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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 09:45 AM
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So therefore we simply forget the fact that they wield a GW???
that is the part that does not make sense.
In my opinion the ASL aura negates the SoA, so wielding a GW makes them strike last.
I am assuming you guys think that as the SoA gives them ASF (no matter what weapon type) they will keep negating the fact that a GW is used?

Not sure if that makes sense to me...
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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magpie_Oz View Post
The problem is that

ASL + ASL = ASL not 2ASL

So ASL + ASL + ASF = ASL + ASF = 0
That depends on the order the rules are applied:

(ASL + ASL) + ASF = ASL + ASF = 0

(ASL + ASF) + ASL = 0 + ASL = ASL
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 10:41 AM
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Indeed, the SMs don't have 2 lots of ASL... they never get ASL from their great weapons because while they may lose the ASF from the Speed of Asuryan they don't lose that rule.

But that makes no difference anyway.
EVEN if they did have ASL from their great weapons as well as the thundertusk it makes no matter because they would still have ASF and the rules clearly say that if you have both rules you strike at initiative order.
Its not a matter of the first ASL cancelling with the ASF leaving 1 case of ASL. They have ASL, they have ASF (multiple instances of these rules don't stack as only Extra Attack does that) and so they cancel leaving nothing.



EDIT- maths fail there Dave... brackets make no difference with addition. The only way to look at this matematically would be something like this:

aASL + bASF = 0 where a and b are any non zero positive integers ... which is beginning to get silly.

The best real world equivalent to this would be lunch: if I have both a loaf bread and a pack of ham then I can make a sandwich. Doesn't matter how many loaves of bread or packs of ham I have because the only thing that matters is that I have both... not the amount.


Last edited by Tim/Steve; 04-21-13 at 10:51 AM.
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim/Steve View Post
maths fail there Dave... brackets make no difference with addition.
I was not using addition. I was responding to Magpie, who used +.

Context fail T/S.
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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 11:00 AM
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Just wait another two or three weeks and this discussion will be partially obsolete due to Swordmasters getting new rules.

40k Armies: Dark Eldar / Adepta Sororitas
WHFB Armies: Vampire Counts / Empire / various Elves
Horus Heresy: Alpha Legion / Warp Cult
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post #16 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 11:11 AM
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and then we'll have more fun discussing a whole new set of annoyingly incomplete and non-proof read rules. The circle of GW continues

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post #17 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave T Hobbit View Post
I was not using addition. I was responding to Magpie, who used +.

Context fail T/S.
Hasnat started it !
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post #18 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-13, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magpie_Oz View Post
Hasnat started it !
Ah, I see that I have caused some havoc. I, however, did not imply a mathematical logic although I understand why some may have perceived it to be so.

Besides, High Elves' Speed of Asuryan rule means they have ASF and ignore ASL from great weapons so have ASF overall without the ASL from GWs whatsoever. So, AoF's ASL cancels with the ASF so give strike at initiative order.
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