slann killed once- and that was after around two phases of the unit being multi assaulted by two units of Brettonian knights (and the good ones, mind you, not the basic ones) as well as a unit of their peasants with halberds.

And @ Farseer Darvaleth- Augments can be cast whilst in combat, and Slann are taken pretty much to buff the rest of the army

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post #4 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-16-11, 12:37 PM Thread Starter
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I have radically different approaches to slaan depending on what army I'm playing.

With ogres I target him- my whole army manouvers to get into combat with the TG/Slaan and since Im M6 and pretty good in combat I can get there quickly and smack the TG around when I am there. Normally takes 2-3 combat phases to destroy them but when they're dead (and the Slaan is history) the rest of the army normally falls pretty easily. There has only been 1 game of ogres vs lizards where the slaan has survived (he was hiding with his unit behind 70-80 skinks... but that was back in 7th when charging mattered). Temple guard aren't as scary in combat as they used to be since they can no longer have a 2+ save, so if you hit them hard they'll drop pretty quick still.

With WE I just dont have the ability to smash the Slaans unit, and if they come with the full temple guard bodyguard then I just ignore it- it would take too much effort to kill. Then again WE have the wand of wych elm, allowing me to reroll all dispell attempts which really helps for magical defence.
If the lizards bring a solo slaan with the pseudo-ethereal power then I often find myself ignoring that too, but I will still fire off the occasional magic missile his way: since I normally take lore of beasts this means that the Slaan faces a higher level amber spear- S10 D6 wounds... not really worth concentrating on, but if there are no other good targets around for other spells its always worth a go.

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post #5 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-16-11, 01:41 PM
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There is something that can defeat the big unit of inevitable body guards and the Slann itself. It's a little combo I run with my VC.

It requires one Vampire with the Lore of Beasts (then whatever you want) and of course you'll have the spell which grants +3S and +3A to a friendly character. Step in a vampire lord with the sword of bloodshed, the crown of the damned, red fury, infinite hatred, and avatar of death. Normally nasty on his own, but coupled with the beasts magic buff(s) [plural included in case you wan to go really crazy].

Also get Vanhels Danse Macabre on him if possible, but against Lizardmen it makes no difference (high initiative removes need for ASF). You have 10 attacks, S8, WS7, I7, re-roll all misses every round of combat, AND any wounds you cause come back in the form of additional attacks to be made immediately. Should anything survive that destructive firestorm, you have a 4+ armour save and a 4+ ward save too, if at the cost of becoming stupid, but Ld10 is fine for that anyway.

It's a horrible combo, it turns a 20-man skeleton unit into a deathstar all of its own. When it's flanked by a 40-ghoul horde and a horrific 30-grave guard horde with flag of blood keep and banner of the barrows, coupled with helm of command from the beasts thrall, it's just....just.... insane!


Anyway, I went on a little rant there, but the lord combo is really what I wanted to demonstrate here.

Give a man a match, and he's warm for a day.

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Last edited by Farseer Darvaleth; 04-16-11 at 01:44 PM.
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post #6 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-16-11, 02:28 PM
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I haven't had many chances to play with my Lizzies yet, but generally, the only thing that can touch my Slann is anything tough enough to take out the Temple-Guard. Watch out for Flesh-to-Stone, or Dwellers on units that get too close.

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post #7 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-16-11, 11:46 PM
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Grave Guard or Blood Knights are likely the VC's best counters... 99% of the time I see the slaan taking lore of life for all the buffs it offers, and the easily spamable dwellers.
The GG & BK are both S4, so dwellers is less of a problem for them.
Support the unit with a fighty vamp lord who's toting the blood drinker on top of red fury + forbidden lore (fire) and you'll chop down his regenerating temple guards soon enough... (just be sure he doesn't get flesh to stone and/or throne of vines off!)

A real nasty blood knight unit would involve the BSB w/strigos banner (hatred) + hellfire banner (magical flaming attacks to the unit). Then you could even use the beast lore for the extra wildform buff to the unit for S8/T5 on the charge!

Cheers!
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post #8 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-18-11, 03:05 PM
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My issue with a lot of the solutions being posted in this thread is that they all work fine in a vacuum- chucking 3-4 strong/large units at the slann will work of course. but that assumes you can get those units there without those 2-3 units of saurus forming a wall getting in your way

my tactics for fielding a slann are very simple- ignore the Temple Guard, they are poor elite soldiers, and throw the slann in a unit of skinks behind the main line. Combine with etheral for warmachine protection and LoS from the skinks vs. magic templates/magic warmachines and he is a tough nut to crack. how do you deal with that?

as a Lizzie player i fear only 3 things- Dwellers (easily dispelled when i can discard all the 6's you roll to cast spells- no IF for you-hoo!) nasty choppy flying characters that can dodge my saurus wall and hit me with a magic weapon, and multiple magic cannons- its still a 1 in 6 chance that can really hurt my slann

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post #9 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-18-11, 03:24 PM
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But what if your main line is broken, and the victorious unit (no doubt including some kind of character) overruns through? Granted, if he's behind tough units its unlikely, but warhammer is a mad and wonderful game. What if they roll Purple Sun right down your army?

Otherwise flying magical things will annoy you, but that's it I guess. Oh, a quick question: for the transformation of kadon spell, did they ever Errata it so the model loses all its special rules and gains the special rules of the creature?

Otherwise you can have HE ASF dragons, or VC Ethereal Dragons (dear god) or dragons with red fury...

Give a man a match, and he's warm for a day.

Set a man on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life!

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post #10 of 29 (permalink) Old 04-27-11, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Farseer Darvaleth View Post
But what if your main line is broken, and the victorious unit (no doubt including some kind of character) overruns through? Granted, if he's behind tough units its unlikely, but warhammer is a mad and wonderful game. What if they roll Purple Sun right down your army?

Otherwise flying magical things will annoy you, but that's it I guess. Oh, a quick question: for the transformation of kadon spell, did they ever Errata it so the model loses all its special rules and gains the special rules of the creature?

Otherwise you can have HE ASF dragons, or VC Ethereal Dragons (dear god) or dragons with red fury...
If you have broken through my saurus units i have bigger issues than losing my slann

and good luck getting your purple sun off when i take all those 6's you roll on your max 6 dice (likely 1 or 2) and discard them, and then dispel scroll that bitch/dispel it

Transformation loses all special rules of the model AFAIK, havent read the FAQ in a while but pretty sure they changed that. No Etheral Frog-dragons for the lizardmen

A little bit annoyed to come back to HO and find I've lost close to 200 rep.....
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