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post #221 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 01:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Shandathe View Post
There will be both an AOS-like system (presumably for 'at a glance and quick' games) and an actual proper points cost which I suspect will be the only one anyone ever cares about.
There's three ways to play, as outlined in this article from April. From what I understand it's very much like AoS.

Unfortunately Canada got rid of the penny and now my two cents rounds down to zero, so...take it for what you will.

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post #222 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 06:58 AM
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... dammit, I could have sworn I saw the info in my previous post somewhere official... yet I'm trying to add the [citation needed] and my Google Fu is failing me.

Edit: I THINK it was among the Adepticon stuff, I've at least found it mentioned on Blood of Kittens which unfortunately isn't exactly an official source...

Edit 2: Relevant bit

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Q: Will points be on launch?

A: Different ways to point your army. Two different sets of points. Powerlevel: focused on narrative play. Not include upgrades. Gives you a model but more focused on getting you gaming in the story. Matched play: Full granular modes with upgrades and points for upgrades {so standard 40K}.
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post #223 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 08:04 AM
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Really liking the new twin-linked and combi-weapon rules! My Baal Predators are quite pleased.
My templars land raider crusaders are also looking forward to the TL rules affecting the bolter sponsons!

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post #224 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 01:49 PM
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An article was published too early and then removed...
here we go

In Warhammer 40,000, a unit’s rules can be found on its datasheet.
Currently, a lot of these rules will reference universal special rules, and you might need to do some digging to find a specific rule in the main rulebook, or just be really good at memorising a lot of rules.
Not for the new Warhammer 40,000 – universal special rules are out, and all the rules for a unit will appear on its datasheet – no more lugging a demi-library of books to every game night to ensure you have all the rules you need. Even the rules for weapons will be on there for the most common weapons the unit is likely to be equipped with. The best way to show you is with an example. We’ll be using the Rubric Marines Datasheet, as requested by Marco Tonino on our Warhammer 40,000 Facebook page.
Ok, lots going on in there, so let’s look at a few elements.
At the very top right, we have the Troop icon, which represents the unit’s battlefield role. There are actually two ways to use Rubric Marines, either as an Elite choice in a Chaos Space Marines force (maybe belonging to a sorcerer pledged to the Black Legion or a renegade warlord), or if your detachment is pure Thousand Sons, they can be Troops, much like today.
Next to that we have Power Level, which we’ll look at in detail tomorrow, but for the moment, suffice to say that it is a quick and easy mechanism for balancing in less competitive narrative or open play games.
Then we have the unit profile. You can see the Rubric Marine is, perhaps unsurprisingly, quite similar to a Tactical Marine we’ve seen already. These guys are a little slower than their non-dust brothers, whereas the Sorcerer leading the unit is faster and a more deadly close combat fighter with his extra attack.
Wargear options are listed next, along with stats for their weapons. Most units have all their weapons on their datasheet, though some with a lot of options (Space Marine Tactical Squads, for example) will list only the most common.
Next we have Abilities. Universal special rules are out, so any time a unit acts differently to what its stats might indicate, the rules for how will be in here. The bulk of these rules will be written in full, but there might occasionally be an army-wide, or very common rule for a given faction that isn’t, though these will always be in that same publication with page references, to make finding it easy.
After the special abilities and psychic powers are the keywords. There are two types of these.
The first, faction keywords, are what you use when selecting your detachments for a Battle-forged army, and often trigger in-game effects regarding what units gain benefits from certain Characters or can travel in specific Transports.
Other keywords are not involved in selecting an army, and usually have more general battlefield effects – for example, perhaps only Infantry can gain the full benefit of certain types of cover.
So, there are Datasheets and some juicy new Thousand Sons rules to speculate about.
We’ll be back tomorrow to look at points and power levels




EDIT: the article is now up on their website

this answers my doubts about point system. We will have a free, "friendly" game, point value and a premium point value in subsequent publications (aka codex), so codex is still a thing, altough under another skin...just like AoS.
It is to be noted that now even the "automaton" marines of tzeentch will suffer morale (unless special shit is involved). This i do not like.

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Last edited by neferhet; 05-11-17 at 02:03 PM.
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post #225 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shandathe View Post
... dammit, I could have sworn I saw the info in my previous post somewhere official... yet I'm trying to add the [citation needed] and my Google Fu is failing me.

Edit: I THINK it was among the Adepticon stuff, I've at least found it mentioned on Blood of Kittens which unfortunately isn't exactly an official source...

Edit 2: Relevant bit
Can confirm, the interview with GW peeps that happened shortly after announcement stated that there is an 'incremental points system' for Matched play. I didn't get to see it all but I saw that part at least.

Unfortunately Canada got rid of the penny and now my two cents rounds down to zero, so...take it for what you will.

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post #226 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 05:42 PM
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So, in general I like the new datasheets. Everything, or nearly so, is right there. Very nice.
So I guess the Power Rating is our new general point system, (Insert DBZ "over 9000" joke here), but doesn't take into account weapon selection. Which I'm fine with as it seems simpler for friendly games, which is how I usually play, but I guess we shall see a more robust point system for competitive play.
Which all of that is fine and in general I don't have issues with.

Now issues. First off it looks like psykers may have set powers, (or this is just for low grade psykers like the Aspiring Sorcerer here.) Ahriman and Magnus, and other powerful psykers, better have the option for selecting powers. If they are deadset on set powers per character than they had better be good options. Of which I mean they need to cover more than another form of dakka dakka. They should cover a range of damage, defense, and utility. Ideally with a couple of viable utility options that change things up for a turn forcing the opponent to rethink their strategy.
Other complaint, @neferhet I agree Thousand Sons' dust golems should not be affected by morale. I can, with some effort, conceive of a reason to apply it to them. When a Thousand Sons unit fails a Morale the Sorcerer loses control of those Rubric Marines which fall dormant. This reasoning makes a degree of sense but the Sorcerer should have a way to recover the dormant golems. I would also expect Necrons to have some mechanics like that.

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post #227 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Roganzar View Post
So, in general I like the new datasheets. Everything, or nearly so, is right there. Very nice.
So I guess the Power Rating is our new general point system, (Insert DBZ "over 9000" joke here), but doesn't take into account weapon selection. Which I'm fine with as it seems simpler for friendly games, which is how I usually play, but I guess we shall see a more robust point system for competitive play.
Which all of that is fine and in general I don't have issues with.

Now issues. First off it looks like psykers may have set powers, (or this is just for low grade psykers like the Aspiring Sorcerer here.) Ahriman and Magnus, and other powerful psykers, better have the option for selecting powers. If they are deadset on set powers per character than they had better be good options. Of which I mean they need to cover more than another form of dakka dakka. They should cover a range of damage, defense, and utility. Ideally with a couple of viable utility options that change things up for a turn forcing the opponent to rethink their strategy.
Other complaint, @neferhet I agree Thousand Sons' dust golems should not be affected by morale. I can, with some effort, conceive of a reason to apply it to them. When a Thousand Sons unit fails a Morale the Sorcerer loses control of those Rubric Marines which fall dormant. This reasoning makes a degree of sense but the Sorcerer should have a way to recover the dormant golems. I would also expect Necrons to have some mechanics like that.
Rog, i'm having an hard time justifying the new morale rule. Its like everyone suddenly get demonic instability. Its gross (to me). I say it now: it will be the true turd of the new edition. I'll houserule the hell out of it. I will never be fine with a rule like that.

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Originally Posted by Lux View Post
The calls of Slaneesh stir so deeply within me, as if I was birthed from the very essence of it. For my ambition to infinitely ascend above all is never ending, like fire within it burns me to ever cindering ash. Lord of light and ascension is who I am, realities burn to ash at my very passing. My luminescence is unparalleled for I am luminosity itself, all light is but a shadow of my silhouette
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post #228 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by neferhet View Post
Rog, i'm having an hard time justifying the new morale rule. Its like everyone suddenly get demonic instability. Its gross (to me). I say it now: it will be the true turd of the new edition. I'll houserule the hell out of it. I will never be fine with a rule like that.
Not a fan of it either. However, since its there I decided to thought experiment it with the justification i posted.
The whole lose a number of units the difference of what you rolled is kind of garbage. I'll see what the proper rules for it look like before tinkering with it.
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post #229 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 08:19 PM
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Anyone notice that a power sword is now essentially ap 2 (-3 rend) while a power axe is ap3 (-2 rend)?
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post #230 of 646 (permalink) Old 05-11-17, 09:05 PM
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Anyone notice that a power sword is now essentially ap 2 (-3 rend) while a power axe is ap3 (-2 rend)?
Those are force weapons rather than power weapons. That might make a difference.
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