The Chapterhouse row rumbles on... - Page 2 - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
Wargaming News and 40k Rumors Discuss and share wargaming news, new releases, warhammer and 40k rumors here.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #11 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-17-14, 09:15 PM
nice boy, daft though !
 
bitsandkits's Avatar
bitsandkits's Flag is: United Kingdom
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 10,212
Reputation: 58
Default

GW were always gonna play hard ball, they really have no choice but to use everything they can to keep chapterhouse under their heal .



Never pay again for live sex! | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! | Chat for free!

HUGE BITZ RESTOCK NOW ON
bitsandkits is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-17-14, 09:39 PM
Feed
 
Serpion5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Space
Posts: 10,976
Reputation: 51
Default

I wonder what this means for all the other third party minis we've seen lately, if GW will go after these companies next?

We should get our orders done with them while GW is still beating CH down.


Nonsense is our Salvation

Serpion5 is offline  
post #13 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-17-14, 09:59 PM
nice boy, daft though !
 
bitsandkits's Avatar
bitsandkits's Flag is: United Kingdom
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 10,212
Reputation: 58
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serpion5 View Post
I wonder what this means for all the other third party minis we've seen lately, if GW will go after these companies next?

We should get our orders done with them while GW is still beating CH down.
I don't think it will change anything, the other indies have for the most part played ball and kept away from blatantly ripping of GW and more importantly kept away from using copyright and trade marks , Scibor has been doing compatible bitz longer than chapterhouse and has avoided a trip to court, now they are a thriving respected brand , same for Kromlek etc



Never pay again for live sex! | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! | Chat for free!

HUGE BITZ RESTOCK NOW ON
bitsandkits is offline  
 
post #14 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-18-14, 04:30 AM
Thordis
 
Haskanael's Avatar
Haskanael's Flag is: Netherlands
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 2,438
Reputation: 20
Default

I'm not entirely surprised here...
Haskanael is offline  
post #15 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-18-14, 02:25 PM
Critique for da CriticGod
 
Kreuger's Avatar
Kreuger's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 3,350
Reputation: 43
Default

First and foremost I think is bad for the consumer if this has a chilling effect on the 3rd party market.

As far as Chapterhouse goes it's not terribly surprising. It's been a while since I heard anything about their legal battle. The last news I recall from maybe a year or more ago was much more in favor of chapterhouse.

I think Chapterhouse stepped over the line and I don't really like their products, but I like that they were part of the wave of producers opening up the market for 3rd party pieces.

And GW have borrowed so much of their IP from other sources (books, movies, etc.) that I'm always amazed at the vigor with which they defend their stolen goods.

Chaos Army Showcase with photos (Updated 2013/12/02)
"To endure one's self is perhaps the hardest task in the universe." Frank Herbert, 'Dune Messiah'
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dethklokk
"CHEESE!" is the battlecry of the ill-prepared.

Originally Posted by Deathscythe4722
Could someone please call the police on this guy? I can hear the English Language screaming in pain. This has to be illegal somewhere.
Kreuger is offline  
post #16 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-18-14, 02:47 PM
Senior Member
 
Einherjar667's Avatar
Einherjar667's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Western Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 1,459
Reputation: 10
Default The Chapterhouse row rumbles on...

It all depends on if, in the eyes of the court, if an IP or copyright was infringed upon. What CH did was brazen and deserves the hammer. As an artist, and one who works closely in the IP and copyright field, I have ABSOLUTELY ZERO sympathy for Chapterhouse. Especially when you're going up againsr a company like GW that is known to be territorial and aggressive about depending things they own the copyright for(which is how they are able to mount these legal battles, by owning the copyright).
Einherjar667 is offline  
post #17 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-18-14, 03:17 PM
Critique for da CriticGod
 
Kreuger's Avatar
Kreuger's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 3,350
Reputation: 43
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Einherjar667 View Post
It all depends on if, in the eyes of the court, if an IP or copyright was infringed upon. What CH did was brazen and deserves the hammer. As an artist, and one who works closely in the IP and copyright field, I have ABSOLUTELY ZERO sympathy for Chapterhouse.
I would agree Chapterhouse was foolhardy.

However I find this concerning. The interesting thing about US IP law as I understand it is that nothing is certain until decided by a court. And the concept that people (in general, not chapterhouse in particular) shouldn't make 3rd party pieces because GW might get ornery is garbage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Einherjar667 View Post
Especially when you're going up against a company like GW that is known to be territorial and aggressive about depending things they own the copyright for(which is how they are able to mount these legal battles, by owning the copyright).
My further understanding was that GW miscalculated the differences between USA and UK IP law and what is required to demonstrate ownership and therefore infringement beyond that. Not that I agree with chapterhouse, but I recall the case wasn't open and shut, and was much more nuanced.

Having an aggressive legal department doesn't make a company right, but it does give them an advantage in attrition.

Between the 2 I like/support GW more than Chapterhouse, but between GW and independents and their ability to produce their own add-ons/similar units, I support the independents.

Chaos Army Showcase with photos (Updated 2013/12/02)
"To endure one's self is perhaps the hardest task in the universe." Frank Herbert, 'Dune Messiah'
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dethklokk
"CHEESE!" is the battlecry of the ill-prepared.

Originally Posted by Deathscythe4722
Could someone please call the police on this guy? I can hear the English Language screaming in pain. This has to be illegal somewhere.
Kreuger is offline  
post #18 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-18-14, 03:26 PM
Senior Member
 
Einherjar667's Avatar
Einherjar667's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Western Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 1,459
Reputation: 10
Default The Chapterhouse row rumbles on...

I didn't intend to say that the bigger legal prowess is right, I meant, if you flash in the face of a company that is as aggressive as GW, don't be shocked when you get a C&D letter (which Chapterhouse surely got, and likely ignored as this issue made it to court).

There is no doubt that the translation between US and UK copyright laws could get a bit lost, but that end of the legal spectrum I am pretty fuzzy on. Here in the US, you have to apply for Copyrights, and once you get it then it's yours (pending renewall). This will give you the upper hand when it gets to court, but in the end, if challenged or disputed in any way, a court will have to decide issues like that, but the US Copyright office is the one to hand out the initial copyright.

Indie model makers shouldn't fear as long as they tend to their own ideas and not step on other companies toes(not just GW).
Einherjar667 is offline  
post #19 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-18-14, 04:13 PM
Critique for da CriticGod
 
Kreuger's Avatar
Kreuger's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 3,350
Reputation: 43
Default

I think that's fair.

Chaos Army Showcase with photos (Updated 2013/12/02)
"To endure one's self is perhaps the hardest task in the universe." Frank Herbert, 'Dune Messiah'
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dethklokk
"CHEESE!" is the battlecry of the ill-prepared.

Originally Posted by Deathscythe4722
Could someone please call the police on this guy? I can hear the English Language screaming in pain. This has to be illegal somewhere.
Kreuger is offline  
post #20 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-18-14, 06:23 PM
Jeep's and Harley's
 
OIIIIIIO's Avatar
OIIIIIIO's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sparta
Posts: 1,997
Reputation: 10
Default

Funny thing about the US Copyright thing ... GW did apply for some copyrights and were denied for things like Roman Numerals and other things. The courts sanctioned GW Counsel because they tried to hide this during discovery and CH ended up finding out about it. The vast majority of the claims GW brought were denied (something like 70% IIRC) and the rest have been taken to appeals.

Do I think that what CH has done was illegal? Not sure. I did read court transcripts that said that GW tried to pull a bunch of shiesty shit and got caught. My real problem with this harkens back to the old fight between K&N air filters and the big three of Detroit. They tried to stop K&N from offering an aftermarket filter that would fit your car. They wanted to force the consumer to purchase air filters from them. The big three went as far as to deny warranties if people were using a K&N air filter.

After a lengthy court battle the verdict that came down was one that came to this: If the big three wanted to void warranties because people were using aftermarket air filters, then the big three had to provide air filters to their customers, free of charge, to the customers for the life of the warranty.

This was a boon for the customers as it allowed an aftermarket product that would not void warranties. In this case it allows aftermarket parts for the miniature market, which is a fairly small market anyways, as GW has had the problem of releasing rules but not models for their games.

On a side note ... I find it funny that they refuse to call their miniatures toys in the UK because if they do then they are not covered under the IP laws.
OIIIIIIO is offline  
Reply

  Lower Navigation
Go Back   Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums > Wargaming News, New Releases and Information > Wargaming News and 40k Rumors

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome