asf rerolls and great weapons - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
Warhammer Rules Discussion Post any Warhammer Fantasy rules queries here.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-05-14, 04:17 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Mursaat's Avatar
Mursaat's Flag is: Australia
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 118
Reputation: 2
Default asf rerolls and great weapons

Recently I have been playing a lot of games with a friend whos running dark elves against my high elves and the issue ive been running into that I would like to get some clarity on is that he says: because my whiteions have ASF and great weapons that the great weapons ASL rule cancels my ASF rule meaning we strike in initiative order right... and because ive lost ASF to my ASL rule, therefore he keeps his always strikes first... is this correct? Because I also read that ASF will cancel out ASF... which rule is applied first.

W/L/D (2014 Season)
High Elves: 3/2/0
Wood Elves: 0/0/0
Mursaat is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-05-14, 07:35 AM
Vaz
Senior Member
 
Vaz's Avatar
Vaz's Flag is: United Kingdom
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Manchester, UK.
Posts: 12,830
Reputation: 79
Default

Been a while since I've played, but yes.

If a model has Always Strikes First and Always Strikes Last, the two cancel each other out, and you strike in Initiative order.

If a model has the Always Strikes First rule, but either strike at the same Initiative or before their opponent, then they may reroll failed to hit rolls.



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bindi Baji View Post
It's not a black and white question really, there are different shades of anal probing,
a rectum spectrum, if you will
Vaz is offline  
post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-05-14, 10:25 AM
Senior Member
 
Xabre's Avatar
Xabre's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,848
Reputation: 72
Default

I'm not sure if that's the case. I mean, after all, the entire purpose of the Swordmasters unit is basically that they're guys with Great Weapons with ASF...

Or maybe it's just that elven init is so high that it might as well be the same thing?

Xabre is offline  
 
post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-05-14, 12:10 PM
Vaz
Senior Member
 
Vaz's Avatar
Vaz's Flag is: United Kingdom
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Manchester, UK.
Posts: 12,830
Reputation: 79
Default

All Elves, regardless of High, Dark or Wood have ASF now. After all, they were originally all one race, so it never made sense only one race got it.

Basically, the intention behind each

Swordmasters - Blend Light Infantry
White Lions - Heavy Armour/Monsters
Executioners - Heavy Armour
Wildwood Rangers - Monster Hunters



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bindi Baji View Post
It's not a black and white question really, there are different shades of anal probing,
a rectum spectrum, if you will
Vaz is offline  
post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-06-14, 12:19 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Mursaat's Avatar
Mursaat's Flag is: Australia
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 118
Reputation: 2
Default

The intention I see as correct however I just found it a bit unfair my own rules cancel eachother out and he still gets to keep his asf and rerolls. Which he knows puts me at a disadvantage against dark elf units... I mean I still won the match but something about that combination of my rules shafting my own units irks me. However im going to have to get used to it as my armies at the moment are high elves and wood elves.

W/L/D (2014 Season)
High Elves: 3/2/0
Wood Elves: 0/0/0
Mursaat is offline  
post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-06-14, 06:33 AM
Senior Member
 
kickboxerdog's Avatar
kickboxerdog's Flag is: England
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: wiltshire
Posts: 1,415
Reputation: 50
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mursaat View Post
The intention I see as correct however I just found it a bit unfair my own rules cancel eachother out and he still gets to keep his asf and rerolls. Which he knows puts me at a disadvantage against dark elf units... I mean I still won the match but something about that combination of my rules shafting my own units irks me. However im going to have to get used to it as my armies at the moment are high elves and wood elves.
ha ha feel ya but at least your great weapon wielding units get to strike at initiative order, which being a elf you normally have a higher initiative than most army so there for still striking first, so I don't see your own un its getting shafted if anything your asf rule helps u with great weapons as any other non elf army will strike last with them, I play dwarfs and love my great weapon wielding dwarfs but the asl really can hurt sometimes,( I know even striking at int order for a dwarf I normally strike last still) but u get my point , if you did have to strike last with them rather than initiative order that could really hurt.
kickboxerdog is offline  
post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-06-14, 10:34 AM
Senior Member
 
Jack Jack's Avatar
Jack Jack's Flag is: Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Montreal
Posts: 1,147
Reputation: 2
Default

While it is true that both rules cancel each other out for the purpose of striking order and the asf rerolls of your oponents, they do not, however, cancel each other out for the purpose of rules like «Blizzard aura» and Bironna's Timewarp which grant always strike last and always strike first.

A model can only ever have these special rules once, even if they are both present and cancelled in the same model, it cannot gain another, non-cancelled additional instance of either.

For any reason.

I have no clue why it works like that, but that's how it's ruled all over the place, according to my gaming club and to Ulthuan.net.

I fled to chase dreams that I can't yet describe.
I wake up, shivers, I hope my dream wasn't you.
But son, your dad, it ain't me, it can't be.
Jack Jack is offline  
post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-06-14, 11:54 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Mursaat's Avatar
Mursaat's Flag is: Australia
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 118
Reputation: 2
Default

@kickboxerdog , i meant it boned me against dark elves which is what my bestie plays and has chosen as his main army lol there are only a few of us in the group.

Alex: has 9 armies but only mainly wants to play Dark Elves (my main competition at the moment)
Chris: Daemons of Chaos, once he gets all the model bases and stuff together.
Scott: Skaven, once he purchases the models he needs.
Tristyn: Empire, is buying a lot of models.
Klay: Lizard-men, Works a lot so its hard to t-up a game with him.
and Ofcourse Myself: With High Elves, and Wood Elves.

Up until the last month or so its just been Alex and i duking it out Dark Elves Vs High Elves, and i was constantly running into the issue with losing out to him on the my own asf canceled out by great weapon asl. Mainly on the white lions.

W/L/D (2014 Season)
High Elves: 3/2/0
Wood Elves: 0/0/0
Mursaat is offline  
post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-06-14, 12:41 PM
Senior Member
 
kickboxerdog's Avatar
kickboxerdog's Flag is: England
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: wiltshire
Posts: 1,415
Reputation: 50
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mursaat View Post
@kickboxerdog, i meant it boned me against dark elves which is what my bestie plays and has chosen as his main army lol there are only a few of us in the group.

Alex: has 9 armies but only mainly wants to play Dark Elves (my main competition at the moment)
Chris: Daemons of Chaos, once he gets all the model bases and stuff together.
Scott: Skaven, once he purchases the models he needs.
Tristyn: Empire, is buying a lot of models.
Klay: Lizard-men, Works a lot so its hard to t-up a game with him.
and Ofcourse Myself: With High Elves, and Wood Elves.

Up until the last month or so its just been Alex and i duking it out Dark Elves Vs High Elves, and i was constantly running into the issue with losing out to him on the my own asf canceled out by great weapon asl. Mainly on the white lions.
aww ok fair one if u can get other games againt they other guys u game with your white lions will excel, but yeah kind of lose out to another army that has asf all round.
kickboxerdog is offline  
post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-11-14, 02:42 PM
Senior Member
 
Deathypoo's Avatar
Deathypoo's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 223
Reputation: 3
Default

I mean, for the record, Dark Elves with great weapons have the same "problem" against your non-great weapon high elves... just pointing out it's not a one-way deal ;)
Deathypoo is offline  
Reply

  Lower Navigation
Go Back   Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums > Warhammer Fantasy Battles & Age of Sigmar > Warhammer Rules Discussion

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome